NO Addons please. There is another solution!

Not only that, but the guy was claiming that Add-ons ruined his hybrid ability in WoW as a ret Pally... clearly it wasn't the huge changes made to the class after TBC which basically made it impossible to hybrid (as the game stands now,) it was the add-ons that did it. And the fact that the guy wasn't able to cope with people telling him that he's playing incorrectly, while backing up their claims with hard numbers, the add-ons did that too.

The fellow wanted to heal and DPS and add-ons ruined it for him.

Edit: to be clear it was NOT the glaring changes made to Pally itemization or talent trees that made it impossible for this gentleman to hybrid, it was add-ons.

Yup, that's how I read it, because based on his description HE was still able to do what he designed his character to. The GROUPS would not let him do it because he wasn't following formulas which were created through the use of these add-ons. They weren't giving him hard numbers relevant to his build, they were giving him numbers based on how they felt his build should be designed, which had nothing to do with his build.

So yes, none of those things were the reason. It was the micromanagement of the game that became the ingrained basis of the gaming culture as a result of rampant use of add-ons that ruined it for him.

It's good to see you also understood what he was saying, as you obviously were making a straight commentary and not using sarcasm to not only put down his view of events but also make yourself somehow look superior.

Absolutely this.

Nah, I'd need an add-on for that.

Stats for Ret pally had changed over time, and that person wanted to continue the same old rhythm without adapting. When someone pointed out the flaw, it's the add-ons fault. "O M G this person just told me that this add-on is showing that I'm doing less DPS than the tank, what an evil add-on." *heals as ret pally*

I guess my point here is: This is a terrible argument against the use of add-ons.

lol, no you don't.

We did fine without add-ons before now, and can do fine without them in the future, people have just become dependant on them, well time to have your withdrawls and relearn how to play.

Well to be clear, data is required, not the add-ons.

Otherwise, how do you know if you're doing more DPS in Lightning or Madness spec? Guess?

Taking steps backward > taking steps forward?

I agree to disagree.

Bring on the add-ons let's see what people can create for this game.

I have no problems with DPS meters to gauge things after the fact and help improve min/max, but anything that simplifies gameplay would suck.

I am enjoying the challenge of the encounters (although they are not that hard to be honest). We have had no issues with our tank holding agro, I have no issues with healing without mouse over (even in raids). I would not be against a mouse over healing though, don't get me wrong.

The main thing I am against are the add-ons that simplify encounters to the point of not having to know your own limits. Threat meters, mods that tell you when boss skills are coming etc., just seem to make the experience more button mashing than actually an engaging fight where you need to pay attention and god forbid know your class. I would prefer those type of mods be kept out.

I would like a more customizable UI for sure though.

**edit** I am also evidently against correct spelling **edit**

There are some valid arguments for why blanket support of all addons can be detrimental to the game. Most commonly cited was gearscore, which was used in WoW to judge the worth of a player, leading to understandable bitterness.

My appeal is directed solely at DPS meters. Clearly, I play DPS.

A DPS meter is an objective measure of a DPS class's value to a group. More important than it's use in a group is its use by the individual player to evaluate the end result of changes in ability-rotation and gear setup. Theorycrafting is great up to a point, but in the end, data is necessary to validate theory.

If Bioware agrees that DPS meters could cause undue elitism, then create a system wherein only the individual player can see him/her own DPS/HPS.

To reference WoW, the addition of practice dummies was a huge step in the right direction to supplement DPS meters. It allowed casual players to improve their ability usage and hardcore players to optimize their gear setup. All in a completely private setting.

Understood that this game isn't WoW, however, I challenge someone to explain to me why any given DPS player would be better off not knowing their damage output is.

I'm all for Add-Ons, if you don't want them, then don't use them. It's mostly a vocal minority who doesn't like using Add-Ons.

Like, a lot of people say they don't like Recount, but even if they made a Recount-type Add-On, they'll still use it. I myself would also like a Recount Add-On as it'll help me see what I'm doing wrong in certain encounters that I'm having trouble with. Am I running out of Force to fast? Overhealing way too much? Etc.

I know, a lot of people also want Customizable UI's. I myself don't mind the UI, but even in General Chat you see people who dislike the UI all the time. So, these will show up, or Bioware will add an Option to allow you to customize your UI.

Boss Mods, now, I myself used these in WoW since I came from a competitive Raiding Guild, but WoW has evolved to the point where the game itself will tell you the stuff toO avoid, and when it will happen with the Dungeon Journal and Raid Shoutouts. So, again, the game could go either way.

Along with other Add-Ons similar to Atlasloot (which is great for planning), or other fun style Add-Ons.

So, I welcome Add-Ons if they come, and if you don't like them, simply don't use them.

Then don't use them.

Seriously, I'm going to call the anti add-on crowd "badd-ons" for the simple fact the majority of them are absurdly terrible at gamin and are deathly afraid of someone exposing their suckage. Sorry, I like to know when I'm carrying dead weight. Addons please.