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Scoundrel Top 3 Answers

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oaceen's Avatar


oaceen
09.11.2013 , 04:00 PM | #141
Quote: Originally Posted by Laforet View Post
Because set bonuses are the only reason Scrapper isnt wanted in RWZs. All the other questions just reflect the community perception problem while playing the game.
just so it's clear, i only asked about the set bonuses because i felt that the question wasn't actually answered.
i attributed it to how i worded the question. it seemed that that using the gunslinger set bonus was a bigger point than i really intended, and commenting on the PvP set bonuses and clarifying the 4-set bonuses got a little lost in that.

so i sent EricMusco a PM with a re-worded question in hopes that it could be answered more directly, not necessarily to say 'we don't like this answer, try again'
oaceen assault specialist / oac scrapper / oacao kinetic combatant / oacianado tactician
[Guide] The Dirty Rotten Scoundrel's PvE DPS Compendium

Yestreen's Avatar


Yestreen
09.11.2013 , 04:07 PM | #142
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
One of the other things I have seen discussed a bit in this thread and other Class Rep Top 3's is our dialog about class changes. One thing that can be a bit tricky is our exchange tends to be - players state their stance in a question, we state our position in an answer, players discuss. In some cases we will have a situation where the community disagrees with the answers provided by the dev team, and that's ok!

In fact, what I wanted to let you know is how the dialog sort of works after you have your top 3. I know sometimes it can seem like a bit of a mic drop, but the fact is I am combing through these threads and passing back to the Combat team your disagreements. Especially when that disagreement comes in a way that is constructive and offers points on how these things can be addressed. Let me give you some examples from this very thread:
  • While Shoot First/Hidden Strike does better damage than most Scoundrel/Operative attacks, it could probably do more.
  • The Scrapper/Concealment skill tree probably needs more survivability to make them less of a “Lone Wolf.”
  • Set bonuses need to be better (as indicated in my post above this is something we are aware of and are working on across the board).

Keep posting your feedback. Try to be as concise and constructive as possible. I am always taking what is said in these threads back to the team. In fact the examples above are direct pieces of feedback that the Combat team called out as being constructive things they have seen from this thread. Keep it coming and I will keep passing it on!

-eric
In addition

-scrapper/concealment needs better/more tools to help it fulfill the role as a 'shady, slippery character
-scrapper/concealment and dirty fighting/lethality need a tool that makes them desirable over other melee classes
-scrapper/concealment needs a boost to sustained, our of stealth damage
-dirty fighting/lethality survivability is probably needs more survivability to make it less of a 'lone wolf'
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Cordorian's Avatar


Cordorian
09.11.2013 , 04:13 PM | #143
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
One of the other things I have seen discussed a bit in this thread and other Class Rep Top 3's is our dialog about class changes. One thing that can be a bit tricky is our exchange tends to be - players state their stance in a question, we state our position in an answer, players discuss. In some cases we will have a situation where the community disagrees with the answers provided by the dev team, and that's ok!

In fact, what I wanted to let you know is how the dialog sort of works after you have your top 3. I know sometimes it can seem like a bit of a mic drop, but the fact is I am combing through these threads and passing back to the Combat team your disagreements. Especially when that disagreement comes in a way that is constructive and offers points on how these things can be addressed. Let me give you some examples from this very thread:
  • While Shoot First/Hidden Strike does better damage than most Scoundrel/Operative attacks, it could probably do more.
  • The Scrapper/Concealment skill tree probably needs more survivability to make them less of a “Lone Wolf.”
  • Set bonuses need to be better (as indicated in my post above this is something we are aware of and are working on across the board).

Keep posting your feedback. Try to be as concise and constructive as possible. I am always taking what is said in these threads back to the team. In fact the examples above are direct pieces of feedback that the Combat team called out as being constructive things they have seen from this thread. Keep it coming and I will keep passing it on!

-eric
thanks eric, that is what we want to know. we want to be taken seriously.
this class is probably the best healing class in game currently. but the two dps trees suffer from surviability espcially in pvp... thats the main point... we dont need to outdamage mara/sents but we want be viable in arenas as dps. stealth wont be such big factor there...

Laforet's Avatar


Laforet
09.11.2013 , 04:19 PM | #144
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
One of the other things I have seen discussed a bit in this thread and other Class Rep Top 3's is our dialog about class changes. One thing that can be a bit tricky is our exchange tends to be - players state their stance in a question, we state our position in an answer, players discuss. In some cases we will have a situation where the community disagrees with the answers provided by the dev team, and that's ok!

In fact, what I wanted to let you know is how the dialog sort of works after you have your top 3. I know sometimes it can seem like a bit of a mic drop, but the fact is I am combing through these threads and passing back to the Combat team your disagreements. Especially when that disagreement comes in a way that is constructive and offers points on how these things can be addressed. Let me give you some examples from this very thread:
  • While Shoot First/Hidden Strike does better damage than most Scoundrel/Operative attacks, it could probably do more.
  • The Scrapper/Concealment skill tree probably needs more survivability to make them less of a “Lone Wolf.”
  • Set bonuses need to be better (as indicated in my post above this is something we are aware of and are working on across the board).

Keep posting your feedback. Try to be as concise and constructive as possible. I am always taking what is said in these threads back to the team. In fact the examples above are direct pieces of feedback that the Combat team called out as being constructive things they have seen from this thread. Keep it coming and I will keep passing it on!

-eric
You guys need to learn you cant just drop stuff like "we dont expect you to use vanish as a reopener / stealth is a defensive cd / h2f / perception problem" and expect to get away with it.

Its not only false (STEALTH IS NOT A DEFENSIVE COOLDOWN, SELF HEALS DO NOT EQUAL INSTANT STRAIGHTFOWARD SURVIVABILITY, CAN YOU FREAKING "INTERRUPT" SABER WARD?) but also highly offensive towards the people who are in the field trying to make the said specs work as you guys intend to.

We are not rivals of the combat team, for petes sakes we are trying to play your game, its not our fault if its unplayable if we dont run certain classes *ahem marauder / sniper / jugg / op healer* ahem.
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DrKlep's Avatar


DrKlep
09.11.2013 , 04:26 PM | #145
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
I know sometimes it can seem like a bit of a mic drop, but the fact is I am combing through these threads and passing back to the Combat team your disagreements. Especially when that disagreement comes in a way that is constructive and offers points on how these things can be addressed.
Thank you for coming back in here. Please try to remember in the future that we can't know this is happening unless you come in and make a post like this.

Quote:
  • While Shoot First/Hidden Strike does better damage than most Scoundrel/Operative attacks, it could probably do more.
  • The Scrapper/Concealment skill tree probably needs more survivability to make them less of a “Lone Wolf.”
  • Set bonuses need to be better (as indicated in my post above this is something we are aware of and are working on across the board).
This is a good start, but I want to reemphasize that it's not just that Shoot First/Hidden Strike doesn't do enough damage. Scrapper DPS needs an across-the-board boost. We just can't compete as is.

Racter's Avatar


Racter
09.11.2013 , 04:33 PM | #146
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
One of the other things I have seen discussed a bit in this thread and other Class Rep Top 3's is our dialog about class changes. One thing that can be a bit tricky is our exchange tends to be - players state their stance in a question, we state our position in an answer, players discuss. In some cases we will have a situation where the community disagrees with the answers provided by the dev team, and that's ok!

In fact, what I wanted to let you know is how the dialog sort of works after you have your top 3. I know sometimes it can seem like a bit of a mic drop, but the fact is I am combing through these threads and passing back to the Combat team your disagreements. Especially when that disagreement comes in a way that is constructive and offers points on how these things can be addressed. Let me give you some examples from this very thread:
  • While Shoot First/Hidden Strike does better damage than most Scoundrel/Operative attacks, it could probably do more.
  • The Scrapper/Concealment skill tree probably needs more survivability to make them less of a “Lone Wolf.”
  • Set bonuses need to be better (as indicated in my post above this is something we are aware of and are working on across the board).

Keep posting your feedback. Try to be as concise and constructive as possible. I am always taking what is said in these threads back to the team. In fact the examples above are direct pieces of feedback that the Combat team called out as being constructive things they have seen from this thread. Keep it coming and I will keep passing it on!

-eric

Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
Question 1. Scrapper (PVE / PVP):

Many a stealth class or specialization has struggled with the feeling of being a “Lone Wolf” in PvP in many different games over the past decade (and maybe even longer). We do not believe this has ever necessarily been each and every designer’s intention for stealth classes, but rather, a byproduct of the stealth ability itself – often times, a stealther is able to go places where his allies can only dream of going. While designers may be able to take some steps here and there to give players some tools which reduce that “Lone Wolf” feeling (see the answer to Question 2 for more on this), the greatest power for eliminating this feeling actually lies with the stealther and the stealther’s allies. There may be more we can do to alleviate these concerns, so please feel free to point us at specific skills or abilities that you feel take away from your ability to play as part of a team. We will not be removing stealth itself, but we are open to making stealthers as “team friendly” as possible (within reason, of course).



This is just blatantly false. The reason scrapper feels like a lone wolf is very obvious to anyone who has actually played the class. Any team with competent DPS can remove you from a fight with damage alone, no cc required on the tank or the healer, THROUGH GUARD WHILE GETTING HEALED, in 5s or less. in regular warzones every day I am literally killed by people before getting a third attack off. We are a lone wolf entirely because this class has to be very picky about who, when, and where we attack. The sole cause of this? It's not our mediocre burst damage, or because we're melee, and it has nothing to do with stealth at all. It's because our survivability is *********** awful. Do you remember people complaining about how squishy marauders were in beta? Then you guys gave them cheat death (actually, two cheat deaths, because back then force camo had 100% DR too if I remember correctly) and cloak of pain, so they wouldn't just pop immediately. Assassin, pre 1.6? 1.7? had exactly this same problem, and you solved it correctly, giving them 30% AOE DR and an on demand 25% DR, as well as a stacking DR talent, and DR upon exiting stealth. You also gave them increased energy regen during stealth and while their 25% on demand was active on top of already having superior energy mechanics (no brackets, set regen rate across the board). We need EXACTLY THESE THINGS. We have dodge, lasts 1/3 as long (with our set bonus) as deflection but has half the cool down and 100% avoidance instead of just increased avoidance. Fair trade, balanced. We have shield probe, absorbs pretty close to the same amount overcharge saber heals for (again, with the set bonus), shorter cool down, not quite as good, and no offensive benefit to using it. Fair trade, balanced. They have force shroud, we have nothing to compare to this. -1. They have 30% AOE DR, we do not, -1. They have 25% dr in stealth and an on demand 25% DR out of stealth, we do not, -2. We are clearly at a significant survivability deficit to our fellow stealth burst spec. They can hang in the main fight, we cannot. Moving on.

Quote:
Shoot First/Hidden Strike does great damage because it requires you to be stealthed behind your target. If it did not require stealth, it would do considerably less damage. Our metrics assume that Shoot First/Hidden Strike is only used once per encounter, so if you are using Disappearing Act/Cloaking Screen to perform additional Shoot First/Hidden Strike attacks in a single encounter, then you are probably performing above our expectations. We understand the difficulties in using a positional attack from stealth, and we do not wish to require players to use an escape mechanic to produce competitive, sustained damage. That said, we have to be careful to keep the burst damage at a reasonable level when the mechanic is used. We might consider giving Scrapper/Concealment Scoundrels/Operatives a way to use Shoot First/Hidden Strike outside of stealth, since they already have many skills that improve it, but such a drastic change to game play would be more likely to come along in an expansion pack than a balance update.

At launch maybe, now this is certainly no longer true. If SF/HS does not crit, it hits for only slightly more than many cc's in this game. I will continue my comparison to the only other stealth burst spec in the game, deception assassins. Spike has a 30s cd, requires stealth and does 1-1.5k dmg on non crits and 1.5-2.5k dmg on crits. It also knocks the target down for 1.5s. It also procs duplicity, which grants a free maul that does increased damage. In min/maxed partisan on my Assassin, the maul typically hits for 6-9k. On my operative in min/maxed conqueror, SF/HS hits normally for 2.5k-3.5k, and crits between 6-7.5k. Fair? Nope. Balanced? Nope. Out of control burst? Absolutely not. Assuming a maximum burst opener, with a perfect string of crits on a sorc or sage in recruit gear, I can drop a 7.5K SF/HS, 6K EP/SC, 7K BB/BS, while FR/AB ticks for 1k/s on top of that, amounting to a grand total of 23.5k damage in 3 globals. Seems pretty good right? Now consider a deception sin. 2K Spike, 10k Maul, 9K Discharge. 21k damage in three globals. Slightly worse (and for all I know, this may only be a gear difference, full 65s vs full 63s), but both have now decimated poor sorcy sorc. Scrapper/Concealment pulls ahead, but wait! Sins can do this same burst over again almost immediately without vanishing, while taking less damage, with absolutely no stealth requirement involved, on people OTHER than poor Mr. Sorcy Sorc in rags. I could see this statement being accurate if SF/HS was the one critting for 8k+ all the time, but seeing as it is not not only not doing that, but the other stealth burst class actually is, and does not have a stealth requirement or cool down on their closest equivalent, this is totally laughable. Assuming we aren't using our vanish offensively is also laughable, considering none of our abilities have a significant crit boost, and many times we are forced to vanish and reopen on random targets simply to actually damage them and not tickle.

The opener listed above was assuming a perfect string of crits from the Scoundrel/Operative, which is incredibly rare. Now let's play the same scenario back, assuming a no crit scenario (which is far, FAR more common). 3k SF/HS, 4K EP/SC, 3K BB/BS, in addition to 500/s from FR/AB. We have now blown all of our burst upon Mr. Sorcy Sorc, and have done a measly 10.5k. Our assassin friend comes by, hits a 1k Spike, 8k maul, 9k discharge. 18k damage in three globals. Maul train 1, Scrapper 0. However, it is worth pointing out that no one complains about deception's burst. So, in summary, what the actual **** were you thinking when you wrote this, and how could this be even remotely overpowered, considering you have another spec doing exactly what scrapper/concealment is designed to do (and would very obviously like to return to doing), and no one is throwing a tantrum over it?


Quote:
Rotationally speaking, we could have Turn the Tables/Culling return your energy over time rather than immediately, though we are not sure all Scoundrels/Operatives would be happy with that change (especially when you are not anywhere close to full energy). That would resolve the issue with it triggering at or near full energy, but is it something that Scoundrels/Operatives would actually want? Quick Shot/Overload Shot is admittedly a poor filler ability. A scoring check reveals that, for its energy cost, it should deal more damage than it does, and we can fix that in a patch by properly rebalancing the ability. Hopefully, rebalancing Quick Shot/Overload Shot will make it into the competent filler attack that it was meant to be.

The current mechanic of returning 10 energy every time Flying Fists/Collateral Strike damages a target is acceptable and needs to remain untouched. Quick shot is literally only useful for damaging a Sin who has activated force shroud, and you are better off using flurry of bolts/rifle shot during this time to regen energy. Seeing as it costs nearly 1/5th of our energy bar and hits for somewhere in the neighborhood of 2k ( I am admittedly unsure of this, as this ability is so poor that I very, very rarely use it) you could delete it entirely and no one would complain. It would need to do double the damage it currently does for half the cost to even be worth considering over flurry of bolts/rifle shot IMO.

Quote:
Question 2. Survivability (PVP):
Scoundrels/Operatives are meant to be shady, slippery characters that survive by escaping rather than sticking around to face the brunt of a foe’s attack. For Scoundrels/Operatives, both their ability to heal and their ability to stealth count toward their ability to survive. We do not give every single class an area-of-effect damage reduction skill because we want there to be differences and play-style variances among the classes. That is also why not every class can wear heavy armor, enter stealth mode, or heal. That is not to say that Scoundrels/Operatives will never gain access to such a skill, but they also should not expect a skill like that any time soon.

Of all answers so far, this is by a large margin the single most idiotic thing I have read. Our ability to heal, especially as scrapper, is totally laughable. Our only usable heal in combat is Underworld Medicine, which costs a 1/4 of our energy bar (guaranteed to put us in a bad spot energy wise, even if we don't have to scamper 1-3 times to get range to avoid getting interrupted/ LOS, thus being totally 100% out of energy after a single heal. This single heal (which is a 2.5 second cast, of course) heals normally in the 3k range, and crits for around 6k accounting for the trauma (general pvp heal debuff, not the marauder/sniper heal debuff) on a crit. Every single class in this game can hit for that much or more in one GCD. How on Earth could this be a survivability benefit? We generally cannot flash bang a target to throw 2 heals down (playing this spec correctly for DPS requires keeping a poison on the target for TA regrants) and even if we could, and they both crit, that is still only 12k hp once a minute (flash bang's cd). Both Mercenaries and Sorcs can drop instant heals on themselves (though the mechanics are different for the two) for the same amount in the same time frame (mercenary may be able to do it more often, not 100%). Both of these classes also primarily deal damage from 30m, while we are a MELEE class. Which brings me to point #2, how is not wanting to be smashed for 8-24k in a single GCD by a person/people NOT EVEN TARGETING YOU a play style? This is totally ridiculous. I am fine with Rage, honestly I am. The auto snares, the second root, the massive snare from force crush, the AOE pressure it offers, all fine. i disagree with the survivability boosts given to Marauders in the tree (IE lower CD on Undying Rage as well as knocking the health requirement down to a measly 1/4), but only if every melee DPS class can access 30% AOE DR. It should exist entirely to prevent ranged players from stacking on each other and to pressure tank/healer parings, not totally eliminate all other melee dps from competitive PVP. Without this talent, ignoring any other changes to survivability entirely, we will never be accepted in a competitive setting. Period.

Quote:
As for upcoming survivability changes, we are planning to make a change to Disappearing Act/Cloaking Screen (and also to Force Cloak, for any Jedi Shadows or Sith Assassins that may be reading this) so that it no longer decreases all healing received by 100%. It will still decrease all healing done by 100%, so Scoundrel/Operative healers will not be able to continue healing themselves or their allies with their heal-over-time abilities from the hidden safety of stealth mode. But this change will allow Scoundrels/Operatives to be healed by other allies immediately after using Disappearing Act/Cloaking Screen, which should help to address both Scoundrel/Operative survivability in group situations and, to some extent, the “Lone Wolf” issue you mentioned in the first question.

This change will do absolutely nothing to make Scoundrel/Operative healers not clearly the best choice for arena healers, and will do absolutely nothing to boost DPS Scoundrel's survivability in PVP. This will do absolutely nothing to alleviate our survivability issues, and will do absolutely nothing to aid us in achieving success in regs, let alone competitive PVP.

Quote:
We are concerned that Sawbones/Medicine survivability is probably a little bit too good, which means any survivability we give to Scoundrels/Operatives cannot be made available to the Sawbones/Medicine specialization. To address this, we may consider moving some Sawbones/Medicine survivability skills over to the Scrapper/Concealment and Dirty Fighting/Lethality specializations (as part of a skill trade), but we do not currently have any details to share about what these exact changes may be.

Finally a small flicker of hope from this nonsense. The dodge/evasion talent must go, and the damage reduction talent needs to either be moved to tier one or removed entirely. Still wont knock them off the top, but is definitely one step closer.

Quote:
Question 3. Set Bonuses (PVP / PVE):

Like all of the other PvE set bonuses in the game, the intent behind the 4-piece Scoundrel/Operative PvE set bonus is to provide a small boost to sustained damage. It could very well be the case that the sustained damage gained by adding five energy to the Scoundrel’s/Operative’s resource pool is too small. We will look into this further, and we may at some point make a change to this particular set bonus if we find that we are not completely satisfied with its performance.

What further investigation is required? The math has been explained in both class forums many times. The set bonuses are total garbage. Point black fact. This is not even just about the PVE bonuses, the PVP set bonuses are also total crap. If our survivability wasn't complete and total ****, there would be no benefit at all to using set bonus gear as a DPS scoundrel of either spec.

Quote:
It is interesting that so many Smugglers/Imperial Agents have taken such a liking to the 2-piece Gunslinger/Sniper PvP set bonus. Due to the DPS gain, it is understandable why this is the case, but the results of this design are unintentional. We touched a little bit on this in the Gunslinger/Sniper questions, and we can go into a bit more depth since you have specifically asked about it.

Because of how our ability damage is scored, XS Freighter Flyby/Orbital Strike puts out some of the best DPS in the game – assuming all of its damage ticks hit a target – and this is without the set bonus. While we do intend for XS Freighter Flyby/Orbital Strike to be an excellent choice against three or more enemy targets in an area, the single-target effectiveness of the ability is not intended to be so good, with a possible exception for the Saboteur/Engineering Gunslinger/Sniper. But the other five Smuggler/Imperial Agent specializations are not meant to be using the ability against a single target. To address this issue, we plan to make a few changes.

First, we will be lowering the effectiveness of XS Freighter Flyby/Orbital Strike by reducing some combination of its cooldown, activation time, and energy cost. Then we will rescore the damage it does. This will allow it to be used more easily and more often, but it will deal less damage per use. We will also be swapping the 2-piece and 4-piece Gunslinger/Sniper PvP set bonuses, so that the extra tick of XS Freighter Flyby/Orbital Strike damage will be tied to four pieces, and the increased range for Distraction and Quickdraw/Takedown will be tied to two pieces. These changes should combine to bring XS Freighter Flyby/Orbital Strike closer to its intended purpose: being a marvelous multi-target ability and a less than optimal single-target ability.
Yes, nerfing our moderate damage AOE ability that already costs 1/4 of our energy bar, has a ONE MINUTE cool down, and has an ENORMOUS delay while a HUGE target mark sits on the ground is clearly the correct answer to our mediocre DPS (Scrapper) and hilariously bad set bonuses (all specs). Good job.

Eric you basically said our mediocre burst will continue to be mediocre and we will like it.
Our survivability will continue to be retardedly bad and we will like it.
Our set bonuses will continue to be lolwat and we will like it.

Our big hitters hit for far less than literally everyone elses, our survivability is literally the worst in the game, and our set bonuses do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to increase damage IN ANY WAY, SHAPE OR FORM. The fact that the gunslinger set bonus is used instead of ours is a clear indication of this.


Clear and concise enough? Not trying to be rude but ffs we've been saying this for almost 2 years, it's not like these are even recent concerns.

snave's Avatar


snave
09.11.2013 , 04:35 PM | #147
^^ Post above is spot on.

The thing that you and your dev team keep failing to grasp is why the community gets so outraged at your responses. It's not because of a "mic drop" at the end of the poorly worded and ill thought out responses it's because the answers given have no bearing on the reality of the game. You need to understand this, no one here or on any of the class question threads is asking to made overpowered, the questions given to you are the genuine issues with the class.

You have a fondness of responding with "metrics say this and metrics say that" without providing said metrics or even taking into consideration the basis of those metrics. How on earth are you analysing scrapper performance in high end (ie. ranked) PvP when there are literally zero scrapper scoundrels at end game PvP? You're blindly looking at numbers and ignoring the context of them which is analysis 101, people expect better from a AAA MMO and from a global company like EA.

The initial response earlier gave us nothing, maybe we'd get some defensive boosts but shoot first is over performing as to where you thought it was so we should be happy with that. We're slippery, play slippery. People get angry because this advice has no bearing in the game, sometimes I don't even know if you play the same game as the rest of us. Perhaps Bioware has access to some version of the game where scrappers don't get blown up in 5 seconds of focus fire from a lack of defensive abilities whilst the rubbish engine chooses to ignore the last 3 commands I sent to my PC giving me phantom GCD's but I severely doubt that's the case.

Despite what you may want the community to think this is not a hard issue to solve. Auto crit on shoot first with a 50% heal debuff on flechette round would AT LEAST get us into consideration for arena, buffing / reducing the CD on vanish, shield probe and evasion would actually make us viable but I think at this point in time we'd take anything so we can start being included in PvP.

Stop acting like this is amateur hour and we should appreciate that you're "trying".

Cordorian's Avatar


Cordorian
09.11.2013 , 04:36 PM | #148
sorry for spamming the forums today, but when it is about my favourite class i cant hold back.


it alway comes back to the same things, compare to the decption tree from assissins we lack both reliable burst and survivsbility in our middle tree. the 3 healing abilitues we have dont make up for that in pvp.

df or lethslity can dongreat damage but be useful it need more suvivsbility or another way tobcreate ta/uh.
healing needs either a nerf or other healing classes need a buff. yet as it stands currently scoperatives are forced into healing if you want to do top contend

oaceen's Avatar


oaceen
09.11.2013 , 04:38 PM | #149
i know i started another thread on this, but i think since eric is looking directly here (and possibly not there), i figured i would post some here.

as far as the energy return discussion goes, I think that reducing the cost of the next Sucker Punch / Quick Shot / Blaster Whip by 10 would be another good alternative as well since the energy would happen at roughly the same time, but wouldn't be so prone to being wasted if we are at full energy.

mathy stuff
Spoiler



as far as set bonuses go, as i mentioned in the pm, the PvP set bonuses are rather generic and interchangeable, giving no real bonus to healing or dps.
i know that +15% back blast crit is highly-valued as a PvP set bonus for dps.
i know the +15% kolto cloud was pretty well-liked for healers, and the replacement was not really a fair tradeoff

i think the PvE 2-set bonuses are good. adding a +15% crit chance to blaster whip equally affects both specs and did not really hinder scrapper by swapping it around (unlike the eliminator set bonus that kind of made gunnery more difficult). giving PvE healers +15% kolto cloud healing and removing the super lame +15% kolto pack crit chance because no one was really using it.

the 4-piece bonus, i think we've made clear, isn't really valued. i think some of the most obvious would be a lowered cost of some basic moves, like -2 cost of blaster whip or -6 cost of vital shot or something for dps or -4 cost of kolto cloud for healing (like the old set bonus)
oaceen assault specialist / oac scrapper / oacao kinetic combatant / oacianado tactician
[Guide] The Dirty Rotten Scoundrel's PvE DPS Compendium

EricMusco's Avatar


EricMusco
09.11.2013 , 04:41 PM | #150 Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread. Next  
Quote: Originally Posted by Racter View Post
*SNIP*

Clear and concise enough? Not trying to be rude but ffs we've been saying this for almost 2 years, it's not like these are even recent concerns.
I understand your frustration and again, that is the purpose of the Class Rep system. Regardless of what was done in the past, my goal is to increase your communication to the Combat team and to insure your feedback is going there. For example, Racter, your previous posts had some great points in it. They may not have been written in the most constructive way but still good points . Keep giving feedback, I will keep passing it on.

I realize you felt like you haven't been heard in the past, I am trying to correct that!

-eric
Eric Musco | Community Manager
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