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4v4: problems with acid pit and turtle comp

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
4v4: problems with acid pit and turtle comp
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AlexModny's Avatar


AlexModny
08.15.2013 , 12:36 PM | #61 Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread. Next  
Quote: Originally Posted by ManiacDavis View Post
In the majority of games, sudden death will not occur.

FWIW, that is what we have seen in our playtests.
Alex Modny | Assistant Designer
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DkSharktooth's Avatar


DkSharktooth
08.15.2013 , 12:37 PM | #62
Quote: Originally Posted by AlexModny View Post


They won't.
Thanks

ManiacDavis's Avatar


ManiacDavis
08.15.2013 , 12:44 PM | #63
Quote: Originally Posted by AlexModny View Post

FWIW, that is what we have seen in our playtests.
Thanks Alex for being so vocal this week in quelling anxieties. I look forward to testing on the PTS. Feel free to stop by at www.twitch.tv/rrmaniac as I attempt to break everything you have worked so hard to build.
Man-iac - The Only Commando Left Standing
http://www.twitch.tv/rrmaniac

wildcoast's Avatar


wildcoast
08.15.2013 , 12:45 PM | #64
It was stated the acid moves in like a wall from all sides, it doesn't blanket the arena all at once, so the thought of pushing your opponents into the acid wall while you remain untouched in the center using stealth is still a valid turtle tactic. It isn't until the acid hits you that you lose stealth from what the Dev has said.

If the sudden death is, the whole arena fills with acid at the same time, then it's burn them down quick time, otherwise if it's a slow moving wall of death, it will be used as a killing device for turtle style teams.
Trooper Thavious
203rd Republic Expeditionary Legion

Envyyyyyyy's Avatar


Envyyyyyyy
08.15.2013 , 12:45 PM | #65
This whole thread makes me laugh. It shows that most of you have never actually been in 4v4 PVP death match, I can understand since it's not in the game, but for those who have done the tournaments or set it up themselves trust me when I say this .... it will be a VERY rare site to see that gas/acid. In 4v4s they can be SO fast....

Example i've seen one team sneak with the operative over to the other team, pop out of group stealth to ONE SHOT a DPS.. starting the round 4v3, burning the heals down was simple, last DPS and Tank went down like butter. It was over in less than a minute. Arenas will be fast paced, very rarely will you see a stalemate, and the fact that you're worried about what comp will last the best during a stalemate means you won't have the comp to win, so you'll die before you even get enough time to see the sudden death.

1. I wouldn't care or even focus on this aspect of Arenas YOU WONT SEE IT.
2. I would worry about your class/spec/burst
3. How to properly cycle CC, cooldowns, guard swapping etc.. is FAR more important than what class/make up will out last the other team lol YOU WONT.


In these 4v4s you Might get smashed double by 2 sentinels dealing 14,000-18,000+ dmg INSTANTLY to you. These are very fast paced and fun fights. So don't worry about this acid/sudden death and put more focus on reworking your specs to add more slows/roots/defensive etc.. I promise you you'll be surprised how these play out.
Vital (Shadow) Mondavi (Guardian) Midnight (Sage) Lavado (sorcerer) Enviously (Vanguard) Avaya (Operative) Anderson (Sentinel)
Thats No Moon (Founder / GM)

Akuryu's Avatar


Akuryu
08.15.2013 , 12:50 PM | #66
Quote: Originally Posted by ManiacDavis View Post
The dev blog does a good job explaining that the acid prevents stealth and healing. The sudden death will come down to who does the most DMG given the many escapes and gap closers many classes have. With that said, if I am in a game that reaches sudden death, I have already failed. In the majority of games, sudden death will not occur.
My understanding of the blog post is that the acid seeps in slowly. At first it will only be on the outer edges of the ring. As time passes it closes in. This leaves open the possibility that one team could stall until the acid is up, then do everything in their power to stun/push/pull the other team into the acid's path. A full team of stealth would have the advantage of surprise (the enemy won't know where they are positioned). I could even see suicide tactics developing where a tank would sacrifice himself to pull the enemy healer into the acid. Whoops... no more healing for you buddy.

I don't want arenas to turn into "who can knock who into the acid first"

ManiacDavis's Avatar


ManiacDavis
08.15.2013 , 12:54 PM | #67
^this is absolutely correct. A current example is hyper gate. Never have I seen the sudden death in a regular hyper gate. However at the highest level ranked. When no one caps a pylon, Hyper gate goes 20 rounds, ends abruptly and boths team lose after an hour of playtime. Do people complain about this, NO, because it rarely ever happens. Btw bioware you should change this because it is dumb.
Man-iac - The Only Commando Left Standing
http://www.twitch.tv/rrmaniac

Megatfx's Avatar


Megatfx
08.15.2013 , 12:56 PM | #68
Quote: Originally Posted by AlexModny View Post

FWIW, that is what we have seen in our playtests.
Alex i mean no disrespect but maybe that is the case with your playtests that is the case but in mine amongst the top teams it was different.

Very rarely will two teams instantly charge each other at the start of a match. They will spend a minute deciding who to attack and who to cc etc. then depending on the overall team strategy they might both waste 1+ minutes waiting for a team to initiate combat. Then the top 4v4 teams on pot5 with amazing healers often go for 5-10 minutes before someone dies running tank, 2dps, one healer. How do i know this will happen? From thousands upon thousands of arena games in wow. 5 minutes would probably be okay if both teams flat out charged each other out the gate every time but it wont happen like that. Maybe in your tests when your opponents knew who they were fighting.

With two to three minutes wasted every match before combat even begins you will find most games will end in sudden death.

AlexModny's Avatar


AlexModny
08.15.2013 , 12:56 PM | #69 Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread. Next  
Quote: Originally Posted by ManiacDavis View Post
Thanks Alex for being so vocal this week in quelling anxieties. I look forward to testing on the PTS. Feel free to stop by at www.twitch.tv/rrmaniac as I attempt to break everything you have worked so hard to build.

Looking forward to it!
Alex Modny | Assistant Designer
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Akuryu's Avatar


Akuryu
08.15.2013 , 01:07 PM | #70
Quote: Originally Posted by Envyyyyyyy View Post
This whole thread makes me laugh. It shows that most of you have never actually been in 4v4 PVP death match, I can understand since it's not in the game, but for those who have done the tournaments or set it up themselves trust me when I say this .... it will be a VERY rare site to see that gas/acid. In 4v4s they can be SO fast....
I don't know, I guess we'll find out. Considering the over-tuned heals (particularly on operatives) and the tank mechanics as they exist today, I don't think it's far-fetched to think 2 tanks and 2 healers (or 3 healers 1 tank) could outlast a group for 5 minutes. That's what this topic is about: turtle compositions whose sole purpose is to never die.

It's hard to focus down a really good operative healer who is being guarded in an 8 man warzone. Now you only have 4 men, and at least one of them will be a healer. Possibly a tank too. 2 DPSes focusing 1 operative who is being healed by another operative and guarded by not one but two tanks? As balance exists right now: I don't see that operative dying. "Forget the operative! Kill the tank! Focus fire!!!!!" Okay but that tank has 40k HP, defensive cooldowns out the ***, 2 healers taking care of him and another tank taunting for him.

Lets not forget most competitive ranked matches being played today turn into stalemates where nodes are never capped, bombs are never planted, etc etc etc.