Pay to Win

Its kind of funny your brought bands into this, but it'll work with what i'm about to say. I paid 250$ up front to see Slash at house of blues, i'd rather see that than some porcupine boy band. You can have the opinion that porcupines are better, but it's just an opinion, it rings hollow.

Stats never lie and stats always talk.

I'll just leave it at this, before this turns into the philosophy of an opinion etc. You enjoy SWTOR, i'll enjoy GW2, Let's just agree to disagree.

It doesn't encourage them, it forces them to pay if they actually want to experience the actual game.

You don't really have to worry about the F2Pers because you are subbed. Don't speak on their behalf.

Now if they could post on the swtor website, this forum would have a complete different feeling. Everyone here is subbed and they don't really care what free players do.

You are absolutely right. I do not care about the opinions of people playing for free, because their opinion doesn't matter..

You are absolutely right. I do not care about the opinions of people playing for free, because their opinion doesn't matter. It doesn't matter because they aren't paying to play the game. To experience the game as intended from the beginning they should have to pay...just like the rest of us subs. If they aren't invested enough to drop 15 bucks a month for unfettered access to a game, they don't need a voice. Their very transient nature means their opinions are probably not worth squat.

As far as I'm concerned, F2P players are parasites similar to people who game welfare to avoid getting jobs. Some of them want everything for nothing and they want to do it on the backs of people who pay their own way.

They want a voice? They can drop 15 bucks for a one month sub and come into the forums and blast away. Otherwise, they can remain silent and enjoy their no-cost game play while those of us with a vested interest in how the game grows and develops continue to enjoy ourselves fully at the mere pittance of 15 bucks a month.

You're sub'd and you seem to think you can speak for the F2Per's so don't act all high and mighty as if your voice yelling to give them something for nothing is more important. I'll speak my mind on a subject I've seen actually destroying MMO's instead of improving them. F2P benefits no one but transient players who can't commit to a single game but somehow expect to get it all for free.

F2P is the last ditch gasp of air corporations make in order to save an MMO from drowning. It may seem like it does some good but unless an MMO fixes the problems that forced the F2P decision the MMO is doomed as the F2P crowd moves on to wherever they feel the grass is greener and the subscribers leave because they see no reason to continue to support a game that still has the same problems that plagued it before.

The only game that did F2P somewhat well is actually GW and GW2, but the initial idea of making the game free but charging for content updates every 6 months has moved into the true realm of P2W, unlike SWTOR which started as a sub model and added F2P and the CM in order to try to save the drowning man...so to speak. Their entire business model for the F2P transition revolved around giving limited access to F2P to everything but the actual leveling process and cap and allowing a la carte purchases via the CM in order to let F2Per's experience the full game on a limited basis to actually encourage subscription. Of course, the CM also started adding fluff to entice the subscribers to drop more cash above and beyond the sub fee and where I feel EA/BW went wrong was an excessive focus on the CM fluff to the detriment of the in-game fluff and actual content.

In summary, SWTOR was and still is a P2P game that has a F2P teaser that exists to let people experience the game without a financial investment but which encourages subscription. However, until SWTOR fixes those problems that initially drove away subscribers and required the F2P addition, no amount of free play will encourage players to invest financially in the game. As we move to 2.3 and beyond (and hopefully to the SSSP and some point...dear deity of choice, let it be soon) we will see if the changes are for the better or are just more of the same.

Even die hard subscribers have only a limited amount of patience and goodwill to give.

Please learn to summarise, this is far too long, especially for what could be summed up in three sentences (literally three sentences).

Here is HIS essay summarized: Pay to avoid not being able to play the game fully. If you haven't paid, you are trash and you should feel like trash.

This essay made me face palm quite a bit. But a good laugh too, you think the game has a future, that one got me.

How was refuting my GW2 diagrams that i broke down for you going? That earlier proves you know very little about mmos and how they survive. But then again, i wouldn't expect much from a kid who enjoys cutting out F2P.

Paragraphs are your friend.

Please learn to summarise, this is far too long, especially for what could be summed up in three sentences (literally three sentences).

Here is HIS essay summarized: Pay to avoid not being able to play the game fully. If you haven't paid, you are trash and you should feel like trash.

You guys realize that Propane and BUBBUH are trolling you, right?

It's not Pay to Win. It is Pay to play the game as intended. F2P was an afterthought and in order to continue to earn money restrictions had to be put into place to encourage some actual spending by players regardless of whether or not they were F2P.

So F2P is actually Free to play some of the game but if you want the full experience you'll have to pay.

Of course, neither of those has the ADHD quality of F2P or P2W even if they are better descriptors of the realities of this (and other) online games.

You seem to think that the original game model is gone and that the "new" F2P model is now the standard. In truth, this game is a subscription MMO that offers a F2P version. So it is not a F2P game. It never was. It simply has a F2P version that has some pretty strict restrictions. As it should, since the F2P aren't doing anything to support the game and the company if they aren't spending money.