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2.0 DPS Leaderboard (v2)


Knopik's Avatar


Knopik
07.25.2013 , 02:11 PM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post
Eventually the boards will be "most accurate" several weeks from now when ~everyone is in 75s. Until then people can post parses for the fun of it. If you want to delve deeper into the parse and ignore the big red number, you will find that DPS is actually irrelevant. When comparing logs of the same spec, you can see the more important things such as # of hits or # of ability activations and that is what people need to look at instead of DPS numbers imho.

Parse A has X number of ability activations over 5 minutes and did 3200 DPS
Parse B has the same X number of ability activations over 5 minutes and did 3000 DPS because he is undergeared

for all intents and purposes both people "played just fine". Once in a while the stars align and you see someone post something like:

Parse C, which has the same X number of ability activations over 5 minutes, but had 15% more crit chance and did 3600 DPS.

Parse C did not do something extremely "pro" compared to Parse A and B. He just had more lucky crits.
Parse A is not better than Parse B, he just had more gear. These things people can see if you look past the DPS numbers and spend a little time figuring out # of ability use or ability activations all of which are available in the Log section of torparse. Turning these threads into a i have bigger DPS #s boards i think defeats the greater purpose of these threads. It can help people improve by pointing out what they need to do more, or what they are doing less. This is why i dont think there needs to be a flag for people in 75s and why the focus should be less on DPS #s (which stands out) but more on ability usage (which does not have a # attached to it) when parsing on the training dummy.

Just an opinion
That makes sense.

Ardarell_Solo's Avatar


Ardarell_Solo
07.25.2013 , 03:21 PM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Emperor-Norton View Post
Whoever is in charge of the thread checks the first 5 minutes of every parse to make sure you are telling the truth. Forex, OP sees Combat started at 00:00:00, so they select from that to 00:05:00. If they find the DPS is either greater or lesser than what you claim, they will let you know. Also, keyword is first 5 minutes, not the 5 minutes that has the highest DPS.
Ah, thanks for clearing that up.

About gear discussion: I have two 75 armorings and one 75 modification, rest is 72, pretty much BiS, I think.

About judging parses: I'd say APM, gear and crit luck are not the only things to take into account. You can still mess up rotation or get lucky/unlucky procs...
El'ethon (Sentinel) | Rickmyron (Gunslinger) | Alreegan (Sage)
Craeg (Scoundrel) | Dacs (Commando) | Vayus (Guardian)
<Taking the Jawas to Alderaan> rDD gesucht: -> hier klicken
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Carlenux's Avatar


Carlenux
07.25.2013 , 06:24 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post
Eventually the boards will be "most accurate" several weeks from now when ~everyone is in 75s. Until then people can post parses for the fun of it. If you want to delve deeper into the parse and ignore the big red number, you will find that DPS is actually irrelevant. When comparing logs of the same spec, you can see the more important things such as # of hits or # of ability activations and that is what people need to look at instead of DPS numbers imho.

Parse A has X number of ability activations over 5 minutes and did 3200 DPS
Parse B has the same X number of ability activations over 5 minutes and did 3000 DPS because he is undergeared

for all intents and purposes both people "played just fine". Once in a while the stars align and you see someone post something like:

Parse C, which has the same X number of ability activations over 5 minutes, but had 15% more crit chance and did 3600 DPS.

Parse C did not do something extremely "pro" compared to Parse A and B. He just had more lucky crits.
Parse A is not better than Parse B, he just had more gear. These things people can see if you look past the DPS numbers and spend a little time figuring out # of ability use or ability activations all of which are available in the Log section of torparse. Turning these threads into a i have bigger DPS #s boards i think defeats the greater purpose of these threads. It can help people improve by pointing out what they need to do more, or what they are doing less. This is why i dont think there needs to be a flag for people in 75s and why the focus should be less on DPS #s (which stands out) but more on ability usage (which does not have a # attached to it) when parsing on the training dummy.

Just an opinion
Smart comment up there ^, he is right of course... like ive always said, most top 1 rankings are always that lucky dude who got lucky crit % above the rest, or got the crits in the "right time"... so i always say anything thats 50-150 maybe 200 under top parse (unless top parse is like 2700 i guess) should be a good parse, maybe some stuff that could be improved, but a lot of it could be gear or Luck too.
Hmaull // Carlenx // Carlenix // Pyrotec // Invinc // Hwynn

Airwolfe's Avatar


Airwolfe
07.25.2013 , 11:31 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post
Parse A has X number of ability activations over 5 minutes and did 3200 DPS
Parse B has the same X number of ability activations over 5 minutes and did 3000 DPS because he is undergeared

for all intents and purposes both people "played just fine". Once in a while the stars align and you see someone post something like:

Parse C, which has the same X number of ability activations over 5 minutes, but had 15% more crit chance and did 3600 DPS.

Parse C did not do something extremely "pro" compared to Parse A and B. He just had more lucky crits.
Parse A is not better than Parse B, he just had more gear. These things people can see if you look past the DPS numbers and spend a little time figuring out # of ability use or ability activations all of which are available in the Log section of torparse. Turning these threads into a i have bigger DPS #s boards i think defeats the greater purpose of these threads. It can help people improve by pointing out what they need to do more, or what they are doing less. This is why i dont think there needs to be a flag for people in 75s and why the focus should be less on DPS #s (which stands out) but more on ability usage (which does not have a # attached to it) when parsing on the training dummy.

Just an opinion
Ya, correct. But it's also important to bear in mind that (at least in my class) a high APM is certainly aspect but not all. Doesn't account for rotation.
And as a Carnage Marauder for example, 4/36/6 will invariably have slightly lower APM than 5/36/5 - which will have berserk up more often thus increase APM (but in some or possibly most raid fights, 4/6 is better).
Airwolfe - Marauder <Chosen>

ConCube's Avatar


ConCube
07.26.2013 , 08:27 AM | #25
Short question:
Why does the Saboteur/Engineering-tree stand alone? Whats the thing with this tree? Is it just bad in realistic combat and does only dominate on the dummy, or is it just that other Snipers/Slinger not running this tree would be too bad to be listed here in comparison to the named tree?
KaMi NO ChiKara
Azonas Assassin
Warstalker

namesaretough's Avatar


namesaretough
07.26.2013 , 08:54 AM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by ConCube View Post
Short question:
Why does the Saboteur/Engineering-tree stand alone? Whats the thing with this tree? Is it just bad in realistic combat and does only dominate on the dummy, or is it just that other Snipers/Slinger not running this tree would be too bad to be listed here in comparison to the named tree?
There's a move called scatter bombs you get in the tree that makes you drop explosives when you use your covered escape/hightail it. The bombs are intended to be spread along the whole path you roll, but if a boss is large enough or next to a wall you can hit it with multiple bombs, sometimes 4 or even all 5. When you do that, you end up getting a huge dps boost from all the bombs hitting. The dummies are next to walls, which means you basically have the perfect conditions to do monster damage while dummy parsing. That's why the sab/eng parses are so much higher than every other spec. There are tradeoffs for doing this in a real boss fight that makes it a lot more difficult, and you can only realistically get close to those huge numbers on a few boss fights, but it's the upper limit of what the spec can do (which is what a thread like this is all about).

odawgg's Avatar


odawgg
07.26.2013 , 10:49 AM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by ConCube View Post
Short question:
Why does the Saboteur/Engineering-tree stand alone? Whats the thing with this tree? Is it just bad in realistic combat and does only dominate on the dummy, or is it just that other Snipers/Slinger not running this tree would be too bad to be listed here in comparison to the named tree?
Short answer: it's OP on a significant number of fights, but not all.... IMO

Falver's Avatar


Falver
07.26.2013 , 11:04 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by odawgg View Post
Short answer: it's OP on a a significant number of fights, but not all IMO
It is essentially this. It is a skewed representation of gunslinger DPS. A gunslinger doing 3600 on a combat dummy because dummies provides a perfect scenario of using it does not mean that it will be done the same way in an ops. It's a good tree, but it'd be fallacious to only represent gunslingers by saboteur DPS, considering it's 400~500 DPS higher than the other specs because of one situational move.
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ConCube's Avatar


ConCube
07.26.2013 , 12:03 PM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by namesaretough View Post
There's a move called scatter bombs you get in the tree that makes you drop explosives when you use your covered escape/hightail it. The bombs are intended to be spread along the whole path you roll, but if a boss is large enough or next to a wall you can hit it with multiple bombs, sometimes 4 or even all 5. When you do that, you end up getting a huge dps boost from all the bombs hitting. The dummies are next to walls, which means you basically have the perfect conditions to do monster damage while dummy parsing. That's why the sab/eng parses are so much higher than every other spec. There are tradeoffs for doing this in a real boss fight that makes it a lot more difficult, and you can only realistically get close to those huge numbers on a few boss fights, but it's the upper limit of what the spec can do (which is what a thread like this is all about).
Well, thats what I assumed! Anyway, thanks for this quick, informal answer!
Another short question:

Would you (everyone is meant here) carry a Deception-Sin to a Progressraid? As a permanent member?
(I know, I know, I already askes this in the former threat but since that time I tried to find even a HM-operationgroup and got denied, a friend (Mara) got 5 invites! (Both random)

Edit: Same gearlevel!

I hope someone can help me (again :/), thanks!
KaMi NO ChiKara
Azonas Assassin
Warstalker