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Nerf Smash/Sweep


Jarfunkz's Avatar


Jarfunkz
07.03.2013 , 12:42 PM | #31
Quote: Originally Posted by Boch View Post
Healing is not on par with DPS, its about 50% over if not more.
I fully agree with pvp... but pve, pretty close to being even. I gave a way to minimize healing without it effecting the pve environment.
VicVega

znihilist's Avatar


znihilist
07.03.2013 , 12:46 PM | #32
Quote: Originally Posted by szczypaczek View Post
i Love how you ppl try hard to explain opnes of your class xD

I mean Smash is too powerfull, but maybe not in terms of numbers, but it's too easy to set it up, make this spec more difficult to play or smt?
Like the OP healers, nerf the non existant energy cost on their hot and things should be fine
I don't play smash, so try again!
Smash is required in this game, we need a hard hitting aoe.
"YOU" (and not you in specific) are asking for a nerf to smash. You need to come up with an answer to the question I asked earlier, how can you effectively counter the stacking strategy ? In order to nerf smash you need to create something new to stop the opposing team from employing that tactic.
Smash has a role to play, if you want to eliminate that role you must come up with a new one (within the boundaries of what's in the game already).
The problem is that you are not seeing further than your nose.
These are not the signatures you are looking for!

Brunner_Venda's Avatar


Brunner_Venda
07.03.2013 , 01:38 PM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by KhalDrogoe View Post
The Autocrit to everyone is the issue. If Mercs had a skill that was auto crit...
Actually AP powertechs get an auto crit rail after a rocket punch - the kicker is that it only does about 5K with a 15 second CD on that spec. Not a merc, I know. But close.

I don't want to nerf every class into powertech uselessness.

I'd like to point to smash, and be able to say SEE DEVS? 8K AOE. FIX PT's NOW!

The alternative is a long stalemate in a cold kolto shower - all while trying to play whack-a-mole with healer operatives using rubber light sabers.

Enfuri's Avatar


Enfuri
07.03.2013 , 03:30 PM | #34
The real issue behind the Smash/Sweep specs is how damage modifiers stack and synergize.

For anyone who doesnt know how the spec works. After a leap of any sort, the next smash/sweep is an auto-crit. This means that people in the spec do not have to waste any effort stacking crit chance and instead can stack surge. Also when 3 stacks of the singularities build after using the exhaustion or combat focus, the next sweep is free and does an extra 100% damage.

The tree also has a talent that makes all abilities ignore 30% of armor and another talent that increases critical damage by 15%. This means the base surge for a smasher is already 65% before stacking any surge stats. If a player stacks enough surge they can get their crit damage boost to about 90%. Also with the pvp gear, there is an ability to get an extra 10% damage boost after a leap.

Essentially with everything lined up right, a smasher/sweeper can autocrit and do an extra 200% damage. The AoE aspect of the move is really not the issue and you cant change smash/sweep without changing the capabilities of the other specs. Furthermore the range is actually short, its only about 5m but with lag it can get out to about 10m.

The real problem is the stacking damage modifiers. If the singularity buff was decreased to only give a 75% damage increase, if the surge boost was removed, or if 30% armor pen was removed it would reduce the spike of smash/sweep spec a great deal. But currently with all of them working together its how you can see the 8-10k hits.

However, currently there is also the issue that healing is quite powerful and with a guard some healers become almost invincible. In those cases, smash spec is one of the most effective ways to kill the tank and healer pair.

If the devs really want to tackle the issue there are a few things they can adjust and some things dont even need to be adjusted all that much. The easiest fix is to adjust the amount of bonus damage the singularities offer. If they nerf the smash damage prepare for an increase in other damages to make up for the pure single target damage potential. The best solution would be to have exhaustion do slightly more damage or make a talent have a modifier that makes a base move like slash do more damage. They will need to keep the total damage potential the same while nerfing the spike associated with smash.

Seengularity's Avatar


Seengularity
07.03.2013 , 04:10 PM | #35
Quote: Originally Posted by znihilist View Post
I don't play smash, so try again!
Smash is required in this game, we need a hard hitting aoe.
"YOU" (and not you in specific) are asking for a nerf to smash. You need to come up with an answer to the question I asked earlier, how can you effectively counter the stacking strategy ? In order to nerf smash you need to create something new to stop the opposing team from employing that tactic.
Smash has a role to play, if you want to eliminate that role you must come up with a new one (within the boundaries of what's in the game already).
The problem is that you are not seeing further than your nose.
Znihilist --> Got it right

I say --> Complaining about Smash is sooo pre 2.0 (And even then it wasn't warranted).

thx, we'll be closing this below,




/thread

JeffSantos's Avatar


JeffSantos
07.03.2013 , 04:27 PM | #36
You know what? I think there's not a single class in this game that needs a nerf. Nor smash sents/marauders nor operatives healers nor snipers. They're all very powerful, but they don't need a nerf at all. There are some classes/specs that could be buffed though, like Assault/AP Vanguards or healing Commandos/Mercs..
[CENTER]The Corleone Legacy - POT5
Sofia'coppola (Operative) / Marlon'branndo (Marauder)

KhalDrogoe's Avatar


KhalDrogoe
07.03.2013 , 05:05 PM | #37
Quote: Originally Posted by JeffSantos View Post
You know what? I think there's not a single class in this game that needs a nerf. Nor smash sents/marauders nor operatives healers nor snipers. They're all very powerful, but they don't need a nerf at all. There are some classes/specs that could be buffed though, like Assault/AP Vanguards or healing Commandos/Mercs..
Yeah I remember when everyone was screaming for Merc Nerfs, then all the mercs had to go healing, then everyone was screaming that merc heals were OP, then they were nerfed. It'd be sad if another class had to wait a year before they became playable again like mercs did. Even now Arsenal is only on the verge of being rated viable, still need some buffs to get them on par with Juggs/Ops/Sorcs/Assassins

Iraq-Lobster, Wakwa, The Marshmallow Legacy POT5
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Zunayson's Avatar


Zunayson
07.03.2013 , 05:09 PM | #38
Quote: Originally Posted by KhalDrogoe View Post
Yeah I remember when everyone was screaming for Merc Nerfs, then all the mercs had to go healing, then everyone was screaming that merc heals were OP, then they were nerfed. It'd be sad if another class had to wait a year before they became playable again like mercs did. Even now Arsenal is only on the verge of being rated viable, still need some buffs to get them on par with Juggs/Ops/Sorcs/Assassins
Operative DPS took a year to be decent. Now it's good.

this game and this community has a grudge against mercs and operatives.

Which, when you think about it, are the tech users. That's how you know this is truly a star wars game.
Quote: Originally Posted by Uber_the_Goober View Post
Bioware couldn't balance a sheet of plywood if it were laying [sic] on the ground.
Quote: Originally Posted by Aragost View Post
Make sure you take 3/3 in the "knowing how to play" box

Lilouk's Avatar


Lilouk
07.03.2013 , 05:27 PM | #39
Lol at those saying smash/sweep doesn't need a nerf. I guarantee that you either use it yourself or you run ranked with multiple smashers.

The tree takes no skill at all and all these so called 'Pro' PvPers use the smash/sweep spec because it's so OP.

It needs a nerf, end of.

xAZUREx's Avatar


xAZUREx
07.03.2013 , 05:52 PM | #40
smash monkey smash hit me for over 8k

my vigilance sweep hit back for 2.5k crit

now that 1 smash monkey hits 8k on my full conqureor gear, armor rating, damage reduction so what happens when it hits 5 light-medium armor chars hit over 8k on each of them
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