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Dread Guard nerf - Catering to the Casual


AlrikFassbauer's Avatar


AlrikFassbauer
06.28.2013 , 04:25 AM | #41
Quote: Originally Posted by ErosGyne View Post
Most guilds dont reach that far, half way of phase 2 with luck
I expect the "professional guilds" want it that way.
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mastirkal's Avatar


mastirkal
06.28.2013 , 12:19 PM | #42
Quote: Originally Posted by AlrikFassbauer View Post
I expect the "professional guilds" want it that way.
Something wrong with wanting hard content, but not insane enrage?

odawgg's Avatar


odawgg
06.28.2013 , 01:09 PM | #43
Quote: Originally Posted by mastirkal View Post
Something wrong with wanting hard content, but not insane enrage?
Yeah that's what Hard Mode is for

MVaglin's Avatar


MVaglin
06.28.2013 , 02:10 PM | #44
Yeah, if hard modes was actually like that.
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Mireleni's Avatar


Mireleni
06.28.2013 , 03:04 PM | #45
Quote: Originally Posted by Airwolfe View Post
Nice to see Bioware caving to the casuals
How do you define "casuals"? Is there a cutoff for hours played per week? Hours per character? Achievements unlocked? Money in the bank? Gear level, and percent gear won vs. percent gear bought with comms or crafted? Or is a "casual" really just anyone who isn't you?
People who should be able to beat the fight: Me.
Casuals, who obviously shouldn't: Everyone else, suckers.
All the people saying "Only the best players should be able to beat Nightmare Mode" have this same problem in reasoning. How do you quantify "best"? Top 5%? Top 1%? 0.1%? etc.

It's like a high schooler graduating at the top 5% of his class whining about a kid from the top 10% of the class who got into the same college. "Elite University is catering to the stoopids!" Now he can't even boast about the college he got into, because Mr. 10% got in, too. Well guess what: Just because he's paying the university for his education doesn't make him the dean of admission. Sure, he can voice his opinion, but the university is going to try to do what's best for the university as a whole and not cater to that one individual.

BioWare is trying to improve the experience for their players as a whole. They can make missteps, of course, but I don't doubt that this is their goal (it goes along with making sure the game continues to run and make money). A change that affects you negatively may affect a greater number of people more positively. They won't nerf it to the ground, because then too many people would be unhappy. They have to figure out what percent of raiding guilds they want to admit to elite university and tune the fights from there.

TL;DR: Go ahead and debate whether you think the fight is too hard, too easy, or just right. But don't pretend that you define the gold standard for who should win. You're not the gatekeeper.
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Powerrmongerr's Avatar


Powerrmongerr
06.28.2013 , 03:29 PM | #46
Stick a lever near the Dread Guard encounter. Pull the lever, enrage timer drops by 30 seconds. You get a title just for beating them. Remove lever if/when level cap increases.

While you're at it, due to the same thing for Lost Island so people can play it in its pre-original nerf state.

Carlenux's Avatar


Carlenux
06.28.2013 , 04:11 PM | #47
i believe DGs was hard, and it was HardCore raiding, but not that much, the hardest fight in the encounter should be the last one, in a long Ops like SaV, if you give me last 2 just as hard as NiM Dg even harder, and the rest "hard" like DG after nerf, then thats what everyone wants... 5 bosses to kill, that will take few days, maybe 1 week, then 2 fights that should take 1-2-3 weeks each, because you need both "great performance" plus the 5-10 pieces of loot from the other 5 bosses are useful after wiping for 1-2-3 weeks, on each boss...

now making the 2nd fight the hardest is stupid, just made whiners avoid, others gave excuses, for a content that 3 guilds killed before 1st week -.-.... you need at least to give people 4-5 bosses to "work hard" in maybe 7-10 days to complete, then the last 2 being *********** insane that only the best can clear withing 4-5 weeks... the good guilds will take 6 weeks to clear (more gear)... the awesome guilds will take 3-4 weeks for loot as well... the best guild will take 2 weeks because they are so good they will overcome the lack of gear.

that was WoW theory back in the day, and its the only thing i agree with WoW, that would help all this QQ and whine about hard content in swtor for once, also remove stupid lockout from HM / NiM it cant be more pointless, not only is gear lost, but its open to exploits / skipping as well as its 1 less difficulty / raid to do for each person/char = less time to play the game,

if i had nim for progress, hm for gearing alts, and sm to help other people, i would be playing all day on all my alts, but i dont know why bioware doesnt get this and give us dailys and CM useless thing that most raiders dont care about, dailys doesnt make the game funnier, it just force raiders to do them to have money for consumable / gear / repairs.
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paowee's Avatar


paowee
06.28.2013 , 04:32 PM | #48
Quote: Originally Posted by Carlenux View Post
i believe DGs was hard, and it was HardCore raiding, but not that much, the hardest fight in the encounter should be the last one, in a long Ops like SaV, if you give me last 2 just as hard as NiM Dg even harder, and the rest "hard" like DG after nerf, then thats what everyone wants... 5 bosses to kill, that will take few days, maybe 1 week, then 2 fights that should take 1-2-3 weeks each, because you need both "great performance" plus the 5-10 pieces of loot from the other 5 bosses are useful after wiping for 1-2-3 weeks, on each boss...

now making the 2nd fight the hardest is stupid, just made whiners avoid, others gave excuses, for a content that 3 guilds killed before 1st week -.-.... you need at least to give people 4-5 bosses to "work hard" in maybe 7-10 days to complete, then the last 2 being *********** insane that only the best can clear withing 4-5 weeks... the good guilds will take 6 weeks to clear (more gear)... the awesome guilds will take 3-4 weeks for loot as well... the best guild will take 2 weeks because they are so good they will overcome the lack of gear.

that was WoW theory back in the day, and its the only thing i agree with WoW, that would help all this QQ and whine about hard content in swtor for once, also remove stupid lockout from HM / NiM it cant be more pointless, not only is gear lost, but its open to exploits / skipping as well as its 1 less difficulty / raid to do for each person/char = less time to play the game,

if i had nim for progress, hm for gearing alts, and sm to help other people, i would be playing all day on all my alts, but i dont know why bioware doesnt get this and give us dailys and CM useless thing that most raiders dont care about, dailys doesnt make the game funnier, it just force raiders to do them to have money for consumable / gear / repairs.
i agree somewhat.

hasrdest boss should be the last or last 2 so that guilds can spend a few weeks farming the earlier bosses for gear that theyll need to overcome the last encounter
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Grimsblood's Avatar


Grimsblood
06.28.2013 , 04:55 PM | #49
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post
i agree somewhat.

hasrdest boss should be the last or last 2 so that guilds can spend a few weeks farming the earlier bosses for gear that theyll need to overcome the last encounter
I do agree, we spent ~40% of our time in NiM TFB on Dread Guards alone. We should have had to spend that time on Terror (But sadly, Terror as it stands is a poor fight. Exceptionally repetitive and boring).
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dscount's Avatar


dscount
06.28.2013 , 05:14 PM | #50
To those doing the QQ this got nerfed... "Get over it". No really, this is silly. A good solid NiM that is a challenge is really cool, but the facts are pretty obvious that 4, 5 maybe 6 guilds actually CLEARED the DG NiM Pre-Nerf? This is an entertainment business that BW/EA has to maintain for THOUSANDS of customers and not just the 30-60 people that are skilled enough and determined enough to become "FIRST" at that hardest stuff on the server. I love the NiM content and thinks it's pretty close to workable for many more guilds soon to finish Min/Max of 72 gear. (Different thread for <insert gear stat = crap>)

Quote: Originally Posted by Carlenux View Post
i believe DGs was hard, and it was HardCore raiding, but not that much, the hardest fight in the encounter should be the last one, in a long Ops like SaV, if you give me last 2 just as hard as NiM Dg even harder, and the rest "hard" like DG after nerf, then thats what everyone wants... 5 bosses to kill, that will take few days, maybe 1 week, then 2 fights that should take 1-2-3 weeks each, because you need both "great performance" plus the 5-10 pieces of loot from the other 5 bosses are useful after wiping for 1-2-3 weeks, on each boss...
Totally agree with Carlenux on this one! Some feedback on S&V NiM was heard about Thrasher being a bit overtuned.
Quote: Originally Posted by AshlaBoga View Post
Honestly, I think the issue with the DG was that they were the second boss. I like the idea of the last boss being as hard as pre-30 second added to enrage timer DG, then the penultimate boss being as hard as the current DG..
Quote: Originally Posted by paowee View Post
hardest boss should be the last or last 2 so that guilds can spend a few weeks farming the earlier bosses for gear that theyll need to overcome the last encounter
Quote: Originally Posted by Grimsblood View Post
I do agree, we spent ~40% of our time in NiM TFB on Dread Guards alone. We should have had to spend that time on Terror (But sadly, Terror as it stands is a poor fight. Exceptionally repetitive and boring).
Sounds like a LOT of people agree that FUTURE NiM content should move the "Ball crushing, butt kicking" bosses to the back of the line and add some MEAT to the loot drops on them while at it. Risk needs to provide reward! DG NiM should have dropped the "BEST" 75 Gear in all of the OP as it is the most difficult out of all the bosses. (So I've heard/read)

Maybe you should x2 the Gear dropped in DG NiM and then tone down that gear as they are nerfed over time? (Just a thought to reward some of the best hardcore guilds clearing and give a carrot to others to not wait for NERFS?)

Oh yea.. PLEASE SEPARATE NiM & HM lockouts! S&V NiM should have a separate lockout for NiM / HM (Retro do the same for TFB NiM / HM as well).
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