I'm starting to get really worried by the CM

I'm pretty sure I do, if you read my posts you will in actual fact find I understand it perfectly.

Being an *** = the proper use of vocabulary? Haven't heard that one before I admit.

Anyway, as I said you will never admit swtor has any faults because you thr kind of consumer that will blindly support and follow without asking questions.

Maybe, but so what?
The "big guys" are the ones making the decisions and they rarely make sense (both them and their decisions), not Bioware devs.

The point is that, when the decision to go F2P was made, they were informed that they need to keep some subscribers AND have a successful game shop.

Heh. you said that without a smiley or a smiley with a tongue??

Kilora has posted plenty of fault and shortcomings about SWTOR in the forum here.

Some people just do it constructively... and I get that constructive comment is lost on a lot of people who have an axe to grind about the game.

LOL -- so you resort to ad hominem?

Instead of continuing to prove your ignorance -- take a look at my post history.

1.) I don't blindly support anything.
2.) I've critizied BW numerous times -- even within the past few days.
3.) I don't deny issues that exist.
4.) I constantly tell people that, if they feel something isn't worth the $, don't spend the $.

So, instead of acting like a 5 year old child, maybe you shouldn't assume you know someone?

People can see boogey men behind every corner and shadow for sure. This is fundamental to human nature and it originates from the more primitive (tribal) elements of the human brain. Calling it superstition in modern style, probably expresses it best.

But it does not mean there ARE boogey men behind every corner or shadow.

There is a generally accepted definition across the wide and diverse MMO player base as to what P2W means. This MMO does not fit that generally accepted definition.

But generally accepted fact and definition of terms never stops an agenda. The terms are simply redefined and the facts distorted to promote the agenda. Some people flat out don't like micro-transactions and cash shops. So they will redefine and distort (sometimes to extremes) to build a foundation to support an agenda. In the case of the CM... the agenda is some people don't like micro-transactions and want everything in an MMO to be covered by their subscription price. And they are willing to do anything to try to prove their point. But facts, objectivity, and thoughtful understanding of what the term P2W actually means in the MMO context cannot be defeated by boogey men.

See, I understand how people can see $ as a timesaver to be P2W.
Technically, since there really isn't a concrete agreed-upon definition, it is.

I refuse to call it P2W -- because it isn't detrimental to anyone, nor anymore "unfair" than my having more time than someone else. You still have to play the game to get the best gear and such. And P2W carries a negative connontation -- I don't feel things like XP Boosts and other timesavers/convenience items are negative.

The generally accepted definition of P2W is not to save time, but to give decisive advantage of one player over another in player on player interactions (generally in PvP). Raiders stretch this definition (with some validity) to include short circuiting "paying of dues" via "earning your progression gear" to progress in end game content.

SWTOR has done nothing with the CM to enable any of this to date.

I grant that they have pissed off raiders by letting crafters craft the best mods at times after Re-ing them from raid drops... but that has nothing to do with the CM or P2W. But then again.. they fixed this mistake. Still....a handful of raiders have claimed that earning credits via CM ---> GTN is some sort of pseudo P2W... but since credits fall from everything in mass quantities by end game.. your average players at level cap has zero need to gather credits in this manner...to it's an anemic argument... and falls into the boogey man realm as far as I am concerned.

LOL really? Please don't come here with your googled Latin phrases trying to sound smart because you realise you are wrong. I have no interest in your post history.

1. Your posts in this thread say quite the opposite.
2. Funnily enough you aren't on my radar, so I have no clue what you have said in the past, nor do I care.
3. Again evidence in this thread says otherwise.
4. That bears no relevance to this discussion, we're discussing if it's pay2win not if it's worth spending your money on.

Ah yes the classic "you're a child defense" well done.

You know .... you look more silly with each successive post you make.

IF you are going to make sweeping generalizations such as accusing Kilora of never criticizing the game...when in point of fact Kilora often is critical of the game in threads all over the forum...... you are destined to become jovial entertainment in the forum. Zero credibility.. but great entertainment value.

Protip: when attempting to assassinate another forum members position on the game...it is better to use the entire forum as context, rather then just a single thread. Spend 5 minutes.. scan Kiloras posts in the forum...gain accurate context.... then apologize IMO.

It's hard for me to see anything on the market as P2W...at least under the proper definition of such...due to the fact, as far as I am aware, that all items purchased on the market can be sold on the GTN.

If you couldn't get items on the GTN that you could buy in the market and that item gave you an advantage over someone that has no cash to spend then perhaps you could call it P2W. But even if that was the case we are still not talking about a serious advantage at end game, or any at all, the advantage comes much earlier in the game.

Here are some contentions that I do not agree with (but that doesn't necessarily make the them invalid, just my opinion)

Buying any advantage with cash is P2W.

You pay cash for a subscription and expansions. Doing both can provide you with advantages that you can't have if you don't pay. Therefore everything could be considered P2W IMO.

Buying any convenience, or anything that makes your game easier/play time shorter is P2W.

People buy speeders. They buy unlocks. They buy gear. This is all normal stuff. Some of it is convenience. This is not really a P2W situation.

If you can buy something with cash that you would normally have to earn it is P2W.

The same can be said for buying something with credits. People can give you credits, then you could buy stuff you didn't earn. People can carry you through content and then give you the loot. People can just give you loot. The ability to pay cash for it should not be the only qualifier.

The existence of a cash shop is P2W.

This is just silly IMO. One might as well say the existence of anything in an MMO that requires cash is P2W...like your sub.

Just my slant.