Events bringing the trolls out from under their bridges, and how to fix it.

You are very good at manipulating words.You are giving me crap by saying no one is forced to do this, to do that. But when I use same example you object. So you should understand different people have different objections.

First, we killed him 4 times back to back. But he managed to kill 2 or 3 of us every single time. That is what I wrote. He was two shotting one person at the beginning of the fight with the surprise advantage. But that is not the point. I am talking about 1 vs 1. Can a PVE guy a beat PVP guy given the equal skill level with the gear difference? I don't think so. So if the outcome will be always a PVP guy winning against a single PVE guy, what is the point?

You aren't forced. In no way are you forced to do any of the PvP quests. If you elect to do them, I suggest you have the appropriate gear...otherwise, you'll be 2 shotted and get no sympathy from me, nor most PvPers, for trying to do a PvP mission without PvP gear.

What you seem to be truly upset about is that Bolster doesn't effect Ilum's PvP area any longer - and it should. That I'd support you on and defend your right to have Bolster granted in the FFA area - it's how Bioware does all PvP these days...to exclude this area is inexcusable.

Not sure that could ever be added. Too easy to cheat the system in Open World PVP areas - You still have to have a different PVE-type objective even in PVP.

I've learned over the years that if gamers can cheat the system, many will.

I like seeing that at least there's some worthwhile conversation going on...

But ultimately, there is, and has only ever been, one response from those defending the way things are now... "It's a PvP mission in a PvP area. I can gank you if I want."

And I get it. You're right. It's a mission labeled PvP, and it occurs in a PvP area. But whereas the griefers see this as their "gank freely with no consequence" card, everyone else sees it for what it is... poor design, and a recipe for allowing the worst elements of a community the opportunity to force their stupidity on everyone else.

I will continually find it funny how, with the several hundred players on my server running through Ilum during the time I'm also there, nearly all of us manage to walk in the area, get their objectives, and leave without attacking a single player... most grabbing an orb and forming a largely orderly line at the pylon to turn it in, and even without a menacing glare or a brandishing of weapons to be seen... and many helping other players outside of their own group to secure objectives and guard the pylons to actively prevent fighting on turn in... and yet, when that small handful of PvP'ers rolls in and insists on cowardly attacking other players when they're engaged in fights with mobs or mid action during objectives, WE'RE the ones who don't understand what the mission is all about.

The hilarity comes from, in part, the desperate clinging to excuses as to why such actions are ok. Why you're not a douche for stealth camping the pylon, waiting for a group to come by and turn in before you attack them... if you really thought it was your mission to turn in orbs and prevent others from doing so, then why aren't you getting orbs for your group, or attacking players straight up when they come to turn in the orb? Why you think it's your mission to engage in PvP combat at all when you gain nothing for it... it takes you longer to get your own objectives done if you're fighting other players, rather than just waiting like everyone else, and you neither win nor lose in preventing other players from getting their own objectives. Why you insist that it's a PvP mission.... when there isn't a single player interaction, or it's a PvP area when not one fight needs to occur. Why you try so hard to convince the rest of the community that you're just not a sad excuse for a human being.

No... I wouldn't even lump most PvP players in with the sorts of individuals that attack other players in the PvP area. Any honest PvP player would rather spend a whole night in Warzones playing the game than sitting around Ilum waiting for hapless questers to pounce on. Hell, the honest PvP players treat the Gree event just like the rest of us... get in, get my easy rep and 100 WZ comms, and get out. "You mean I don't actually have to fight anything, but you give me comms anyway?"

I agree; most PvP players play for the love of themselves more than anything else.

Seriously. This thread boggles my mind. Boggles.

By the logic some people are using, all warzones are PvE areas. They all have objectives which are NOT 'kill x people'.

Let me make an analogy like this: Bioware makes bosses/instances which sometimes require specific strategies or behavior to overcome. Do you insist on using a different method and complain when you die horribly over and over, or do you adapt and learn the strategy to win? If you are undergeared for the encounter, do you whine about how the opponent is overpowered or do you gear up to the appropriate levels?

If you really really want to finish those objectives, there are plenty ways of doing so. If you do not wish to overcome those challenges, you do not need to. No quest in all of SWTOR is mandatory. You only have to participate in the content that you like. If you do not like PVP content, do not participate in it. If Bioware says its PVP content, and creates an FFA area for it, then it is PVP content. Regardless of the issues with implementation, it is PVP because Bioware says so. The same as warzones are PVP because Bioware says so. Just because its in an area rather than an instance does not make a difference.

You don't do warzones because you do not like PVP content, thus you do not have to do these quests if you do not like PVP content. If you want the rewards that badly, then you can adapt to the encounter.

I am not a PVPer at heart. I have not stepped foot in a warzone. Even so, this seems obvious to me. Even as a non-PVPer, I did these quests and I enjoyed it as a change of pace. Take it for what it is.

Ah - but now you're using logic to counter the words of people telling us that the Gree event missions are not PvP and are in fact PvE.
If we look at the warzones and their objectives:

Civil War
Capture and defend turrets so as to destroy the oppositions craft

Voidstar
Place charges on doors to allow access to a datacore and download this data

Huttball
Score a point by moving the ball over the oppositions goal line

Novare Coast
Capture and defend gun batteries to destroy the oppositions base

Ancient Hypergate
Capture and defend an ancient hypergate. Charge the gates with orbs

In each WZ the actual killing of other players is as a consequence of the actual objective. There is no "kill x players" objective in a WZ.
Of course you can play the WZ by ignoring the objectives and just killing other people. The fact it's a PvP environment means you can do this.
How is this actually that much different from the PvP missions during the Gree event?

I'm reading the OP, and I slogged through a good half-dozen pages of people making comments of one or another type about the OP's comments.

I'd just like to say that what I got from the original post is that there is an issue with the culture behind some people playing PVP. Campers, gankers and griefers aren't playing in the spirit of honest sportsmanship or enjoyable play. Sure, they get their kicks in pwning some PVE player trying to knock out a quest in a PVP area, but where is the real enjoyment in stomping on people who don't want to play the game that you're playing?

What I would like to see in an open world FFA PVP quest would be something along the lines of the Warzone quests- engage in x number of PVP combat events in the FFA PVP area, and the events that you (or your team) survive (aka win) counts as 2 of those required numbers. That way people who are looking for PVP get their (true to flavor) PVP quest, and people who are doing the quest for the numbers aren't looking at receiving only the rewards of a repair bill for their troubles.

Something like that would put enough combatant PVP people in the area to curb the campers, griefers and gankers, and the people who are only there for the event get something for being beat on by the people who play the game to beat on other people.

In this case.....

Huttball, Voidstar, Novare Coast, Ancient Hypergates and Civil War are PvE areas because you are not required to kill other people. Objectives are to cap nods, nothing more.

and if the quest tells them to jump in front of a train.... let's forbid all trains rather than slapping people like this left and right for reading, understanding and thinking what may be involved for what they have to do.

PvP player go into PvP areas to do.... PvP. If people don't fight back, don't blame any PvP player for it. Nobody is griefing you, it works as intended that everyone can attack you and you can attack everyone else.

I have a perfect solution for you... PvE player do the quests which are inside the PvE area = 0 problems. If you want to get more out of the event, do it with several chars... = you get your legend status and anything coming along with it much faster and you don't have to take any "poor" character stalking anyone in a PvP zone but their own kind.

You know what would improve player experience during the entire game and for the sake of the argument, humanity smarter and getting somewhere? If people wouldn't make up stupid arguments, they are the source of.

I play on a RP-PvE server, and I play a Sith. I run around the game fully flagged, so if Republic players wish to attack me they can. If I get jumped by a group of 3-4 players and die, I'll end up having to die. Its how I roll. I dont try and intentionally flag people even if I do know how. If people wish to fight, having a PvP flag on means they will. I have been killed during dailies before, and this was certainly a little annoying this was a risk I took in putting my flag on. The PvP quests for the Gree event happen in a PvP area, so you agreed to be flaged by going in, you also agreed to be flagged doing the outside quests too, if you didnt wait at your base for your flag to go. Therefore any kills made on you I feel are legimate. That being said I play a Sith, we hate Jedi and their allies and I'm not a nice Sith at times, so I like to hurt people. I am going to kill you if I see you flagged, as thats part of my Roleplay. I will admit I spent hours during the Gree event in the middle of the PvP area, during night hours, Sometimes alone, something with others. For the most part I let my own faction live, but I made some exceptions, you killed one of my guild, the whole guild took that as a sign that you and your guild wished war. We are Sith we kill, so we would kill you on sight. Those Imperial players who killed one of ours we showed no mercy to. The Republic had more of a chance, if you tried to use the pylon in the middle I would kill you the first time. Then provoided you came back slowly and waited off the pylon, I would make a offer, bow to me and recognise yo are inferior and you can do you quest. Some did this, and they got their dailies done. This is RP in a PvP area, it was fun. Others just tried to kill me or use the pylon, they had been warned and would die. People may say I only did this with friends in uber PvP gear. I did not do that all the time. I had full partisan as thats what I like on my charecter,. PvP. It is not my fault that some walk into a zone with PvE gear. By flagging yourself you say you are their to be killed. In war you dont stop to ask if the person in a uniform in front of you is the cook, you see a enemy and kill it. I fought everyone I saw, I engaged groups when I was outnumbered, I adapted if the groups were good, and very very rarely did I call for any help from others. Only If I knew that I was greatly out matched, I fought groups 4 on 1, and lost, came back and kept losing. I came up with tricks to get them and I did. I had some good fights and some not so good fights, when people brought groups of upto 20 players from their guild and allies to come take the middle from me. I encouraged both RP and PvP on a RP server. And I will do so again next event. By people walking into the PvP area, they agreed to all this, if you dont like what I did, come find me next gree event, I will be stood out in the middle on the PvP area with a non stealth class waiting for people to fight. That is my RP,. that is my game.