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S+V- 8 HM Progression Ranking


Iggyemu's Avatar


Iggyemu
04.10.2013 , 11:51 PM | #11
No dispute bro. You guys are first. And gratz again on that.

I think Mae is just considering the future Nightmare stuff. If this tracking goes well and everyone is in agreement we'll continue on with it. If not we'll leave it up to someone else to give it a shot.
SuckaFish on The Bastion (Empire)
Tigg: Sorcerer (Corruption)
Officer/Raid Leader

http://suckafish.enjin.com/

Iworet's Avatar


Iworet
04.10.2013 , 11:58 PM | #12
Didn't want to sound aggresive

My english isn't the best, so maybe my words and 'intonation' aren't the best/right ones

Thanks for your work with tracking and validating all the kills. My kudos to you =) I would like to see it again with Asation NiM!

odawgg's Avatar


odawgg
04.11.2013 , 12:06 AM | #13
Gratz to Revenge on World 1st!

Hopefully we can give ya a better run for ur money going forward Damn reward bug nipped us in the butt

Krazy_Karl's Avatar


Krazy_Karl
04.11.2013 , 12:08 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by maebeebuzz View Post
From the first boss to the last, speed of clear should mean something.
This is the most insane thing I have heard coming from anyone in the progression threads thus far. How about we also asterisk guilds who practiced on the PTS versus going in blind (because it's more fun this way)? Or how about incorporating gear rating (since clearing with lower rating gear is more difficult)? Or hell, how about basing it on class usage (like it would be more impressive if no Sentinels were used)?

You sir should accept that you were not first, or even second and not attempt to devalue the achievements and skill of the players who are better than you.

Regards,
KK
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. - Yoda

ancksunamur's Avatar


ancksunamur
04.11.2013 , 12:18 AM | #15
Hey man, no disputing, 1st is 1st period, I don't care if you were in there non stop for 2 days straight, to Revenge and Unleash Fantastic Job. Hopefully we can keep up with you come TFB NiM
HMFiC of SuckaFish - Empire (The Bastion)

http://SuckaFish.enjin.com
50 Powertech: Donn

Iggyemu's Avatar


Iggyemu
04.11.2013 , 12:24 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Krazy_Karl View Post
This is the most insane thing I have heard coming from anyone in the progression threads thus far. How about we also asterisk guilds who practiced on the PTS versus going in blind (because it's more fun this way)? Or how about incorporating gear rating (since clearing with lower rating gear is more difficult)? Or hell, how about basing it on class usage (like it would be more impressive if no Sentinels were used)?

You sir should accept that you were not first, or even second and not attempt to devalue the achievements and skill of the players who are better than you.

Regards,
KK
Easy there buddy. Nobody is devaluing anything. But in your rant you are devaluing our achievement. Don't do that.

What Mae said was something brought up as part of the discussion of how we can tweak the spreadsheet. At the end of the day there is no official way of tracking progression with this game. It's just up to we that care on how we track it. That''s all we are discussing. We aren't changing anything from the way it is now for S&V HM. If we make changes it'll be before the Nightmare stuff. And we'll discuss it with every guild that cares to ensure there is a consensus.
SuckaFish on The Bastion (Empire)
Tigg: Sorcerer (Corruption)
Officer/Raid Leader

http://suckafish.enjin.com/

maebeebuzz's Avatar


maebeebuzz
04.11.2013 , 12:39 AM | #17
Wasn't trying to take value away from anything, you guys have world first in our eyes. We're just looking at ways to make the process better in the future. 16man thread has them discussing the same types of things, and they actually implemented a diminishing point for kills times.
Aspiring Casual
Back on the Bastion

Messiaah's Avatar


Messiaah
04.11.2013 , 12:55 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by maebeebuzz View Post
Updated, grats on the clears.


Phebus and I are talking about some way to incorporate clear time into this going forward. From the first boss to the last, speed of clear should mean something. For the top 3 we're looking at:

Revenge : 27 hours, 26 minutes
Unleashed: 23 hours, 59 minutes
Suckafish: 3 hours, 23 minutes
9. 4.

we leveled up and entered hm but we get dashrood on story mode, no adds low live but it displayed hardmode when i checked the phase, we thought it was just a bug which displayed the wrong mode and decided to take him down, after that we were not able to reset the operation and we were not able to get into hardmode, no matter if the hardmode was chosen or not. we ended in story all the time, sometimes some of us managed to get into hm while some ppl get into sm at the same time and oparations group we saw them on the minimap but they were in another phase. so we had to do story and hoped to be able to enter hardmode if we cleared the ops on story. but it still wasn't possible to get into hardmode. we tried everything to get in for hours. after that, we did tfb hm to get some gear at least.

10.4 Server restart

we managed to get in hardmode and started progression.

dash'rood 5 pulls
titan 6 3 pulls
thrasher 2 pulls
operations chief 1 pull
olok 2 pulls
cartel lords 1 pull
styrak 11 pulls

we had some breaks which were not planned but unavoidable. after we knew revenge got styrak down and there was no point to be stressed, since serverfirst was done already, we did tfb story to get some extra gear.

our setup was: 2 pt tank, 1 pt dps, 1 sniper, 1 marauder, 1 merc dps, 1 merc heal, 1 sorc heal.

thats our story, but that doesn't mean that speed of clear means anything. firstkill is firstkill, revenge earned it and it's not their fault that we had this phase issues. we had the option to go straight into tfb hm to gear up and we decided to keep trying to get into SnV hm, that was our bad and that's why we didn't earn the firstkill.

what really means something is the point in time. your guild points have to be related to the kill time and not only to the kill order because at different times you have different circumstances e.g. commendations through dailies, weeklys or even the time to farm gear in flash points.
e.g. our tfb 16 man progression: we went for 8man at the first week, cleared it and went for 16man at the second week, also cleared it. because a lot guilds cleared the easy bosses in the first week, we get very few points for them, and some of this guilds defeated the last boss weeks later and get a better rank than we did, while having more time for gearing, farming comms etc.

your system really needs a decay by time to become a fair system. just take a look at wowprogress.com

Quote:
How does the Guild Ranking work?

WoWProgress pulls Guild and Character information from the official Battle.net API and transforms it into Guild Bosskills with date/time attached.

Guild Bosskills define guild progression. In general, the faster you progress, the higher rank you get.

Each boss has a maximal score attached.

World first gets maximal score, next kills score determined based on time interval between the kill and the world first kill plus a constant (constant = nominal score / 2). Boss kills after 180 days grant only constant amount of points.

Guild rank may depend not only on score. Important encounters (milestones) can make guild rank higher regardless of score points.
Guildlead - Seven Stuck
Kereg - Juggernaut Tank
Recruitment: open

Krazy_Karl's Avatar


Krazy_Karl
04.11.2013 , 01:46 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by maebeebuzz View Post
Wasn't trying to take value away from anything
By attempting to implement a policy which favors yourselves in a ranking system, you are in turn devaluing the others. It is as simple as that. You are now trying to frame it such that you don't seem biased by referencing an unrelated thread. Time of clear from start to finish is largely irrelevant. The only thing that matters is the actual time of each individual kill, and a decay over time value.

But you inserting your foot into your mouth is at the very least entertaining.

Also, there are many more than three guilds that have already cleared much of the S&V 8-Man HM operation, they are just not participating in this particular e-peen waving contest.

Regards,
KK
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. - Yoda

Messiaah's Avatar


Messiaah
04.11.2013 , 01:58 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Krazy_Karl View Post
By attempting to implement a policy which favors yourselves in a ranking system, you are in turn devaluing the others. It is as simple as that. You are now trying to frame it such that you don't seem biased by referencing an unrelated thread. Time of clear from start to finish is largely irrelevant. The only thing that matters is the actual time of each individual kill, and a decay over time value.

But you inserting your foot into your mouth is at the very least entertaining.

Also, there are many more than three guilds that have already cleared much of the S&V 8-Man HM operation, they are just not participating in this particular e-peen waving contest.

Regards,
KK
What is your problem? If u are not interested in e-peen, why are you reading that and try to pick a fight with this guys? They spend their time to provide a ranking for those who are interested. And if you would have any clue you would recognize that there was no attempt to get favored, it's just about bringing a time based factor into the system which makes absolutely sense. So do us a favor and either help to find a better system or remain quiet.
Guildlead - Seven Stuck
Kereg - Juggernaut Tank
Recruitment: open