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EC Kephass NiM 8 Man - Mechanics Questions

Chickensevil's Avatar


Chickensevil
04.02.2013 , 01:00 PM | #1
So, I know many guilds have done this fight and here we are finally getting around to doing him on NiM mode 8 man (would have been there sooner and at 16 Man, but had a lot of people getting burnt out from the content and leaving the game). Anyway, we are trying to sort through phase 2 when you get all the trandoshians spawning up and there is something weird we found out with the aggro tables that maybe someone else can shed some light into this.

It has to do with where they run to when they initially spawn up. What we have found out at least to some degree, is that the tank with the highest threat coming into that phase (after attacking the warstalker) gets the initial aggro on the regular adds, and the person with the second highest threat gets the aggro with the Warriors.

The problem comes from this being largely speculation and a lack of threat meter in the game to confirm exactly what is happening. We have managed to get the adds (without the assistance of a taunt) to always go to tank A with the regular mobs and tank B with the warriors. The problem then comes with the subsequent add spawns, which we have only been able to, with some varying degree, ensure the adds start with the correct initial aggro where they are supposed to.

Anyone else notice this with the initial aggro of the adds and if so, has anyone else done any testing to sort out where they run to and what causes them to run where they go?
Quote:
First man says to the second man: Why are you hitting your head against the wall over and over?
Second man responds: Because it feels so good when I stop
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tahoeWolverine's Avatar


tahoeWolverine
04.02.2013 , 03:53 PM | #2
I know a lot groups have 1 tank guard the other tank to ensure that the trenchgutters go to him. I know that a lot of groups have experienced the warriors running to the healers when they spawn. I personally have noticed that proximity can play a part, and that a tank ~ 30 meters away from the spawn will generally not have anything initially aggro'd, but if you hang around closer to the spawn you can get some aggro. To this point, the only way I've gotten kills is to make tweaks specifically based on the raid comp AND the way that the aggro generally works. It's very difficult to attempt to use a strategy others use if your comp or aggro aren't working the same way.

Personally, as a tank, I hope that bioware really moves away from encounters where targets magically appear and then immediately start wailing on people. Having to pull the needle (warrior/shield) out of the haystack on those packs was not a very fun gameplay experience for several weeks.
DrGordon - Chosen - Prophecy of the Five

atschai's Avatar


atschai
04.02.2013 , 04:46 PM | #3
Yes, trenchcutters seem to go to the raid member with the highest threat, however with the warriors I'm not so sure. They seem to be spawning with a "clean slate" meaning their aggro table starts filling once they spawn. They usually aggro healers or anyone that damages them, as they take some time to make up their mind to whom they run. We usually have 2 tanks tanking the trandoshans and the warriors still go the opposite direction towards a healer when spawning. Just be sure to aggro them as quick as possible to prevent that.

Aurojiin's Avatar


Aurojiin
04.02.2013 , 04:59 PM | #4
IIRC, Trenchcutters spawn with 100 threat on the tanks, while Warriors spawn with 200 threat. However (and this is most likely deliberate) Trenchcutters do not respond to heal threat, while Warriors do. Having one tank guard the other ensures that the Trenchcutters will always run to the same person. When the first pack spawns, have one healer do about 4k healing (in other words, don't have everyone at full health) and you can pull the packs apart. After that, the sustained healing required will naturally split the packs as they spawn in.

We place the highest AOE threat tank with three DPS behind the walker, and both healers, the guarded tank, and our highest single-target DPS out the front.
Aisev -:- Seer Sage Si'ki -:- Darkness Assassin

Chickensevil's Avatar


Chickensevil
04.02.2013 , 06:16 PM | #5
Thanks for the responses guys.

Yeah, that is currently where we are at is our AOE tank (assassin) is guarding our single target tank (jugg). The only issue, we were having some instances where one or two transdosians would run over to the tank, and occassionally getting a warrior in with the AOE pack. It was frustraiting the crap out of us.

Nevermind that without guard on myself (powertech) and another dps (also powertech), as soon as we open with our aoe we are ripping threat pretty fast and healers are having trouble keeping up. I think we have mostly worked through that, to not rip aggro, I just want to make sure we are doing the transdosians right.

With your responses it seems like we are on the right path... just going to take a bit more tweaking to get it where we need to.

I also agree, this is by far the WORST mechanic they have done. BW take note... dont do another fight like this... cause it is just frustraiting and confusing... this is why it is so hard... not because it is understanbly difficult... it is a weak mechanic which seems to have a ton of unknown elements to it.
Quote:
First man says to the second man: Why are you hitting your head against the wall over and over?
Second man responds: Because it feels so good when I stop
Zetliam - Empire - Bounty Hunter - Pot5
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PariahMessiah's Avatar


PariahMessiah
04.03.2013 , 06:29 PM | #6
I'd be curious to hear the "intended" method by the devs for doing this fight since it becomes moot next week.

Double points for a vid of the developers doing it with the "lower" classes for each role commando/merc healers, vanguard/pt tanks (worst CDs of the 3), scoundrel/op /shadow/sin sage/sorc DPS, means no armor debuffs no scramble field no LOLNOFORCESHROUD and no bloodthirst.

Olostur's Avatar


Olostur
04.04.2013 , 01:15 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by PariahMessiah View Post
I'd be curious to hear the "intended" method by the devs for doing this fight since it becomes moot next week.

Double points for a vid of the developers doing it with the "lower" classes for each role commando/merc healers, vanguard/pt tanks (worst CDs of the 3), scoundrel/op /shadow/sin sage/sorc DPS, means no armor debuffs no scramble field no LOLNOFORCESHROUD and no bloodthirst.
Here is an old video of our first kill. You see one of the tanks is a vanguard. While we don't have any of the DPS classes you mentioned, our focus guard was accidentally in Soresu stance the entire fight (look closely and you can catch it when he gets healed). Since then we have done it with a sage DPS no problem.
~ Darth Decimal ~

gunte's Avatar


gunte
04.04.2013 , 02:51 AM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by PariahMessiah View Post
I'd be curious to hear the "intended" method by the devs for doing this fight since it becomes moot next week.

Double points for a vid of the developers doing it with the "lower" classes for each role commando/merc healers, vanguard/pt tanks (worst CDs of the 3), scoundrel/op /shadow/sin sage/sorc DPS, means no armor debuffs no scramble field no LOLNOFORCESHROUD and no bloodthirst.
You are really not on the right path if you think commandos are the worst healers for this fight and vanguards the worst tanks, the easiest time 've ever had doing this fight was healing on my commando alt with another commando healer and both the tanks were vanguards. As far as DPS goes, well done it with one shadow and sage DPS in the group at the same time.

As far as sticking to the topic, a lot of groups prefer having two melee dps take the warriors out each time they spawn (preferably sentinels but i've seen vanguards and i think a shadow do it as well). That's the way we do it as we normally have two sentinels in the group.
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