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Are you prepared for 2.0? You still have 2 weeks to roll a sniper/slinger

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Are you prepared for 2.0? You still have 2 weeks to roll a sniper/slinger

Laforet's Avatar


Laforet
03.24.2013 , 03:05 PM | #51
Quote: Originally Posted by Jherad View Post
Macro has been reposting that for many, many months. I'm sure BW has seen it.

Some of us (myself included) think he's probably at least partially right, some don't. Either way, nothing will change. If he's wrong, BW shrugs - something else was to blame for the mindboggling balance changes.

If he's right however, and despite his pointing out the flaws, BW have continued to rely heavily on this methodology for so long, then they are utterly wedded to it. Their stat analysis has become such a sacred cow, that no matter how many people poke wide gaping holes in it, nothing will change.
He is at least 70% right man, we know that. Another thing we could add to his reasoning is that BW "confounds" single target DPS and AoE DPS.

Example? Well, a lot of people /bow to sages being "best healers in PvP high HPS bro", but forgot that a lot of the sages HPS comes from salvation, with is an PvE AoE splash spell. That severely cripples us for PvP because we look good in the numbers game but thats splash heals not counter burst heals, and we know how dominant the balance between burst / counter burst in PvP is.

Example 2. Smash.

They also seem to account for "raw" HPS / DPS numbers, not taking into account DMG taken / kills death ratio or damage per death ratio. If they did this they would see some classes are getting the shaft, merc is one of them.

They also, for some obscure reason, think that off heals are incredibly powerfull and taunts are not. Which is basically a flipside. Taunts are instant and cost almost ZERO resources while off-heals are neat but the DPS actually needs to stop and cast them, while also costing a severe chunk on resources.
Believer - Seer - Fatman - RETIRED

Glower's Avatar


Glower
03.24.2013 , 04:22 PM | #52
Quote: Originally Posted by Macroeconomics View Post
Nope, that's now how class rebalancing works in ToR. BW bases their class rebalancing on which class is performing best ingame. And "best" is defined using their extensive ingame stat collection system. Which is to say it is using meta average comparisons. So when a class becomes FotM, what you see is a horde of undergeared players still learning to play the class surge into warzones. This actually reduces the meta average productivity of the class and this results in BW buffing that class. This is why snipers are being buffed in 2.0. And that is why they will be further buffed in 2.1. Count on it.

In contrast unpopular classes such as Merc dps and Anni Mara will continue to be nerfed. Once a class gets it's first nerf, certain players leave that class. And the first to do so are the lower performing ones. The better players who can remain viable with the class tend to stay. Thus subclasses that get nerfed actually see their meta average productivity RISE. Which leads to them being nerfed again. This is what happened to operative dps in 1.1 and 1.2. This is what happened to Merc dps multiple times since 1.2. This is what has happened to Anni Mara. And this is what is going to happen in a big way to PT Pyro.

The bottom line here is that BW's ingame stat collection system is unable to account for player migration and shifts in player quality within a class. This has resulted in the puzzling class rebalancing choices that BW has made. But that is how class balance is managed in ToR.
wow
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Rabios's Avatar


Rabios
03.24.2013 , 09:50 PM | #53
my shadow is gonna own all these snipers , just because they have high dps and scare players off doesn't mean they don't have their niche and cant be defeated, .

People need to find their role on the field and stick

biowareftw's Avatar


biowareftw
03.24.2013 , 11:28 PM | #54
Quote: Originally Posted by Rabios View Post
my shadow is gonna own all these snipers , just because they have high dps and scare players off doesn't mean they don't have their niche and cant be defeated, .

People need to find their role on the field and stick
You are doing more in rated then solo guarding a node on a hybrid spec with a shadow? Or are you talking about unranked?

As a shadow my role in the field is sitting on a node, 3 v 1 people after I sap them, call for a floater. You can kill a sniper as a hybrid...but it is gonna take awhile , and that isn't your "role".
Einstein's relativity work is a magnificent mathematical garb which fascinates, dazzles and makes people blind to the underlying errors. The theory is like a beggar clothed in purple whom ignorant people take for a king... its exponents are brilliant men but they are metaphysicists rather than scientists.- Nikola Tesla - New York Times (11 July 1935)

Z-ToXiN's Avatar


Z-ToXiN
03.25.2013 , 02:48 AM | #55
Quote: Originally Posted by biowareftw View Post
You are doing more in rated then solo guarding a node on a hybrid spec with a shadow? Or are you talking about unranked?

As a shadow my role in the field is sitting on a node, 3 v 1 people after I sap them, call for a floater. You can kill a sniper as a hybrid...but it is gonna take awhile , and that isn't your "role".
Boy do I know that. Hate how sins get pigeonholed into that role where you sit around doing nothing most of the time. Like a soccer goalie. Has its fun moments but mostly standing around doing nothing. Would love to do main tank as sin rateds, worked well the few times I tried it though admittedly that wasnt against the top teams.

/reroll

- former professional node guard

And on topic: Sniper is my 2nd least favorite class to play, after Operative. No thanks.
ADRAAJ SHI'KARI ARRIAN
◙ASSASSiN ╚╬╝ THE BASTION ╚╬╝ POWeRTeCH◙
DECEPTiON HYBRID < ♣ > HYBRID SiN TANK
<JAWA BUNNY RANCH> // <CLiCKERS>

Marrio's Avatar


Marrio
03.25.2013 , 04:04 AM | #56
Quote: Originally Posted by biowareftw View Post
You are doing more in rated then solo guarding a node on a hybrid spec with a shadow? Or are you talking about unranked?

As a shadow my role in the field is sitting on a node, 3 v 1 people after I sap them, call for a floater. You can kill a sniper as a hybrid...but it is gonna take awhile , and that isn't your "role".
Snipers were fine in PTS rateds. Stacking PTs and smashers still work fine, watch the rateds from MVP and Nostrum's streams, derp.
Luiigi - Vanguard (Harbinger)
Luigi'stank - Operative (Harbinger)

BambulaGTS's Avatar


BambulaGTS
03.25.2013 , 04:32 AM | #57
Another ****** - witty guide.

Do not use cover bar, cause you won't know cooldowns on the abilities on cover bar when you are not in cover.

Carnage marauder and marksman sniper are the same design, given sniper generaly designed to have more uptime. If carnage marauder has at least same uptime as marksman sniper, he will do considerably more damage.

Roll a sniper, roll a whatever. If you bad with everything and think rolling class Y suddenly will make you not bad, it won't help you.

mattycutts's Avatar


mattycutts
03.25.2013 , 06:42 AM | #58
Ive been playing my sniper since day one, and i also have a lowbie sniper for some fun.

Now in lowbie ive come across some of these new snipers and OMG they are seriously free kills. A descent sniper has to leanr alot, every single ability more or less is needed to be a top sniper.

Those that have every single class more or less now rolling a sniper, u seriously think they going to be as good as them that play sniper every day more or less since day one lol

Making posts like this is going to cause more to actually roll what they think is a fotm class just like when smash anti posts started so now u going to have x amount of gimped snipers running around that havnt got a bloody clue since it actually takes skill to be a good sniper.

and as pointed out having to many snipers in a group is a group gimp. I hate pug games where theres loads of snipers an dno melee means we going to get slaughtered. although most fun game of huttball i ever had was two teams of mostly snipers, finished 0-0 anyone approached ball died lol
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MotorCityMan's Avatar


MotorCityMan
03.25.2013 , 07:23 AM | #59
2.0 is so unfair to me. Let fear and panic rule. The end.

cashogy_reborn's Avatar


cashogy_reborn
03.25.2013 , 07:55 AM | #60
Quote: Originally Posted by BambulaGTS View Post

Roll a sniper, roll a whatever. If you bad with everything and think rolling class Y suddenly will make you not bad, it won't help you.
this.
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