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Vanguard players it is time to stand up and be heard!

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Vanguard / Powertech
Vanguard players it is time to stand up and be heard!

GostGajol's Avatar


GostGajol
03.16.2013 , 02:18 PM | #1
Dear Vanguards I made a simliar post on the PT forum and I've been asked to post this here aswell as it concerns both classes. In this fight let us unite and let our voices be heard, lets send the message that we will not go quietly into the night!


My fellow Vanguards

Vanguards are getting screwed in the 2.0 patch unless people act
Question is, do Vanguards stand up for their right to fight??
I SAY HELL YES! ITS TIME TO BUMB THE THREADS!

Get to the test forums - read up on the following 4 posts!


VANGUARD PLAYERS WE NEED YOUR VOICE TO BE HEARD OR WE WILL ALL BE STUCK WITH A USELESS CLASS IN PATCH 2.0! - EVEN IF YOU HAVE NOTHING TO ADD GO BUMB THE THREAD TO THE TOP WE MUST BE HEARD!


/Gajol
I'm too old for heroic internet kids aka. board warriors!


Grimoir's Avatar


Grimoir
03.16.2013 , 02:26 PM | #2
Not that it'll do much good, but I'd like to echo the complaint in the thread and chime in on the consensus that these nerfs were, for the most part, unwarranted.

I have played Terminal Velocity(AP/Pyro Hybrid) going on 10 months now, and although its not exactly what elitists would call "competitive," it happens to be a very fun spec and much more entertaining than pure Pyro, at least in my opinion.

2.0 patch hits the PTS: Everyone starts playing TV. With the changes to the trees and the extra talent points, we're able to pick up Steely Resolve for an overall Aim increase, and Firebug/Assault Trooper for a massive DPS increase to the main focus of the hybrid: Railshot/High-Impact Bolt. After some testing, it was widely considered to be the absolute BEST DPS on the test realm, putting out significantly higher DPS than anything but Smash-monkeys and Sniper/Gunslingers.

Now fast-forward to the patch on the 14th: EA/BW guts(see what I did there?) Terminal Velocity. With the numbers they were putting out on the PTS, I can understand this to a certain degree. But honestly, how hard could it have been to just push Firebug further up in the tree to put TV closer to where it is on live? It isn't OP on live at all, so why not allow it to exist, but limit its players to being able to take either SR or Firebug/Assault Trooper? I really hate to see hybrids across the board being neutered like this because it truly limits the choices that players are able to make. Not much balancing has to be done if hybrids are always slightly below the full trees in capability. Trust your players and adjust things with a lighter touch on a case-to-case basis(I'm looking at you, hybrid Assassins >.>), rather than pulverizing anything existing outside of the norm with the nerf-bat.

So not only that, but they decided to wreck the AP/Tactics tree too. All that had to happen to shut down TV really, was to attach the CG/CT proc to HEGC/HEC. They absolutely could have stopped right there and things would've almost been balanced, but did they? Nope. They decided that the full AP/Tactics tree was doing too much damage, so they hit not only the already mediocre stats for the HE stance, but one of the main sources of damage for the tree by removing the crit damage on FB/IP, made it so CG/CT would proc more reliably but less often, and reduced crit chance even more. To top it off, there are no buffs whatsoever to speak of to make up for this atrocious assault on the already sub-par tree that is AP/Tactics.

Although I may just be repeating suggestions made by other players in this thread, among others, it can't hurt to reinforce the positive feedback and suggestions for keeping us all happy. Here is what I think should be done as an alternative to the nerfs introduced with the March 14th patch:

Spoiler


Overall, these are my thoughts on the changes. It would be REALLY nice to get some Dev feedback on these recent changes so we know what their plan is for adjusting both of the PT/VG DPS specs. Honestly, I'm starting to think that these nerfs are a psychological test in that they will revert them later to make people think that AP/Tactics was just fine all along.

EDIT: Posting this in every relevant thread to get more attention from the Devs. Also a bump for you Gajol =)
~The Jykoor Legacy of The Bastion(PvP)~
Anasė - Terminal Velocity[Hybrid] Powertech - Level: 55
Jerīcho - Tactics Vanguard - Level: 55

sinfulace's Avatar


sinfulace
03.17.2013 , 11:28 AM | #3
vanguard is fine. keep crying that you can do 20k dmg in 5 seconds with all insta casts.

ChaoticDynamite's Avatar


ChaoticDynamite
03.17.2013 , 08:23 PM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by sinfulace View Post
vanguard is fine. keep crying that you can do 20k dmg in 5 seconds with all insta casts.
/sigh
If theres one thing SWTOR taught me about PvP is don't hope don't ever hope just start building up your tolerance level.

ScytheEleven's Avatar


ScytheEleven
03.19.2013 , 08:01 AM | #5
I am shamelessly promoting my own thread, but I think I made some good points on what changes need to be made to AP/Tactics. Please check it out

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=612588

ubermouth's Avatar


ubermouth
03.19.2013 , 08:07 AM | #6
So many people complain about class differences when they could ameliorate those differences by getting their skills up, gear up. With near equal gear and skill, you should be able to hang in any duel.
This great game comminity would benefit from an increase in skill in the player base more than utter control for equality.

Zoom_VI's Avatar


Zoom_VI
03.25.2013 , 09:12 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by ubermouth View Post
So many people complain about class differences when they could ameliorate those differences by getting their skills up, gear up. With near equal gear and skill, you should be able to hang in any duel.
This great game comminity would benefit from an increase in skill in the player base more than utter control for equality.
As a min/maxed EWH shield spec vanguard I still lose every 1v1 with anything other than a juggernaut or PT tank. mechanics>skill
Crinn
Trooper Hunter

If you fail, fail dramatically. At least you will prove the error of your tactics to your successors
- Scott Westerfeld, The Killing of Worlds

planet_J's Avatar


planet_J
03.26.2013 , 09:43 AM | #8
They decreased your inherent crit chance, but buffed the crit chance you gain from stats...see how they did that...take with one hand and give with the other...

That's "balance"

They are also buffing tracer missle/grav round

Is it crappy that TD/AP will now have some DoT? Sure...but Pyro/Assault was pretty OP in PVP anyway...it's not like you guys are losing out on much...in PVE your damage will still be fine, in PVP it levels the playing field a little.

Essentially...where they took something from you...they gave something back. You no longer have to stack your mechanic for additional damage (1 application is enough...that's a buff)...and additionally...that mechanic will also now provide 20% armor pen...which you didn't have before (that's a buff).
Republic Paragons/Paragons of the Empire:
http://republicparagons.guildlaunch.com
To contact in game find Hagimond or Zutharan Republic side for Imperial Side contact Gyrok or Peregrin-Noir

AdamChattaway's Avatar


AdamChattaway
03.26.2013 , 10:57 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by planet_J View Post
They decreased your inherent crit chance, but buffed the crit chance you gain from stats...see how they did that...take with one hand and give with the other...

That's "balance"

They are also buffing tracer missle/grav round

Is it crappy that TD/AP will now have some DoT? Sure...but Pyro/Assault was pretty OP in PVP anyway...it's not like you guys are losing out on much...in PVE your damage will still be fine, in PVP it levels the playing field a little.

Essentially...where they took something from you...they gave something back. You no longer have to stack your mechanic for additional damage (1 application is enough...that's a buff)...and additionally...that mechanic will also now provide 20% armor pen...which you didn't have before (that's a buff).
Smash juggers in pvp kill my higher lv vanguard before i can even react, leap, smash, push, leap, hit hit smash dead... literally before i can do anything, how is this fair? great i will now do 1% dmg instead of 2% dmg int he 0.5 seconds of life i have, why are they not nerfed?
Jedi Guardian
Alignment: Light Side
Server: The Red Eclipse

unluckyperson's Avatar


unluckyperson
03.26.2013 , 11:04 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Zoom_VI View Post
As a min/maxed EWH shield spec vanguard I still lose every 1v1 with anything other than a juggernaut or PT tank. mechanics>skill
It is definitely mechanics. We rely on our shields as our greatest protection but in PvP that's garbage critical hits override shield activation so we never get shields up whenever we're critted.

The moment I stopped tanking in PvP was when I was in almost full WH with 3 EWH pieces (had a little over 18k hp) and a powertech stunned me (my break stun was on CD) and the guy critted for 6k, two times on some channel attack and then hit me with a couple hits afterwards and I was dead, in the span of about 4 seconds. Thinking back I'm almost positive this guy was running a Advanced Prototype/Tactics build (either full or hybrid) and that I was hit by the powertech equivalent of a fully charged pulse cannon.

Skill or not we just don't have the defenses to actually mitigate damage in PvP the way other tanks do.