Stop forcing PVP on PVE servers

Stow your condescension and judgementalism. The selfishness only exists in the actions of PvP players when they are preying upon players who they are perfectly aware are trying to avoid PvP. The solution of quarantining the PvP features of SWToR to the PvP servers is a direct solution-response to the completely unacceptable behavior of players engaing in PvP that violates the standards of conduct already set forth for the game.

I am not even a little bit selfish, I realized when I made the suggestion what kind of fracture such a change would create in the player base, and I've continued thinking about that since posting the suggestion. There is more than one way to address this effect the solution would have:
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• re-label the current PvE servers as "PvE/PvP" servers, and change the entire solution to be: create a new variant of server that is a truly PvE-only server and is labeled a PvE server. Not only would this not be disruptive to the current player base, it would give absolutely everyone more options in the game if they ever decide they want something drastically different. The only people that would be compelled to leave their server are the people that dislike PvP so much that they're willing to start over in a completely new community with mostly unknown players, just to avoid the influence PvP has over the gaming environment.
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• Provide PvE servers with a Preferences setting to disable PvP permanently, which when checked would FOREVER prevent the player from ever becoming flagged for PvP. I would think this is the simplest and most elegant solution, and would result in at least peace-of-mind for PvE players. Not that PvP players wouldn't still have dramatic ways to grief PvE players as they go about PvE missions in locations around the galaxy... but at least then PvE players could group for PvE missions, and use AOE attacks/AOE heals and not have to worry about anything whatsoever about PvP players of either faction tromping through the area.
  
  Naturally, this solution has numerous implications for gameplay, for example players not being able to heal group members that accidentally remained flagged when they joined an Ops group... but simple solutions to these problems (for example a way to quickly and fairly de-flag) could be also put in place.
  
  Excellent would be to add this checkbox setting, and when PvP is disabled, a few new titles are enabled on the character sheet, such as "Guardian of Peace", "War Protester", "Defender of Peace", or "Conservator of the Treaty of Coruscant". It would make sense to require a 7-day wait time for a character to activate or de-activate PvP via this setting.

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I would miss a lot of the people on my Friends list and others if I were to leave for a strict PvE-only server, but I would likely transfer every one of my characters to such a server the very first day it became available. I would even gladly pay a higher monthly fee to play on that server instead of any server where PvP is enabled. Peace of mind is priceless...

I don't know for sure at this point whether I would prefer the completely new server type that is strictly PvE-only over just a simple checkbox setting to prevent myself from ever being flagged for PvP. Both are extremely amazing possiblites for SWToR that would make my time in-game FAR more enjoyable. BioWare could actually implement both solutions, and it would make the most number of PvE players happy.

There's an additional solution that would involve going ahead and removing all PvP features from the current PvE servers, then making the current PvP servers some sort of hybrid version of server where players aren't always flagged for PvP. I'm not sure exactly what logistics would be interesting, especially since I've never set foot on the PvP servers, but perhaps it would involve them flagging OUT of PvP instead of flagging in, and maybe there would be certain regions on planets that weren't forced-PvP areas.

But don't mistake these solutions for a blanket solution to fix all that is unfair for PvE players; there is still the issue of Event missions that require PvP flagging needing to have a way to complete without flagging at all... so that PvE players can remain unflagged and still have the same daily Trophy-earning potential as players who choose to PvP.

The civil rights of PvE players ...

You use the word heartless quite carelessly and are ignoring the part where this solution is only a suggestion for how to protect against the truly heartless behavior of PvP zealots towards PvE players who do not wish to ever PvP.

Have you even considered, when a PvP player stalks PvE players looking for a chance to get them flagged and defeat them in combat as they try to run to safety, that the victim might be extremely young (4 years old?), or much older (80 years old?), or may have a psychological or physiological condition, and could be genuinely and severely traumatized by the experience, and possibly could even be imperiled by the experience of being preyed upon and suddenly attacked? The only thing heartless I see here is the PvP predators, coupled with yours and others' lack of consideration for other players' basic well-being. Players in the game have a right to be provided with a safe-haven from the senseless PvP activity that goes on in-game. Which is exactly why I suggested removing all PvP features from the game for PvE servers.

I've already originated yet another idea of how to improve the game, so you'll need to reference my other recent post to understand that you are mis-reacting to the suggestion. And I beseech you, at least TRY to orginate ideas of your own of how to improve the game, instead of pretending as if there is not a problem to be solved.

And just so you understand, the idea of removing all PvP features from the PvE servers I think is a good one. Though I don't think it should be implemented without also creating new sets of hybrid "PvE/PvP" servers that function identically to current PvE servers. PvP is the offending feature; it's used every day to victimize players in-game, it should be the feature that people have to switch-servers to get back to. I'm more than certain that many people would prefer the solution of creating new strictly-PvE-only servers and force the PvE players (who want to avoid ever being victimized again in-game) to be the people who have to abandon their server.

The civil rights of PvE players ...

Dude!! Enough already! As was pointed out earlier you are getting a little out of control with your personal attacks. You've stated your opinion....A LOT. We get it you want no part in PvP. Unfortunately for you the majority of people would prefer to have it. Be it because they would like the option to PvP when they want, or because making a stupid decision to remove all PvP aspects from a server would leave the server with a handful of people such as yourself. The event is over and what started out as a valid opinion from the OP has turned into 1 person terrorizing every other persons posts with his ranting.

I'm unsubscribing this thread because every time I look at it I feel less intelligent! Peace out and good luck all!

Your examples of who might possibly be "harmed" by a PvP encounter are so over the top you make a mockery of yourself. Honestly, a 4 year old? Anyone that delicate should not be participating in such an overly "stressful" pastime. Also your vilification of all PvP players over the actions of a few is dishonest.

I and others in this thread have suggested the only solution that needs to be enacted. Removing the autoflag triggers will prevent anyone from being autoflagged to PvP status against their will. At that point the only way they can go PvP is to willingly choose to do so.

"If I state my opinion loud enough and loud enough, it becomes fact" is what I am seeing here.

You can't possibly believe that's an unlikely scenario, and why do you think I used the very clear words such as "might", "may", "could", "possibly" ? You just want to continue arguing and continue being dismissive of the rights of other players. And no one will stop new ideas from being stated on the forums... even if it's ideas that would take away something from the game that would be missed by some players. And fabricating the idea that I'm somehow vilifying all PvP players when I've been completely clear in my opinion? Reprehensible. You are most certainly out of control and abusive with your over-reactions to what are very clear, reasonable, and civil opinions.

You haven't figured it out yet, that the suggestion of fixing Events to that they are fair for strictly PvE-only players must stand. It's the entire reason this thread exists in the first place, in case you hadn't realized... the more you dismiss it as invalid, the more responses and criticism of your opinion that will show up here.

You really want to degenerate into personal attacks?

The purpose of this thread is to make sure that:

• the rights of PvE players are promoted in the Gree Event and other events so that they are not forced into PvP just to earn the same daily reward levels as players who do engage in PvP
• the rights of PvE players are protected in general, by maintaining awareness of the multiple ways in which exploits of the PvP system are being used to victimize PvE players in-game

I implore everyone, please stay on-topic... if you've reached your wit's end, and cannot remain civil... then stop posting here.

• Your premise that the so called rights of the PvE players in the gree event were violated is flawed and has no validity.
  
  
  Quote: Originally Posted by anonnn
• the rights of PvE players are protected in general, by maintaining awareness of the multiple ways in which exploits of the PvP system are being used to victimize PvE players in-game

OK. Here's my crude assessment of the situation:

I have a full set of War Hero and some Elite War Hero. To me, PvP warzones are fun exercises in teamwork, strategy, communication, and use of available resources. My main complaints about PvP as it stands currently:

1. We could use a couple new warzones. Denova and Alderaan are very similar, Voidstar is fun, the Gree Hypergate is quite pretty and a good challenge, and Huttball is innovative...but lacks strategy.
   
2. There NEEDS to be a better matchmaking system. As it stands, those who want to try PvP and get the recruit gear queue up and get smashed to bits by the team that REALLY ought to be in Ranked because they're a premade in Elite War Hero. I suppose the premade has a lot of fun with the lopsided match, but if there's no chance of winning on one side and no challenge for the other, it does the whole thing a massive disservice.

That being said, if Ilum was an attempt to get more players interested in PvP, they b*ggered it, big time. Here's the math per Dulfy's handy guide:

Daily questing with PvP quests: 4 minor Gree reputation tokens (270 rep apiece) and 3 medium (630 apiece). Total reputation = 2970

Daily questing without PvP quests: 3 minor Gree tokens (270 apiece) and 2 medium (630 apiece). Total Reputation = 2070

So, a player who does not want to go into the PvP area can only achieve 70% of the daily commendations. Given the event lasted only 14 days, a 30% reduction in commendations and reward adds up even more, since there is a limited time to grind for the special event gear.

Add this to the nasty little exploits the gankers, griefers, and assorted clowns were using in the PvE area to get PvE characters flagged and slaughter them for the lulz. This happened at least three times on Bergen (PvE server) for ops groups waiting for the World Bosses to respawn - a notorious Imperial guild decided it would be cool to use those exploits to ambush and destroy the patiently-waiting Ops group, then slaughter the World boss themselves to gain their jollies and treasure at everyone else's expense. This is in addition to all the other times smaller groups of players decided to exploit the bug, get people killed in the PvE area, and force the PvE player to start their quest all over while incurring some outrageous expense to repair their gear.

So, to those who like to say the PvE players were not being punished or forced into PvP, I call bantha sh*t.

Now, just to add to this? There wasn't a single reward for killing other players other then the bragging rights you had to your buddies for tricking an unsuspecting player into getting themselves flagged and pouncing them or sending someone back to base because they dared venture into the contested zone. Those who PvP for reasons other than the alleged fun of ruining someone else's day had no incentive. With the free for all format (a good idea on paper to address server imbalance), you ended up attacking your friends on accident. Nothing in that area was about goals like holding/taking a position, capturing an objective, working with a team, or achieving a goal. They were PvE quests in a PvP zone, and with the flagging bugs, the whole thing was a PvP zone anyway.

So, I'll say it was a crowning moment of awesome when the players realized that the whole free-for-all garbage wouldn't achieve the goal, or get anyone what they wanted, but cross-faction teamwork would. I saw Imperial and Republic players coorperating to do the heroic there (as it was far easier in the PvP area than the PvP one), I saw the orderly lines for the orb drop-off (with mortal enemy guilds enforcing a truce to make sure no shennanigans went down), and everyone coming out ahead.