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Tanking Stat Weights


Marb's Avatar


Marb
02.07.2013 , 11:13 AM | #91
I find myself using assault a lot? Like pretty much every time I have scream on cooldown, I need to put in an assult there to ensure I have enough rage for the next scream. I'm pretty sure I'm doing something wrong as I keep hearing the threat is better, but I don't see those results in my parses. The dps is better, but the TPS looks to be about the same. How much is "more" threat?

After the opener and smash and ravage go on cooldown I find myself going:

Sunder>Assault>Scream> Sunder>Assault>Impale> Sunder>Assault>Assault>

Here's a log to help see where I'm going wrong:
Spoiler
Zerkhan - Harbinger

sithgreyguard's Avatar


sithgreyguard
02.07.2013 , 01:59 PM | #92
Quote: Originally Posted by Kitru View Post
The actual threat generation and mitigation are lower as well. It's not just "lower damage, same threat and everything else"; the hybrid is generally considered superior mainly because it has generally been shown to *be* superior, as long as you've got the chops to play it.

Of course, all that said, full Defense *is* fully viable: you'll take *slightly* more damage and generate a fair bit less threat (which you can solve by taunt fluffing like most Guardians are forced to do anyway), but you'll still be fine.
i wouldnt mind trying out a hybrid build. anyone know of a really good one for juggernaut?

Kitru's Avatar


Kitru
02.07.2013 , 02:05 PM | #93
Quote: Originally Posted by sithgreyguard View Post
i wouldnt mind trying out a hybrid build. anyone know of a really good one for juggernaut?
This is what's become the "standard" hybrid tank spec. There are some variations upon it (some don't take Overhead Slash and instead take a second point in Swelling Winds; some take Stasis Mastery or Courage instead of Swelling Winds), but it's a difference of 1-2 points of allocation at most and there haven't been appreciable differences in performance discovered between them.
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dipstik's Avatar


dipstik
02.07.2013 , 05:09 PM | #94
Quote: Originally Posted by sankalp View Post
just to throw a spanner into the works.

1800 rating for assasins states

538 621 641 for def shield abs

I think 502 639 659 gives -0.09% damage taken. (-2 def aug +1 shield +1 abs augment)

Can someone confirm or deny this please.
i got 0.3415 for my numbers and 0.3416 for yours, where lower numbers are better.

> d90(dr):=1/(100)*(10 +6+15+ 30 * ( 1 - ( 1 - ( 0.01 / 0.3 ) )^( ( (dr+46) / 50 ) / 0.55 ) )):
> d100(dr):=1/(100)*(10 +6+5+ 30 * ( 1 - ( 1 - ( 0.01 / 0.3 ) )^( ( (dr+46) / 50 ) / 0.55 ) )):
> sh(shr):=1/(100)*(5+15+20+ 50 * ( 1 - ( 1 - ( 0.01 / 0.5 ) )^( ( shr / 50 ) / 0.32 ) )):
> ab(abr):=1/(100)*(20+4+50 * ( 1 - ( 1 - ( 0.01 / 0.5 ) )^( ( abr / 50 ) / 0.18 ) )):
> ac90 := .5;
> ac100 := .5;
> ac90*(1-d90(dr))*(1-sh(shr)*ab(abr))+ac100*(1-d100(dr))*(1-sh(shr)*ab(abr));

Ailie's Avatar


Ailie
02.19.2013 , 04:16 AM | #95
Nvm, I worked it all out, now I just need to find where I get these particular enhancements from
The Azure Wings of Dawn - Against All Odds
azurewingsofdawn.enjin.com

UberDuberSoldat's Avatar


UberDuberSoldat
02.20.2013 , 01:47 PM | #96
cool thread

now add expertise into the mix, mr wizard dipstik.

Endurance+Expertise differences can account for many different things when gearing for PvP, where you primarily stack defense over sh/ab (if you're a jug).

NotRonin's Avatar


NotRonin
02.20.2013 , 06:49 PM | #97
Patch note (Release candidate) for 2.0 is out : it seems you can now shield (but not dodge) any Kinetic/Energy attacks, even if they're tech or force. That would mean.. shield and absorb >> defense depending on the boss. This is going to be a mess for the tanking spreadsheet.

Kitru's Avatar


Kitru
02.20.2013 , 06:52 PM | #98
Quote: Originally Posted by NotRonin View Post
Patch note (Release candidate) for 2.0 is out : it seems you can now shield (but not dodge) any Kinetic/Energy attacks, even if they're tech or force. That would mean.. shield and absorb >> defense depending on the boss. This is going to be a mess for the tanking spreadsheet.
My hope would be that they're also going to include some degree of increased Resistance chance through Defense rating (either that or actually adding a new stat called Resist rating, which would be the best option, imo).
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joshuatalmadge's Avatar


joshuatalmadge
02.22.2013 , 11:39 AM | #99
Kitru, with 2.0 are you saying that S/A is now preferred over Defense for a jugg? Just wondered because my stats as a hybrid were

34% Defense
47 Shield/46% absorb

Now on PTS my defense is down to 19%???

Kitru's Avatar


Kitru
02.22.2013 , 03:03 PM | #100
Quote: Originally Posted by joshuatalmadge View Post
Kitru, with 2.0 are you saying that S/A is now preferred over Defense for a jugg?
Keep in mind the PTS is still a testing environment, and they changed both the DR curves *and* the itemization on gear as part of it. Also, you can't compare current performance in current end game gear to performance in the new end game gear because, right now, we're running at 5 tiers above entry level raiding gear; in RotHC, our 63s are going to *be* entry level raiding gear.

However, purely off of the mechanics, unless something is done to provide Defense with some effect against K/E F/T attacks to some extent, Shield and Absorb are going to be the, de facto, best tank stats because, while Defense only applies to M/R attacks, Shield and Absorb are going to apply against both M/R and F/T K/E attacks. It's still early on, so it's impossible to give a definitive answer, but, based on the current evidence, Shield/Abs are going to be the kingmaker tank stats for all classes.
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