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Is the Lore going too much in the Favor of...

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore > Spoilers
Is the Lore going too much in the Favor of...

Neriath's Avatar


Neriath
02.06.2013 , 01:00 AM | #21
The Empire does need a huge victory here though, and i do wonder what chapter 4 will bring. Does anyone think that the imperial agent will get to kill/fight theron shan? Just a guess but i just can see that as a major story boss fight.

yoomazir's Avatar


yoomazir
02.06.2013 , 03:42 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Neriath View Post
The Empire does need a huge victory here though, and i do wonder what chapter 4 will bring. Does anyone think that the imperial agent will get to kill/fight theron shan? Just a guess but i just can see that as a major story boss fight.
Dunno, but since Malgus is down, the Empire doesn't have anymore a "leader" while the Republic still have Satele; and since you brought the Shan, I thought it would be fun if she turned into the Dark Side.

Zardac_the_Great's Avatar


Zardac_the_Great
02.06.2013 , 12:22 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by Kawabonga View Post
Oh please... the Empire represents evil, and in what good story does the evil prevail? The empire is meant to lose because it's full of bad guys, and plot requires them to eventually fail
Only two that I know of, and in the ends of both stories, the evil victor was eventually destroyed.

In the Godzilla movie Godzilla, Mothra, King Ghidorah: Giant Monsters, All out Attack (the Japanese is less difficult to say, Daikaiju Sokugeki. We ususally say GMK), Godzilla is some sort of mystical evil thing. He actually kills Baragon, Mothra, and King Ghidorah, who are some sort of guardian monsters (stupid premise, awesome movie. Fairly bad effects). Though, in the end, Godzilla is destroyed by a kamikazie submariner.


As a long time Civilization fan, when Alpha Centauri came out, I got it. What I didn't know is that there was a trilogy of novels released with the game. In Centauri Dawn, the Spartans (bad guys) conquer the Peacekeepers (good guys). I was very disappointed, and it was a major buzz killer. Then in Twilight of the mind, the Spartans get hit with an overcharged Planet Buster, which anihilates their entire faction by blowing up a quarter of the world.

errant_knight's Avatar


errant_knight
02.07.2013 , 09:38 PM | #24
There's a whole lot of time before the empire needs to be defeated, much longer than our character's lifetimes. This being an mmo, I expect that victory will go back and forth in relatively minor ways as long as there's a game, and that the real victories will be against third parties.

OldVengeance's Avatar


OldVengeance
02.08.2013 , 12:29 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by Zardac_the_Great View Post
Only two that I know of, and in the ends of both stories, the evil victor was eventually destroyed.

In the Godzilla movie Godzilla, Mothra, King Ghidorah: Giant Monsters, All out Attack (the Japanese is less difficult to say, Daikaiju Sokugeki. We ususally say GMK), Godzilla is some sort of mystical evil thing. He actually kills Baragon, Mothra, and King Ghidorah, who are some sort of guardian monsters (stupid premise, awesome movie. Fairly bad effects). Though, in the end, Godzilla is destroyed by a kamikazie submariner.


As a long time Civilization fan, when Alpha Centauri came out, I got it. What I didn't know is that there was a trilogy of novels released with the game. In Centauri Dawn, the Spartans (bad guys) conquer the Peacekeepers (good guys). I was very disappointed, and it was a major buzz killer. Then in Twilight of the mind, the Spartans get hit with an overcharged Planet Buster, which anihilates their entire faction by blowing up a quarter of the world.
Doesn't that trilogy end with most of humanity being destroyed anyway by the mindworms?

Zardac_the_Great's Avatar


Zardac_the_Great
02.10.2013 , 01:58 AM | #26
I believe it does. They nuke the planet, and the planet fights back. So Lal rushes out to a fungal field (because apparently, he wants to be eaten by the worms or something).

I'm conflicted about those books. On one hand, they're very interesting, and I like them. On the other hand, they have the worst ending I've come across in sci fi books, and their vision for the future of man is utterly abhorrent.


Much easier when I can simply root for Godzilla to destroy Japan.

DAWUSS's Avatar


DAWUSS
02.10.2013 , 10:35 AM | #27
I hope we the player will be able to shape the course of the war in a dynamic way (all we've done primarily is ride along the Railroad Express that is class storylines and repeatable flashpoints)

Darth_Vicente's Avatar


Darth_Vicente
02.10.2013 , 11:38 AM | #28
I hate the argument "The Empire has to lose anyway" because it undermines the most important part of any struggle: Tension. Just because in THREE THOUSAND YEARS the Empire is long gone doesn't mean they have to fall within our character's lifetimes or so one-sidedly for that matter. To do that is bad story telling because:

1) It would make the Empire not even a real threat and not worth dealing with, making the whole story worthless.

2) As a bi-faction MMO, the lack of any worth while victories makes those of us playing the Empire feel all of our efforts have been for nothing, and those on the Republic see the us as a joke.

& 3) If the Republic wins within the span of the game's life/timeline, it's over. There's nothing to carry on.

Sure, EVENTUALLY there's going to be no more Empire, but give this war more tug-of-war type wins/loses rather than hand everything to the Republic.
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Mercurial_Harpy's Avatar


Mercurial_Harpy
02.25.2013 , 10:26 AM | #29
The Republic coming out ahead shouldn't come as any surprise to anyone. The theme of Star Wars in general is that the Sith can't get out of their own way enough of the time to pull it together and score a solid win against the Republic for a lasting period of time. If you look at all the class stories, the Sith had a lock throughout Ch 2 until six events changed the course of the war:

1. Beginning with in-fighting between Sith Lords that diverted forces from the war with the Repulic
2. Imperial Intelligence gets dissolved b/c of the Star Cabal which cripples Imperial Operations on Correlia
3. #2 directly causes the death of several Dark Council members on Correlia
4. Lost power plays result in the death of 2 more Council members (Inquisitor and Warrior story)
5. The fate of the Emperor; possibly dead for real, at the very least crippled, seriously wounded and in hiding. No one knows for sure, which directly led to:
6. Malgus's betrayal, which at the very least diverted even more assets from the war to his own B.S. Lucky for the Empire, that didn't last long.

I mean, the only class story that scores a solid win for the Empire at the end of Ch 3 is the Bounty Hunter, who really only cares about the paycheck at the end of the day. The three other classes are focused on their own mess having nothing to do with the Republic. The war is a distraction from their own goals. That's the problem, and always has been.

So, the Empire is left with no true leader, no Intel, massive casualties from Core World operations which makes them pull out, and a Dark Council down by 1/2 at least. That's even before the Dread Masters return and the Hutt Cartel seizes power.

What a mess. All due to the Empire's ineptitude.

Does that mean they won't pull out another win in the short term? No. We will likely see a "The Empire Strikes Back" Scenario for Chapter 4, after ROTHC, which is basically filler until Bioware gets serious about the next chapter for player stories. I would imagine once the Dark Council re-forms with new members, they'll get good and mad about their crushing defeat. They'll be forced to rally their forces, come up with some kind of Intelligence organization again and push hard against the republic. Saresh is looking for a war and I'm pretty sure she'll get one. I would also look for major strife within the Jedi Council; that seems to be the only way the Empire ever gets a foot in the door. Not that it ever lasts...

So I wouldn't worry too much. All the Republic stories end with your character sitting pretty and the Empire on the run. That won't last forever. It wouldn't make for interesting play.
~The Argost Legacy~

~Jedi Covenant~

Rockerfox's Avatar


Rockerfox
03.06.2013 , 04:17 PM | #30
Well if you look at the loss ratio, Imperials have lost far more important people than the Republic. Malgus, Kilran alone are huge, not to mention the council members that certain Sith classes are forced into killing and that die at the hands of Republic classes. I'm still angry that we couldn't decide to side with Malgus, best Emperor ever.