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The "Other" pay to win

kanare's Avatar

02.02.2013 , 09:30 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by Lord_Apophis View Post
This I agree with 100 %

My guild has been farming Terror HM for a long time, I was the first on my server to be able to craft Resolve Armoring 27, I sold 5-6 on gtn then suddenly was there another able to craft it, who not only almost certainly had learned it from me but also lowered the price of the armoring by setting it out for 400k less then me. Within a week was there 15+ able to craft the armoring and the price had been lowered by over 1 million.

Its not about the money I lose but about the fact that I spent hundreds of thousands if not millions of credits on repairs and consumables to be able to learn to craft that armoring, someone buying it from gtn should not be able to learn to craft it...

It dont care if people choose to gear up their chars by buying the armoring, mods and enhancements, it how I have geared up several alts, but only people that has "earned" it should be able to craft them.
I'm so glad there are others that feel like us well if bioware does not fix guilds like ours will start , not selling on gtn and only sell to trusted players ....and it negatively affect the gtn ..........

Monoth's Avatar

02.02.2013 , 03:59 PM | #22
I remember a time when you could look at a persons gear and get a rough idea of how good they were... Not anymore..

I do agree that you shouldn't be able to RE crafted dread gear mods.... The only person who should be able to sell them is the person who put in the time to get them..
F2P is like driving on a long stretch of highway with toll booths every 1/2 mile

Bleeters's Avatar

02.02.2013 , 04:31 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by Monoth View Post
I remember a time when you could look at a persons gear and get a rough idea of how good they were... Not anymore..
That was never really the case.

And if that matters so much, then look at their armourings/equipment shells.

CommanderKeeva's Avatar

02.02.2013 , 05:22 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by Somanliuus View Post
I've been playing swtor for the last year. Ive completed all content with the exception on NiM EC (on kephiss). 4 BiS 61 toons, 1BiS 63 toon. What gripes me (but seemingly noone else) is people paying to win. An no, Im not talking about the Cartel Market. Im talking about people crafting 63 armorings/mods/enhancements. My old guild had 4-5 regular raiders that bought, with credits, a full set of dread gear. I was against this for the simple fact- not once did we set foot in TfB HM at that time. So going in on our first run most people had BiS 63 gear. I have nothing against people who down this raid crafting the gear because they earned it. But a bunch of people who have a hard time downing EC hard in dread gear should not be buying it, they should work for it. Or am I horribly wrong?
I don't mind this as this actually makes crafting professions useful. Also, given how utterly **** most stock DG pieces are (teeming with 27A and 27B mods and whatnot), min/maxing from drops is next to impossible. You need to custom craft mods to replace those annoying 27A ones with proper 27s. This doesn't bother me.

What does bother me is that you can reverse War Hero armorings/mods/enhancements into molecular stabilizers, from which you can craft BiS PvE gear. PvP should not be the fastest way to obtain BiS PvE armor. I know you can reverse engineer Black Hole items too into stabilizers but come on. 875 warzone commendations you can get in a day. Sometimes twice or three times as many. Alone. 50 Black Hole comms would take 3 Operations and the Rakghoul weekly or 10 daily hard modes. And you need to be in a team for that.

I think it's a problem when PvP becomes to way to get PvE armor....

Ruskaeth's Avatar

02.03.2013 , 12:06 AM | #25
How I read OP's post was like this:

"Everyone can grind materials to get BiS 63 quite fast, but it does not give them necessary skills for EC NiM."

I also picked a subtle hint about him wanting people to progress operations to actually learn how to play.

Once again: skill > gear.

Pekoo's Avatar

02.03.2013 , 03:41 AM | #26
I would agree that people shouldn't be able to craft armorings and hilts/barrels (if you couldn't craft mods and enhancements, even for PvE players only, with the current gear stats it would be a pain to get a full OPS group to BiS) if we didn't need 2-3 PvE armorings to get BiS PvP gear. I am both a PvE and PvP player, but i know that if i was a PvP player only, i would be extremely annoyed if BW forced me to do an OPS to get BiS PvP gear, an easy fix for this would be to remove expertise diminishing returns.
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Larry_Dallas's Avatar

02.03.2013 , 08:37 PM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by Creslan View Post
Why not allow the crafting of elite war hero and let people craft and GTN sell that?
I'm not a crafter and already have mostly optimized ewh, but think this is an excellent idea. Maybe give it schems for this stuff to armormechs and synths or something, instead of letting CTs and artificers make all the money.

Larry_Dallas's Avatar

02.03.2013 , 08:39 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Monoth View Post
I remember a time when you could look at a persons gear and get a rough idea of how good they were... Not anymore..

uniz's Avatar

02.03.2013 , 10:30 PM | #29
[QUOTE=Monoth;5809294]I remember a time when you could look at a persons gear and get a rough idea of how good they were... Not anymore..


i understand what you are saying and agree with you. however wow and wow clone players will not fully understand what you just said. in the more challenging mmos where end game gear wasn't easily crafted or even crafted. raid instances not nerfed after a few weeks. no story modes where fights can be learned. no walkthroughs posted in the forums before the new instances were released and even then not months afterwards. your statement carried more weight and is true.

however, today's wow and wow clone mmos changed all of that as such mmo players will cling to thinking "if i have the gear i am good" mentality. it is true in these other mmos you could pay for runs too but that is only just before a new level cap or expansion is being released making such gear obsolete. still everyone knew you did it too. in those games gear was a badge of excellence which you carried proudly and was enough ego satisfaction in itself. players on the server knew who the top guilds are without any world first or server first in game rankings.

the op has a valid point. the mechanic of crafting such gear as it is today needs some modifications or perhaps just have a vendor in fleet where you can pay 20 million credits or what ever and get a full set. essentially that is what you are doing and the only people hurt by doing such will be high end ops guild crafters. not the average ones. but we all know this will never happen as the wow clone mold of stupid easy obtainable gear and content for everyone is what the average to poor players want. these far out number the rest as most of those have left the game. as long as this mechanic is not currently sinking the financial boat it wont change. i just keep telling myself to embrace the game for what it is and stop dreaming of such changes. it just wont happen.

NogueiraA's Avatar

02.04.2013 , 12:55 AM | #30
They did that because this game have a bunch of casual players, so you can "buy" your max-tier equip.

I like that, makes the game fun for everyone, you have only 3, 4 hours per week to play the game and wish to be full dread guard, you can.