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So if pvp survival gear is useless why keep it in-game?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
So if pvp survival gear is useless why keep it in-game?

Altheran's Avatar


Altheran
01.23.2013 , 03:07 PM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by JP_Legatus View Post
The shield and absorb works great for snipers and all non sorc classes have at least some white damage
Correction : It just works against Snipers, not at all against Sorcerers, and works a bit against some non-Sorc classes (Juggernaut - Marauder - some Mercenaries), and is near useless against the other ones (Powertech - Operatives).

Quote: Originally Posted by RaithHarth View Post
It works against white damage but it's useless against critical damage, why is that?
Because it's supposed to be balanced around the possibility to be either shielded, crit or normal. With equivalent amounts of Shield/Absorb and Crit/Surge, statistically, it's like if the defender wouldn't have any of Shield/Absorb and the attacker any of Crit/Surge. It's just that as a result, the Tank is super spiky when comparing a shielded hit to a critted hit.
That's only when the shielding mechanic is not ignored because the attack is Tech/Force type. And this is the problem. Not shielding a crit is normal (arguable design-wise, but not balance-wise).

Natholomew's Avatar


Natholomew
01.23.2013 , 03:12 PM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by MiaRB View Post
tank gear isnt useless. its 85% of people who roll a tank spec that are useless in PVP.
No True Tanksman, amirite?

Here, I find only the Juggernaut/Guardian really gets the most out of their defensive gear, where Assassins/Shadows can equip DPS and then spec Defense. Powertech/Vanguard are SOL because their defensive spec leaves them "hitting for 100's and getting hit for 1000's"

Please keep your L2P nonsense to yourself.

RaithHarth's Avatar


RaithHarth
01.23.2013 , 03:48 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by cycao View Post
It works against weapon based damage and not force/tech...honestly the miss information on these forums is astonishing.
Why doesn't bioware come up with a solution where tanks could have a chance to counter and push back force/tech damage then? such as Force Deflection or Force Absorb? Which could be useful for Jedi Shadow tanks. Even by using a superconducting loop as Mace Windu demonstrated with his lightsaber against Palpatine's force lightning could be quite handy for Jedi Knights.

It would be nice to see something like these to be used accordingly in pvp once we hear more about our new abilities with the new level cap once the expansion comes out, because we definitely need something.
Don't start the Revolution without me

The artist formally known as Rath, now they call me Sydow!

xxdragonragexx's Avatar


xxdragonragexx
01.23.2013 , 05:15 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by cycao View Post
It works against weapon based damage and not force/tech...honestly the miss information on these forums is astonishing.
White damage is weapon based damage. Do you even know what white damage is?? When you hit a mob, a white or yellow damage pops up. It is how you know whether the ability is force/tech or normal damage.

Quote: Originally Posted by RaithHarth View Post
It works against white damage but it's useless against critical damage, why is that?
It is the way the game works. Remember this is a RPG and damage numbers are computed with a roll of a dice or random number generator(RNG). Unfortunately, the game can either crit or defend an attack. So when a crit happens, it cannot be defended, shielded, parried and etc. So defense is useless against a smasher.

This is the way I remember it, they may have changed this already though.

vimm's Avatar


vimm
01.23.2013 , 05:20 PM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by cycao View Post
I don't think its so useless it should be removed. Yes, you will do more for your team with dps gear probably because most people straight up don't know how to utilize tanks properly. I think for rateds I see more teams utilizing pure tanks more than regs.
In rateds, you'll only see tanksins!
geeR
Phantom of the Operative

SomeJagoff's Avatar


SomeJagoff
01.23.2013 , 05:45 PM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by RaithHarth View Post
Since tanks are wearing dps gear now due to the fact shield and absorption is completely useless in pvp, it's hard to say if this will be fixed or not...if at all!
It's not entirely useless. All of the mods/enhancements stack a ton of endurance, so more endurance will keep you alive longer in pvp. Furthermore, if you're fighting a marksmanship sniper/carnage mara/deception sin (mostly), stacking a ton of defense/shield will help you to avoid a lot of the melee/ranged attacks or at least shield/absorb what you don't avoid. So it has some benefit.

Of course, if you're going up against an operative/sorc/etc classes that use exclusively force/tech attacks, the shield/absorb/defense won't do anything, but your armor rating will reduce the amount of damage you take and the extra endurance will keep you alive longer to take more hits.

I have a ton of endurance on my jugg tank, helps me stay alive a lot longer, I do very little damage, but I stay alive longer, so definitely useful in huttball.
Once you're in the hole, what's a few more feet?

Jenzali's Avatar


Jenzali
01.23.2013 , 06:14 PM | #27
If you think tank gear is useless in PvP then you've never seen an Assassin or Jugg in full tank gear in Huttball.
Dashto Vant - Arsenal Mercenary - The most dashing bounty hunter in the galaxy.

RaithHarth's Avatar


RaithHarth
01.23.2013 , 08:51 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by SomeJagoff View Post
It's not entirely useless. All of the mods/enhancements stack a ton of endurance, so more endurance will keep you alive longer in pvp. Furthermore, if you're fighting a marksmanship sniper/carnage mara/deception sin (mostly), stacking a ton of defense/shield will help you to avoid a lot of the melee/ranged attacks or at least shield/absorb what you don't avoid. So it has some benefit.

Of course, if you're going up against an operative/sorc/etc classes that use exclusively force/tech attacks, the shield/absorb/defense won't do anything, but your armor rating will reduce the amount of damage you take and the extra endurance will keep you alive longer to take more hits.

I have a ton of endurance on my jugg tank, helps me stay alive a lot longer, I do very little damage, but I stay alive longer, so definitely useful in huttball.
I just think it's sad that tanks have to resort to using dps gear now because survival gear doesn't really help against force/tech damage, at least dps gear gives them something to rely on, but like I said in my previous post above it would be great if tanks had an ability to push off force/tech damage or at least have a chance to since it takes so much out of us.
Don't start the Revolution without me

The artist formally known as Rath, now they call me Sydow!

JP_Legatus's Avatar


JP_Legatus
01.24.2013 , 02:34 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by JP_Legatus
The shield and absorb works great for snipers and all non sorc classes have at least some white damage

Quote: Originally Posted by Altheran View Post
Correction : It just works against Snipers, not at all against Sorcerers, and works a bit against some non-Sorc classes (Juggernaut - Marauder - some Mercenaries), and is near useless against the other ones (Powertech - Operatives).
Yes thank you for restating what I said while also saying you are correcting me, I'll let you get away with that.
Oh wait, no I won't

And I don't really know jack about DPS operatives but I'm assuming their DPS spec relies on white damage. Powertech has some white damage too I think, isn't rail shot white damage?
Plaje - 55 Assassin Sorcheals - 55 Sorcerer
TheHulkk - 55 Juggernaut Riksa - 55 Marauder
Ophealing - 55 Operative Lolsniper - 55 Sniper
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Asunasan's Avatar


Asunasan
01.24.2013 , 02:57 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by JP_Legatus View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by JP_Legatus
The shield and absorb works great for snipers and all non sorc classes have at least some white damage



Yes thank you for restating what I said while also saying you are correcting me, I'll let you get away with that.
Oh wait, no I won't

And I don't really know jack about DPS operatives but I'm assuming their DPS spec relies on white damage. Powertech has some white damage too I think, isn't rail shot white damage?
Operatives were originally tank killers, then our armor pen got nerfed. Our basic attack is our only white dmg and it is irrelevant. Pts get in trouble when railshot starts missing and getting blocked though

And I will get away with correcting you.