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Satele Shan [yes this again]

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Satele Shan [yes this again]

Illutian's Avatar


Illutian
12.20.2011 , 03:40 PM | #1
There doesn't seem to be a search option *prods web team*

So, here's my Satele rant. Please explain if you can cause I'm truly confused.

Why is Satele so much older looking as a character than from the Splash Scree, which depicts Coru burning?

I asked this question in Guild and was informed that 'we' are playing 60yrs after the Sacking. I counter with if this is true why is so much of Coru still under heavy construction (almost all buildings in the distance have cranes and scaffolding on them).

Furthermore, why are all the holo-transmissions of Satele "young".

And even more "***" is only just found here:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Satele_Shan

Quote:
In 3,653 BBY, Shan was selected by the Jedi High Council to accompany Master Dar'Nala back to Alderaan, where peace negotiations were being held between delegations from the Republic and Empire.
[...]

Quote:
Around 3,643 BBY, full-scale war was very nearly reignited between the Republic and Empire when rogue droids and a Mandalorian warrior began initiating conflicts between the two governments.
It can be assumed that the first quote is around the time of "Hope Trailer". And the second one around our time (+/-10yr).

Now I don't know about you all but in 'Hope', she looks to be about 25. So ten years later (see bolded dated) she would be in her early to mid 30s. And by our time possibly even 40.

Using today's logic, people in their 40s look extremely young compared to those who were 40 say 100yrs ago. So you extrapolate that into Star Wars and you should be able to assume that you'd look 30 well up into your 70s.

I also remember beta-Satele (coining this!)...if you want a refresher:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-CTmGpA0Eo
Time Index 0:24+

Her ingame model depicted the 'correct' "Body Age".

Anyone got any insight as to why the change in her appearance?

Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall. - Confucius

the-algebraist's Avatar


the-algebraist
12.20.2011 , 04:02 PM | #2
If you play as a Jedi Knight and are asked to go to the temple ruins the character has the option of mentioning how long ago it was since the temple was sacked. Implied, possibly even says, that it was more than 20 years ago. This would add 20 years or more onto her age at the sacking of Coruscant.

Which would make her at least 50.
It's not living that counts, it's living rightly.

Illutian's Avatar


Illutian
12.20.2011 , 04:29 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by the-algebraist View Post
If you play as a Jedi Knight and are asked to go to the temple ruins the character has the option of mentioning how long ago it was since the temple was sacked. Implied, possibly even says, that it was more than 20 years ago. This would add 20 years or more onto her age at the sacking of Coruscant.

Which would make her at least 50.
Must have missed that option.

So then the 'younger' model featured in the trailer (linked), holo-transmissioned, and even the original Beta (I came in Beta...5 [I think]; the following Beta she was 'old'..that's all I know) was a design mistake???

Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall. - Confucius

psychogobstopper's Avatar


psychogobstopper
12.20.2011 , 04:56 PM | #4
That second Wookiepedia quote describes events that took place in the Fatal Alliance novel, which occurs right around the same time as the game. Shan is Grand Master of the Jedi Order during the novel, and both the Imperial and Republic characters in the novel consider a resurgence of war to be imminent - just like many people in the game do.

I'm not sure that I'd place the first quote with the events of the "Hope" trailer, however. The depiction of Alderaan in the Deceived novel doesn't have battles still raging on the planet. That novel covers the time period including the Sacking of Coruscant and the Treaty of Coruscant, even providing a novelized version of Malgus's assault on the Jedi Temple from the "Deceived" trailer.

My understanding (which I realize could be wrong) has been that the game takes place in 3643 BBY, roughly 10 years after the Treaty of Coruscant. I'll try to take a look through my copies of Deceived and Fatal Alliance for descriptions of Satele Shan, then edit them into this post in case that might help with this question.

Everything from this point on has been edited in after the above

Quote: Originally Posted by Deceived
Satele, on the other hand, looked as tightly wound as an ion coil, her gaze fixed straight ahead, her auburn hair mussed, the veneer of her neutral expression unable to mask the emotion boiling beneath it. [p.42]
Quote: Originally Posted by Fatal Alliance
"Tell him why," said Grand Master Satele Shan, standing at his side with hands folded firmly before her. She was a full head shorter than Shigar but radiated an indomitable sense of self. [p.17]

With a finely boned face and gray-streaked hair, she was not a tall woman [...] [p.36]

[...] the slight woman with the gray streak wearing the robes of a Jedi Knight. [p. 252]

[...] a mature woman with gray-streaked brown hair [...] [p. 341]
These are the most useful passages that include any physical description of Satele Shan from those two novels - though admittedly they aren't that useful, after all.

flumpet's Avatar


flumpet
12.20.2011 , 05:09 PM | #5
So, we first see Satele in 'Return' looking pretty young, this took place in 3,681 BBY.

The Sacking of Coruscant took place in 3,653 BBY, and from what I can tell, the game starts 10 years later in 3,643 BBY. That's 38 years. Even if she were 10 in 'Return', she's still pushin' 50 by the time of game, and she doesn't look 10 years old in 'Return', so let's say she's maybe 20 at that time.

I'd say she looks pretty spry for a 60-year old in game.

Illutian's Avatar


Illutian
12.20.2011 , 07:30 PM | #6
Interesting that they'd make her young (in game model) then decide to "oldify" (coined!) her later...since she's a custom model it would have been easier to make her in her current form, which would have then been used for the holo-transmission models. And if the time line was already established; there's really no "we didn't know" excuse.

I guess I could argue that Rukil is (supposedly) 100+ and doesn't look a bit over 75; Satele has too many age marks.

In fact, I've never really studied Star Wars lore, but what is the average life expectancy of humans "now". In Babylon 5 it was something like 120. And in Star Trek I think 135. So if all these "future-depicting" shows say humans' new 'middle age' is about 70; that still puts Satele at looking old before her time.

Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall. - Confucius

CyberCommando's Avatar


CyberCommando
12.20.2011 , 09:54 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by flumpet View Post
So, we first see Satele in 'Return' looking pretty young, this took place in 3,681 BBY.

The Sacking of Coruscant took place in 3,653 BBY, and from what I can tell, the game starts 10 years later in 3,643 BBY. That's 38 years. Even if she were 10 in 'Return', she's still pushin' 50 by the time of game, and she doesn't look 10 years old in 'Return', so let's say she's maybe 20 at that time.

I'd say she looks pretty spry for a 60-year old in game.
Ah, but as she is a Light Sided Jedi Master, would the force have preserved her to some extent?

JediArchives's Avatar


JediArchives
12.20.2011 , 09:58 PM | #8
Stress lines. Come on, fighting the Sith for 30 years, losing your home and losing the war, being unsure of the future of the Jedi Order, discovering Tython and then having to build a new Temple...!

Look as good, you would not!
Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph.
- T Paine

Calax's Avatar


Calax
12.21.2011 , 01:29 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by CyberCommando View Post
Ah, but as she is a Light Sided Jedi Master, would the force have preserved her to some extent?
Never seen a piece of media that suggests that Light Side has any anti-aging effects. Only thing that might come close is the physics of relativistic speeds, but that isn't used at ALL in Star Wars.

Silverspar's Avatar


Silverspar
12.21.2011 , 04:58 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Illutian View Post
Interesting that they'd make her young (in game model) then decide to "oldify" (coined!) her later...since she's a custom model it would have been easier to make her in her current form, which would have then been used for the holo-transmission models. And if the time line was already established; there's really no "we didn't know" excuse.

I guess I could argue that Rukil is (supposedly) 100+ and doesn't look a bit over 75; Satele has too many age marks.

In fact, I've never really studied Star Wars lore, but what is the average life expectancy of humans "now". In Babylon 5 it was something like 120. And in Star Trek I think 135. So if all these "future-depicting" shows say humans' new 'middle age' is about 70; that still puts Satele at looking old before her time.
I don't get what you are complaining about. I've not seen a single episode in game where Satele looks younger. The holo videos, she looks aged and lined as she does in person, just not as perceptible because of the blue transparent look. If you are referring to the videos, those videos are long ago in the past; Deceived is the last, 10 years ago with the sacking of Coruscant, Hope is before that, a victory the Republic had that forced the Empire to do its desperate attack on Coruscant in Deceive that brought the cease fire, and then Return is where it all began which is the start of the war.