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PvE class balance needs to be tighter

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Roles > Damage-dealing
PvE class balance needs to be tighter

Donalj's Avatar


Donalj
01.04.2013 , 01:56 PM | #21
To any of you QQing sages that say it sucks, yeah dummy parses = bad. The 1/12/28 hybrid is the best dps for raiding and once you actually l2p, your numbers will be great, surpassing vanguards and sentinels in some fights.
Donal - Xarea - Pasta - Wotsit - Vebbeg - Potential - Greengiant
Dólan - Hurrimarobot

MisterMuse's Avatar


MisterMuse
01.09.2013 , 06:15 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Donalj View Post
To any of you QQing sages that say it sucks, yeah dummy parses = bad. The 1/12/28 hybrid is the best dps for raiding and once you actually l2p, your numbers will be great, surpassing vanguards and sentinels in some fights.
That is solely dependent on fight and skill. The hybrid spec is an amazing spec overall due to the fact that is really easy as its a 4 button rotation with no energy management. However lots of fights, Withering Horror, Denova Kephiss which you can stand still and turret the fight out telekinetic is better. Balance is too force tight in a lot of fights.

That is would also challenge Vanguards and Sentinels is just not true. Both personal experience and ranked logs show that sages are behind on nearly all the fight (if not all) in the game at the moment dps wise. Vanguards, Commandos, Gunslingers and Sentinels just have too much higher base dps. I love my Sage and love dps with it but it is behind more than it logically should.

*Also as a note, it would be nice seeing some Bioware response to the issue of dps imbalance overall in the game at the minute, Shadows, Sages and Scoundrels are falling behind and there is no reason why these classes should have lower dps.
Raysho - Hybrid Sage
Fahér - Combat Sentinel
Jahír - Vigilance Guardian
Sahír - Assault Vanguard

OlosBC's Avatar


OlosBC
01.09.2013 , 12:06 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by Donalj View Post
To any of you QQing sages that say it sucks, yeah dummy parses = bad. The 1/12/28 hybrid is the best dps for raiding and once you actually l2p, your numbers will be great, surpassing vanguards and sentinels in some fights.
On my sorc 3/7/31, I prefer it over the hybrid, almost full dreadguatd, I do routinely beat powertech and marauders.

But when I hop over to my BH geared powertech, I beat my sorcs numbers by like 200 DPS.

And I'm a lot more experienced and skilled on the sorc than I am on the ptech.

Not to mention on-demand burst for burn phases, which is nonexistent for a sorc, and an execute-style ability, and comparable or better (short term only) aoe.
Olos - 55 Hybrid Powertech
Fonia - 55 Madness Sorceror
<Dark Fury> of Jedi Covenant
Previously Fonia and Daygoru of Tempest server in SWG.

ladwar's Avatar


ladwar
01.10.2013 , 06:01 AM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by MisterMuse View Post
*Also as a note, it would be nice seeing some Bioware response to the issue of dps imbalance overall in the game at the minute, Shadows, Sages and Scoundrels are falling behind and there is no reason why these classes should have lower dps.
reasons
stealth/overpowered healing but dps is correct/stealth

balance is there for pvp not pve so yea it works just the way it was ment to and it is fairly tight for similar gearing.

MisterMuse's Avatar


MisterMuse
01.10.2013 , 09:26 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by ladwar View Post
reasons
stealth/overpowered healing but dps is correct/stealth

balance is there for pvp not pve so yea it works just the way it was ment to and it is fairly tight for similar gearing.
DPS is not right at all between the classes and balance is there for both PvP and for PvE, all classes need to be able to keep the same level of end game quality in terms of dps and usefulness which just isn't the case. A Sage maximum dps (optimal gearing and 100% perfect execution) on a dummy at the moment lies around 1970 while Sentinels can reach up to above 2200, thats a damned 11% difference which is far to much for competitive gaming. Also the classes aren't even balanced for PvP. Its even worse for Scoundrels if I understand correctly which also needs to be meele distance at times.
Raysho - Hybrid Sage
Fahér - Combat Sentinel
Jahír - Vigilance Guardian
Sahír - Assault Vanguard

verfallen's Avatar


verfallen
01.10.2013 , 11:08 AM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by ladwar View Post
reasons
stealth/overpowered healing but dps is correct/stealth

balance is there for pvp not pve so yea it works just the way it was ment to and it is fairly tight for similar gearing.

TOR main strength is the story value. WZ got more popular than Bioware tought I think, but there needs to be balance over all.

Also a good burst, which is what PvPers research, doesnt mean you need bad sustained.

Also it IS, imo, normal pure melee dps should have a bit higher damage to account for fight parameters where boss move around or KB. A rdps WILL have an easier time staying on the boss, and snipers vulnerability to moving around does mean they should, when in cover get a bit of an edge in PvE ops imo.

The fact snipers and mara are "pure dps" can be arguable as to why they have an edge either.

Issue is, this edge looks like a rift to many right now.

NeoTaintedAngel's Avatar


NeoTaintedAngel
01.15.2013 , 01:05 PM | #27
It would be one thing if marauders/sentinels simply had a dps edge. But they also have the utility edge. I know this will instantly result in people rushing in to say that hybrids can do other roles - which is true. But if you take a hybrid as dps, you are taking them as just that - as dps. You aren't bringing them for the ability to toss off a sporadic heal or to attempt to offtank something. You are bringing them as dps.

Usually it's the hybrids which bring the group utility and buffs. This is to offset the fact that they will, more often than not, be outdps'd by a pure dps class. Which I am usually fine with. The problem is in this case? We have the pures with group utility and the higher numbers. Which, in a PvE environment, means that hybrids just become more unappealing by comparison.

Obviously though, Snipers/Gunslingers kind of lack in the utility department too. With a group damage reduction skill which has (I think, it has been a long time since I played either) a three minute cooldown - versus a Marauder/Sentinel which can pop group based cooldowns much faster. (Again, if memory serves)

I guess in short - it would be one thing if they just had the edge in terms of dps. That's fine. 5%? Sure. 11%? Yikes. (And has anyone compared the highest marauder to the lowest operative?) But there's absolutely no incentive to bring any melee aside from the sentinel/marauder. You know, unless you're afraid that it'd take to long to gear up all of them so you throw a powertech/vanguard a bone.

Hopefully the expansion will address some of these issues. As opposed to what I fear will be the case and just widen the gap more. (You know, since there are so many sentinels/marauders now)
"Victory goes to those with courage."

wetslampigduex's Avatar


wetslampigduex
01.15.2013 , 01:07 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Donalj View Post
To any of you QQing sages that say it sucks, yeah dummy parses = bad. The 1/12/28 hybrid is the best dps for raiding and once you actually l2p, your numbers will be great, surpassing vanguards and sentinels in some fights.
The day a sorc beats my PT in dps is the day i quit....

Cynshade's Avatar


Cynshade
07.02.2013 , 01:20 PM | #29
welcome to the whine of thousands of pvp'rs on how their HEALER wasn't pushing DPS numbers... and getting DPS nerf'd to **** over and over until they aren't even viable AS dps.