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"Double" Double distruction help. ECHM


CountOryansen's Avatar


CountOryansen
01.07.2013 , 09:49 PM | #1
I heard this from a few others I ran with for ECHM, that a "double" double distruction is a sign of a problem.
One of our few problems on the Fire and Storm is the 2nd double D falls too close to defensive systems and auto quick drops the first lightning bubble on the tank hitting the dps with no defensive systems cast bar.

Can u take down storm and fire while getting two double D's per phase?
Are there other successful methods other than the 4 and 4 split?

What has worked for others doing HM storm and fire?

P.S "getting another guild" is not a solution

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AshlaBoga's Avatar


AshlaBoga
01.07.2013 , 10:00 PM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by CountOryansen View Post
I heard this from a few others I ran with for ECHM, that a "double" double distruction is a sign of a problem.
One of our few problems on the Fire and Storm is the 2nd double D falls too close to defensive systems and auto quick drops the first lightning bubble on the tank hitting the dps with no defensive systems cast bar.

Can u take down storm and fire while getting two double D's per phase?
Are there other successful methods other than the 4 and 4 split?

What has worked for others doing HM storm and fire?

P.S "getting another guild" is not a solution
Honestly, it sounds like your dps is lacking. You don't need to get another guild, but you should have someone who's skilled at their class mentor your dps (have them fight the training dummy and they can help tighten their rotations). Surely your Sith Warriors/Inquisitors can find a Master, and your Operatives a trainer and your BHs... well they can pay someone for lessons.
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-Quagmire-'s Avatar


-Quagmire-
01.07.2013 , 10:36 PM | #3
A method I understand to be commonly used is:-

A 1FB/3SC split of dps until SC reaches 20%, this can pretty much guarantee only 1 DD between DS's (unless dps is seriously lacking)
Once SC reaches 20% (and after the final shield phase) have all dps focus on FB to it's death, positioning 1 healer and 1 RDPS on SC to take the DD's once FB is down everyone burn down the last of SC ... fight finished.

Edit: additional info.
Have tanks swap as normal for the incinerate armor from FB

In our group we usually have 1 RDPS capable of self-cleanse running around on the ground attracting the lightning rods while everyone else is ON the tanks this is the 1dps that focuses on FB, the other RDPS is standing on FB and dpsing SC from there, the RDPS that is ON FB is then the one that switches to standing on SC for the FB burn phase. this ensures an even 4FB/3SC split when it comes to the shield phase (defensive systems) with the last person being the tank that was on SC attracting the lightning rods well away from the group but in range of the healer
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Dassem's Avatar


Dassem
01.07.2013 , 11:42 PM | #4
There's a couple of solutions to this issue.

1) As previously mentioned stack 3dps on Storm, this can be done in either two ways. The one already mentioned of taking Storm to 20% and then all dps on Fire or by getting a range dps on Fire who does 5-10 seconds worth of dps on Storm after every shield phase just to tip the balance. The first version will work on HM but not on NiM, the second will work on both.

2) You can slow the dps down slightly so that the second DD hits at a slightly higher % and you go into the shield phase as normal. The most obvious problem being that you are further weakening what is already a dps issue and make enraging more of a issue, though its possible.

3) When the second DD comes have the tank drop to the ground and stay there till the shield phase (will only be for about 5 secs normally). This will mean the lighting bubble hits the ground and not on the tank like you are experience. The tank must drop to the ground on the second DD though if he does not or goes to the ground and then back on the tank then the lighting will place itself on the tank as well.

All are viable though 1 or 3 are the better solutions with 3 working quite well once the tanks get used to dropping to the floor on the second DD. While these are all solutions to the problem you face I'd use the reprieve to do what a few others have suggested and look at ways of improving the dps.
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OlosBC's Avatar


OlosBC
01.08.2013 , 12:09 PM | #5
Phase transitions are on a timer or every 20% health on FIREBRAND (NOT stormcaller) .

Best solution is more DPS. If you can't get people to do that, the tank on the ground thing works, or just having DPS alert that a bubble will soon drop on the storm caller tank and to get the F out of dodge as soon as they get DD debuff.
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dipstik's Avatar


dipstik
01.08.2013 , 12:16 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by OlosBC View Post
Phase transitions are on a timer or every 20% health on FIREBRAND (NOT stormcaller) .
lies. i have burnt stormcaller and pushed phases.

wetslampigduex's Avatar


wetslampigduex
01.08.2013 , 12:25 PM | #7
Your dps is low, but there is a very easy solution to this issue keeping everything the same. When the second DD comes up make sure the tank tanking stormcaller moves off of the tank behind the dps. That lighting spire that is dropping on the dps is actually dropped where the tank is standing when DD is casting. So simply by having the tank move to the ground behind the dps as long as the dps doesn't run through it you'll be golden.

Suzina's Avatar


Suzina
01.08.2013 , 09:50 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by OlosBC View Post
Phase transitions are on a timer or every 20% health on FIREBRAND (NOT stormcaller) .

Best solution is more DPS. If you can't get people to do that, the tank on the ground thing works, or just having DPS alert that a bubble will soon drop on the storm caller tank and to get the F out of dodge as soon as they get DD debuff.
It's on stormcaller actually. Stormcaller is the one who does double destruction, so 3 dps attack him should do it.
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Raekor's Avatar


Raekor
01.09.2013 , 02:00 AM | #9
I advise getting some mentoring over the pushing SC to 20%. Reason is you can't do that on NiM, so if you get to NiM you then need to change up your strategy which could cause more wipes then necessary.

What DPS are you running with? If you get your two strongest DPS on SC they might be able to push the defensive systems. Our op make up for NiM is to usually have our two melee DPS (usually dual PT's or a MT/Marauder combo), and during the first 20% the operative healer even drops an orbital strike. Pushing that first 20% is the hardest due to a combo of tank threat starting at zero, timer counting down whilst still getting into position, and having to actually get the 20% before the second DD starts casting. If you do beat that first one, subsequent defensive systems triggers are easier as you get to start at a lower value due to DPS'ing during the cast (we usually push 3% during the cast, so we only need 17% before defensive systems is cast).

I hope that made sense, I kept getting interrupted as I was typing it.

RikuvonDrake's Avatar


RikuvonDrake
01.09.2013 , 06:24 AM | #10
I remember having problems with this back during April during progression, we solved it by having one of our range DPS that were on Firebrand help the Stormcaller team until SC were about 10% ahead. That helped us solve the entire issue and we never encountered the problem again from that point, however also note that you might want to have your best DPS on Stormcaller to keep the "lead" intact.