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One reason there is a tank shortage in group finder

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
One reason there is a tank shortage in group finder

Mallorik's Avatar


Mallorik
01.03.2013 , 11:15 AM | #141
Quote: Originally Posted by magi_melcior View Post
Sounds like your "so called" healer either, forgot to untick the healer option in GF, in which case he's a moron or deliberatly left it ticked to get a group faster, which makes him both a moron and a jerk. Had a similar thing happen in Colicoid Wargames, a Shadow Tank (lvl 44) joined with only 8k HP, was using Force Technique, didn't guard, didn't taunt, kept using Force Cloak to drop agro, didn't have a shield equiped and was in DPS gear, he got vote kicked very fast

Having the GF do a build and gear check could also raise some problems. Firstly the build check, I know a fair number of Guardian Tanks who run a Hybrid build, mixing both the Vigilence tree and the Defense tree, if fact most of these builds have more points in Vigilence than Defence, so there is a risk that they'd be catatgorized as DPS when they are in fact Tanks.
I am also opposed to a manditory gear check of any sort, and short advisory warning that "you may be undergeared for this Instance" would do, but locking people out based on gear over looks 1 important thing, skill can make up the difference!
Case in point, early last year our guild was running EV in Storymode for the first time, we had 6 guild members and a couple of PuG DPS. 1 of our guild (a fresh Commado Healer) was running in Recruit Gear while one of the PuG DPS (a Sentinel) was in full Columi. The Healer was brilliant, despite his lowly gear he kept my Tank and the DPS in my group up with almost no problems at all. The Sentinel on the other hand earned the nickname "Mr Squishy" on the grounds that he died in every boss encounter and half the mob encounters. Based on their gear the Sentinel would be allowed to run LI HM but the Commado wouldn't, but I can tell you right now who I;d prefer to run LI with
As far as the guaridan tank hybrid build, they can work around it, even fix it. Rift classes have 6 or more different skill tree sets per class now and theirs works fine. And yeah a hardcore gear check isnt always great but most of the time its needed, its not like it would be so high that you need rakata gear to run hm eseless. more like, you cant run this hm fp because youre wearing three pieces of level 25 gear.

darthoot's Avatar


darthoot
01.03.2013 , 11:39 AM | #142
I was playing on the level 18 Vanguard I had created and thought I would try out Hammer Station. I'm new to the class and used to playing mostly solo, but I thought a PUG would be good to learn my class a little bit better. Two mob groups into the mission I get a "Pull aggro!" tell then I get vote kicked from the group.

I admit I wasn't doing that great of a job tanking, but it was still the very beginning of a low level FP and we were never in any danger of wiping, so I was a bit upset I wasn't given any time to adjust. Seeing that tank hate is a common problem makes me feel a little bit better about it.

Screaming_Ziva's Avatar


Screaming_Ziva
01.03.2013 , 11:40 AM | #143
Quote: Originally Posted by magi_melcior View Post
Sounds like your "so called" healer either, forgot to untick the healer option in GF, in which case he's a moron or deliberatly left it ticked to get a group faster, which makes him both a moron and a jerk.
Or, as in many cases, the group finder reset itself and checked healer for him.

I've seen this happen many times on my Sorc and on my Merc. I can group find with only DPS checked for days. Then, all of a sudden, Healer will be checked for both of them. If I don't catch it, I'll end up joining a group as a healer.

DarthTHC's Avatar


DarthTHC
01.03.2013 , 11:54 AM | #144
Quote: Originally Posted by Warrgames View Post
I've dropped so many groups because of bad players. I use to try and kick them but to many people just want to finish it instead of replacing bad players. People shouldn't do group things if your not going to work as a group. I never run into any problems doing 4m quest like I do doing HM with group finder. Forcing me to deal with stupid people just to get my BH com is wrong.
This is one of the reasons I like to play tank or healer. When it's time to vote kick the message is, "You can kick the bad DPS or lose the good (Healer|Tank). Choose wisely."

For some reason, it always seems to work.
Human beings see oppression vividly when they're the victims. Otherwise they victimize blindly and without a thought. ~ Isaac Bashevis Singer

Blackardin's Avatar


Blackardin
01.03.2013 , 12:42 PM | #145
Same problem in wow. I participated on the tanking boards quite a bit. The biggest issue were dps players that not only had no idea how to play their class, but at the same time thought they knew how everyone else should play. Tanks just stopped queuing, and dps started whining about long queue times.

People just don't get it, and there is very little that can be done about it beyond what we see here, "tank shortage". There is no cure for idiocy.
May the Schwartz be with you....

Mallorik's Avatar


Mallorik
01.03.2013 , 01:08 PM | #146
I just had a surrreal experience in a lowbie fp i just have to share.

I was playing my 23 operative, qued as dps got in hammerstation, few pulls in our jugg tank is almost dead a few times, then dies. I see our commando healer has his dps barrel on, i ask, did he not realize he was dps? 3 times and 3 pulls and one tank death later he responds. But hes not speced heals so i tell him stay dps ill respec heals. Everything is fine until he disconnects a few pulls later and doesnt come back.

I ask the tank who is lead to reque us about 4 times but he never responds and even attacks the boss with the two bots, i cc the one you can cc and he attacks the boss, letting the other one beat on me the entire time. no biggy im 22 and well geared , well he finaly kills the boss then starts working on the ccd one while the other one continues to beat me. we finaly finish and i refuse to click the station until he reques us or atleast responds.

almost 5 minutes later the reque window comes up, we get a dps, oh joy. a shadow dps in tank stance, i just shut up and we move on. we get to the two champ turrets i cc the far one, our tank attacks the close one, our shadow tank/dps attacks the far one, i mention that its ccd a couple of times, no response.

We get to the last boss, im about to tell the jugg to put his back on the computer and dont point the boss at us, too late hes already jumped in. i mention not to face him towards us a few times, doesnt matter hes facing him at everyone wherever they go. no dps is doing anything about the adds, so im killing them and healing at the same time. we win and these idiots think we did a good job but dont realize its because they have a level 23 in full level 23 orange gear healing them.

I wasnt really mad i was just shocked that i could get a group almost entirely made up of morons and even get another moron when we kicked one out. Theres alot bioware could do to fix these problems that really make having fun hard, and a year of them not doing anything about it is just another example of how out of touch they are and why this game failed in the first place.

Mallorik's Avatar


Mallorik
01.03.2013 , 01:10 PM | #147
Quote: Originally Posted by Screaming_Ziva View Post
Or, as in many cases, the group finder reset itself and checked healer for him.

I've seen this happen many times on my Sorc and on my Merc. I can group find with only DPS checked for days. Then, all of a sudden, Healer will be checked for both of them. If I don't catch it, I'll end up joining a group as a healer.
ive had this happen to me too, jsut another screw up by bioware that they havent addresed.

PlayLoud's Avatar


PlayLoud
01.03.2013 , 01:23 PM | #148
Quote: Originally Posted by Mallorik View Post
Theres alot bioware could do to fix these problems that really make having fun hard, and a year of them not doing anything about it is just another example of how out of touch they are and why this game failed in the first place.
How would you go about this?
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Pantaro's Avatar


Pantaro
01.03.2013 , 01:30 PM | #149
As someone who recently discovered healing and feel in love with it,bad tanks drive me nuts! I actually started healing cause i got sick of healers acting just like you described.So i completely agree,great tanks are like an endangered species,i've lost count of how many tanks i've had to heal who didnt even have tank gear and had no concept of the role of what a tank is meant to do.

I will say tho occasionally some dps don't realize they actually get queued as a healer,until someone tells them.I don't know what server your on,but i would more than love to run groups with a real tank for a change.I bounce around alot of the servers so never know we may be on the same server and i have been looking for a good guild to permenantly plant my feet in and am willing to start on a new server if need be.

PlayLoud's Avatar


PlayLoud
01.03.2013 , 01:32 PM | #150
I'm a Vanguard Tank. I use the group finder daily, and I find it extremely rare that I find a stupid group. I consider myself a skilled tank, and I am definitely well geared (all BH/Campaign or higher). I don't have problems where players tell me I am a bad tank, though if I were in a situation as described by the OP, I would have been a little vocal (but polite) after a couple of deaths. If that didn't work, I would start to get a little more insulting, letting them know I was getting ready to replace them with my companion (also full BH or better) if they didn't start healing. This is only if they were refusing to heal. If they were just under-geared, I would work very hard to pull them through.
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