Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

What is the poison pill, if there is one, for TOR?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
What is the poison pill, if there is one, for TOR?

Petnil's Avatar


Petnil
12.27.2012 , 03:29 PM | #31
Maybe not so much a poison pill, but it doesnīt feel right when other troopers e.x. run round with "my" companions.
I get that if we want companion stories we probably need a same companon, but i wish the storyline companions were fewer and with a bit more story. Then add the option to ask friendly npc chars to join your team to fill the last spots.

Story, i like story, but from a RP point of view the heavy fokus on class story is maybe not so much wasted, but you cant use class story in roleplay. There can be only 1 leader of havoc f.x. If you want to roleplay, and yes i know itīs the vast minority, then you need to filter out class story. With the heavy fokus on class story i feel more like a clone than a unique trooper. All troopers have the exact same story. Works great in solo games, but this is a mmo. It still works, iīm just not sure that was the right way to go.

Worldstory. That could work even in roleplay. But thereīs not enough of it. Some phasing might have helped or just more fokus on the history and lore of each planet. The only planet i feel i got to know the story of is Taris, and i hate Rakghouls.

About scaling. I would like it if you got boostet maybe 2 level when not using companion. I dont agree mobs are too hard. Just adapt and do easier content if mobs are too hard. Also, a big lesson especially for sentinels. Cooldowns are there to be used. I used Kira on my sentinel all the way to 50 and it did probably cost extra wipes, but mobs die faster and you realy learn to make good use of cooldowns.

Kalfear's Avatar


Kalfear
12.27.2012 , 03:40 PM | #32
Quote: Originally Posted by LordArtemis View Post
I think I might have figured out what could be a big reason why some folks walk from the game. It's something that's hard to realize as you go.

I really don't think it's the lack of polished features, content for end game, even the absence of mini-games or social features.

I think it might be the mob difficulty.

Here's what I think I figured out. The story is a big draw, A BIG DRAW. But the problem is, or at least I suspect it might be that the mobs are just too few and too difficult.
Gotta admit I stopped there because IF ANYTHING,

TOR is to simplistic and easy
NOT to difficult

Before joining a guild and running OPS (the only truely challenging content in game and even KP and EV become simplistic on SM and HM after you run it a few times) I 2 maned TOR

1-50
EVERY 2 man Heroic
MOST 4 man Heroics
4 or 5 Flashpoints (pre 50)

ALL done with 1 other person and our companions
heck ALL the 2 man heroics and even some of the 4 man ones I would solo

In the counsular storyline I required zero aide until the last fight of storyline on Corellia

So anyone that thinks this game is to difficult is complete out of touch

What hurt TOR early on is people ripped through the content in a month and left having seen what they wanted to see.

EXACT same issue that plagued RIFT just after their launch as well

Games DONT need to get dumber and easier
They need to get more difficult so players have a sense of accomplishment when they do finally finish storyline 12-18 months after release.
In regards to lessening F2P and Preferred restrictions
In GAMING, as in LIFE,
You get what you pay for
No game restriction is so dire that $15.00/month will not eliminate it

CosmicKat's Avatar


CosmicKat
12.27.2012 , 04:26 PM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by Kalfear View Post
Gotta admit I stopped there because IF ANYTHING,

TOR is to simplistic and easy
NOT to difficult

....
Games DONT need to get dumber and easier
They need to get more difficult so players have a sense of accomplishment when they do finally finish storyline 12-18 months after release.
/agreed

This is, hands down, the easiest MMO ever made.

Not only is it simple, it is repetitively simple. PvE combat never changes, never progresses in difficulty. It's exactly the same from start to finish.

That repetitive simplicity is what kills this game for most people within 2-3 months of starting it.

pixieish's Avatar


pixieish
12.27.2012 , 05:21 PM | #34
I'm joining in with the "Not difficult, too repetitive" group. Pretty much once you figure out a good way to do something, you really don't have any reason to change out of it. Your companions for example. Only one or two are good, the rest don't really fit in, especially the latecomers after you've figured out how to survive without them.

If your companions actually did more than just stand around offering support and dps...

If mobs did more than just stare at you and occasionally heal each other...

If space combat was more than a glorified arcade shooter...

If you had actual vehicles to change things up a bit...

...suffice it to say, at no point in this game did I think to myself "gee, I wish this mob was even easier to kill".

GrimInc's Avatar


GrimInc
12.27.2012 , 06:01 PM | #35
Quote: Originally Posted by Cernow View Post
It's not mob difficulty as such, it's mob grind, caused by density, respawn and a lack of variety in mob combat behaviour.

The mobs themselves don't put up much of a fight, the vast majority don't have any interesting tactics, apart from a few healing mobs, and are entirely predictable. Most mobs just stand around in one place waiting to be cleared, like boring obstacles or roadblocks. There's no life to them, no patrols, no use of terrain or cover, no mobs running for help, no assistance from nearby mobs who impassively watch your fight (unless you're clumsy). They're just standing there in your way waiting to be knocked over like bowiling pins, with about as much life and personality as bowling pins. And because of the fast respawn you usually have clear the same mobs again on leaving the building / cave, which makes it even more tedious and immersion breaking. And just to add to this grindy feel, most mob packs contain at least one Strong, which makes AOE less effective and slows things down further.

So yes, it does create a kind of fatigue. In some games you look forward to combat, even if it is frequent. In TOR it can become a weary feeling of 'oh no, not this again'. Other games have similar problems with mob density and respawns, but for some reason it just feels worse in TOR. Perhaps it's because the story driven content doesn't mesh well with the grindy, unimaginative combat. It just feels to me that mobs exist in this game as roadblocks and target dummies to slow you down, not to give the world personality, variety, challenge, danger etc.
I have to agree with this post.
This Game has an amazing story.
Just seems 1 group made the game then another came in and stretched it out as everything inbetween story hot spots seems to be either fatigueing or obviously planted in your way.
Rule of Two
One to embody the power, the other to crave it

Vhaegrant's Avatar


Vhaegrant
12.27.2012 , 06:34 PM | #36
Not all classes or specs are created equal for levelling.

My first playthrough was a Bounty Hunter Powertech (Shield), the tank spec, with Mako for companion the playthrough was solid but predictably slow. No issue with boss fights or any other aspect of the story.

Sith Warrior Marauder playthrough was a struggle as I chose to level as Carnage spec (probably a better PvP tree) and with a DPS companion (ranged at first then changing to melee). Became far easier when changed to Anihilation spec for survivability with the self heal.

After these two the legacy system was introduced so I started to get multiple class buffs and a significant presence buff to my companions. Hard not to walk through the opposition now when levelling, when I have the companion on the starting world they can take down strongs and elites faster than I can.

At no point would I consider Mob difficulty an issue, if anything for the majority of the game they are far too easy and it's a struggle to keep your character at an appropriate level for the quests you are on.

If you think general mobs through levelling are too difficult wait until you find the Green Jedi Duellists on Corellia and the Jedi Commanders who use the double bladed sabres in [Poisonous Strategy] on Ilum (both of these will only be experienced by Imperial players). Or the good old school MMO overcrowding of mobs in Section X.

General hints.....

1) Learn the classes basic rotation. They tend to be no more than 3-5 abilities that have a sequential order to maximise DPS.

2) Put your interrupts somewhere easy to reach (keybinding is good, if you play multiple classes keep them in the same hotbar slots). Use them on strong/ elites/ healers.

3) Take out mobs in this general order: healers> weak> normal> strong> elite

4) If you have crowd control available use it (elite/ strong as the better targets don't waste it on a mob that's quick to kill), just remember to turn off your companions Area of Effect abilities.

5) If someone is telling you they can solo Heroic 4 it's most likely they are severly overlevelled with lots of legacy perks or playing a class with stealth and crowd control.

TheBBP's Avatar


TheBBP
12.27.2012 , 06:49 PM | #37
If I end up finally walking from the game, it will be due to a lack of forum moderation and community management during off-hours and weekends.
Crosswire - Republic Commando
Commander - The Way of the Maker Christian/Family-rated Guild
Ebon Hawk

EJedi's Avatar


EJedi
12.27.2012 , 06:52 PM | #38
If anything "killed" TOR, it's this...

Bioware Executives and EA Executives
If you pick up a novel, and see pages 2-899 only as obstacles between pages 1 and 900, then it may just be that you don't like reading.

Mallorik's Avatar


Mallorik
12.27.2012 , 07:01 PM | #39
If the solo pve in this game is too hard for you then i think you need to find another hobby, mmos just arent for you.

As for what killed this game? it happens to all games that are released half finished and not up to speed with its competition as far as game mechanics/qol features are concerned, and it will keep happening as long as game companies keep over looking the problem.

DethWraith's Avatar


DethWraith
12.27.2012 , 07:22 PM | #40
No, OP, I disagree. I didn't find the mobs difficult as I leveled, nor do I find them difficult at endgame. You just have to work on your gear. Whenever I had trouble as I was leveling, it was clearly a sign that I needed to work on my gear a bit... I'd upgrade some mods/barrels/armoring, go back and kill those mobs with ease.

The poison pill is the story and the lack of end game content, as someone else said earlier. The story is great, don't get me wrong. However, it draws you in, you enjoy it immensely... but then you get to the endgame, and it just drops off from there. You run the same OPS, FPs and dailies many times over, press the spacebar many times because you've already seen the story and no longer care to watch it... you gear up... and then... not much. Had they spent as much time working on the endgame as they did the story, the game would be wonderful. Perhaps the endgame will improve over time. I really hope it does. Until it does, people will continue to leave the game... it's inevitable. People get bored, and go do something else.

Honorable mention: the game engine. It's a mess.