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One planet is not an expansion

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
One planet is not an expansion
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Vitas's Avatar


Vitas
12.26.2012 , 11:20 PM | #511
Quote: Originally Posted by arunav View Post
I think they would have already announced that, if Varl was to be included. There's no way they would have left out a planet if it's on the way with Makeb. At best, there might be a quest that takes you there briefly, but I don't think Varl is coming in the expansion.
Varl, whilst an explorable world, would be more of a new dailies area like Black Hole and Section X. They still have more to reveal about the expansion, there's still hope that it could be that.
If you'd like to see more Explorable Worlds in Star Wars: The Old Republic,
then head to this thread and discuss, list and vote which you'd like to see and explore in the game:

Rezakh's Avatar


Rezakh
12.26.2012 , 11:26 PM | #512
Quote: Originally Posted by Altyrell View Post
10 brand new planets... really?

I'm guessing that you don't know just how hard it would be to create, code, make sure everything is good, nobody can fall through the word, etc.
I would say its pretty hard, cause they have yet to pull that one off.

I do not understand how folks are making comparisons to other MMO expansions concerning Makeb and justifying it as an expansion. By BW's own mouth, we're told it is equivalent in size and scope to the game's larger planets. That's 5-7 hours of playing time, watching cut-scenes, taking breaks, meandering through the content.

I really wonder the level of MMO experience defenders of Makeb actually have. If you love the game for what it is, great, I am right there with you. But to tell those that are trying to look at this as objectively as possible while being disappointed by the measures we have for the coming content so far is a bit beyond rough.

A typical MMO expansion is 1-2 days /played of leveling, a full gear reset, multiple raiding tiers (the first of which is usually ready at expac launch or very shortly after), new classes or races (typically, with a new structural model in the case of new races, so please refrain from the "cathar card" that probably is not even coming with Makeb), daily hubs (I admit, not a fan, but someone has to design those), along with new graphical designs for weapons, armor, buildings, terrain (not always), dungeons, and raids. There's also new development, or at least newish, concerning boss mechanics in dungeons and raids, and questing encounters/mobs in the leveling experience.

An expansion is worth the 20-40 dollars you plop down for them when they institute these features considering how much a player can receive out of it.

All this I am basing off of what BW has informed us of while taking into account MMO history, of the games I have played.

As for speculation, I presume based on the limited information we have at present, this "expansion" will most likely have less content than major content updates in other MMO's, minus...maybe, the new zone element...that's a bit disappointing.

My solution, do not buy it. But for those that want to have a constructive discussion, on EITHER side of the aisle, feel free to engage in that. But if you're going to bash people for what they post and not be civil, and I for one have been guilty of that, let's just refrain from posting.

For those that do like it and are purchasing it, despite the lack of information on it, I really hope you end up happy with it and it turns out to be enjoyable. Also, I wish I could see it the same way you do, I just cannot at this moment in time. However, I will certainly attempt to keep my perspective open, at least in the time before the release of it, since it would be unfair to place a concrete judgement on it when it has not been seen yet.

Bomyne's Avatar


Bomyne
12.26.2012 , 11:34 PM | #513
Quote: Originally Posted by Rezakh View Post
For those that do like it and are purchasing it, despite the lack of information on it, I really hope you end up happy with it and it turns out to be enjoyable. Also, I wish I could see it the same way you do, I just cannot at this moment in time. However, I will certainly attempt to keep my perspective open, at least in the time before the release of it, since it would be unfair to place a concrete judgement on it when it has not been seen yet.
For me $10 is chump change. I pay more for a meal at most fast food restaurants then I paid for Rise of the Hutt Cartel. The difference is that those meals are gone in 5 minutes. Rise of the Hutt Cartel will take a couple of hours at bare minimum.
"Sometimes, The obvious choice is the wrong choice."

Rezakh's Avatar


Rezakh
12.26.2012 , 11:46 PM | #514
Quote: Originally Posted by Bomyne View Post
For me $10 is chump change. I pay more for a meal at most fast food restaurants then I paid for Rise of the Hutt Cartel. The difference is that those meals are gone in 5 minutes. Rise of the Hutt Cartel will take a couple of hours at bare minimum.
Glad you can see it that way. I'm married with a baby, my wife and I are both college grads with 4 degrees between the 2 of us neither of which looking to give up their career paths. Long story short, there are times that there's little to no time to cook so eating out, even fast-food as nasty as that can be, ends up being more within the realm of necessity than luxury in those situations...given, rare situations. So, for us its pretty tough comparing food with video games.

Just our situation, not an argument. I remember when eating out was a pure luxury, but there are times when its really needed if you are avoiding eating super late or not at all.

But, I see the point. If you can spend $10 on a fast food meal, what's $10 for an expansion when both are entirely luxury/enjoyable items. Real life stuff just forces some to look at it very differently, which can be part of the hang up...maybe, not sure there.

And let's say, for you, worst case scenario Makeb is a complete bomb, OK, you lost a cheeseburger and fries, or a couple burritos, or whatever your fast food of choice is. I get it.

Eurynamous's Avatar


Eurynamous
12.27.2012 , 02:57 AM | #515
Here's the thing, even if its only quarter the content of an average MMO expansion. I am paying only a quarter the price of an average expansion. I bought this game with little to no info and have been very satisfied with that gamble. Could this bomb and be a joke? Sure, but BioWare will hear about it before I do. This game isn't horrendous and this expansion or quasi expansion won't be either. If it was a $40 price point and only releasing with what's been said on the forums, well yes, I would have one big *********** problem. But it's not, it's likely priced for its content size.

So why will I pay for it? I want to support this game, I want to fund the future projects that will hopefully expand and make this game great. Hell, if they put it on kickstarter and were transparent about every detail, I would likely still contribute money to get it "there".
The Red Zone
Amadus Starcrusher
I will take your light, force you into darkness and give you true freedom and power

Devlonir's Avatar


Devlonir
12.27.2012 , 03:06 AM | #516
Quote: Originally Posted by Ignicity View Post
Quite a while? Quite a while! Yup, Bioware is on the money with that accurate assumption. It's no wonder you believe them.

People will be 55 in 24 hours or less after head start launches. That really is "quite" a while, isn't it?
People were 70, 80, 85 and 90 in less than 24 hours in all of WoW's expansions. And they cost full price.

So, what is your point really? That some people are content locusts and rush just to be the first and the complain that they are bored? It's like finishing your Christmas Dinner in 2 minutes and then complaining you are bored because everyone else is still slowly enjoying theirs. You know who do that? The little annoying cousins.. the ones everyone wish would just shut up and let everyone else enjoy their Christmas dinner.

If the levelling arch is equal to 45-50 was, then most people will probably spend about a week or two of their playtime going through the quests and areas to get their 5 levels of experience. Even now, with my characters that I am rushing to 50 with boosts, it takes at least 3 evenings of 3-5 hour play sessions to get them from 45-50. And that is with skipping all dialogues except class stories.

But naw.. unbased hyperbole about no-lifers being able to do it in the first 24 hours of the new planet is what we need to measure content on. Not on actual facts and experience from what we have in game now and how the other 99% of the players play this game.
"Cows go 'Moo', Dogs go 'Woof', MMO Players go 'The PVP is unbalanced!" - Yahthzee
"I'm starting to get the feeling that BW and their MMO are not the dysfunctional ones." - Rafaman

Kazaganthis's Avatar


Kazaganthis
12.27.2012 , 04:55 AM | #517
Quote: Originally Posted by Devlonir View Post
People were 70, 80, 85 and 90 in less than 24 hours in all of WoW's expansions. And they cost full price.

So, what is your point really? That some people are content locusts and rush just to be the first and the complain that they are bored? It's like finishing your Christmas Dinner in 2 minutes and then complaining you are bored because everyone else is still slowly enjoying theirs. You know who do that? The little annoying cousins.. the ones everyone wish would just shut up and let everyone else enjoy their Christmas dinner.

If the levelling arch is equal to 45-50 was, then most people will probably spend about a week or two of their playtime going through the quests and areas to get their 5 levels of experience. Even now, with my characters that I am rushing to 50 with boosts, it takes at least 3 evenings of 3-5 hour play sessions to get them from 45-50. And that is with skipping all dialogues except class stories.

But naw.. unbased hyperbole about no-lifers being able to do it in the first 24 hours of the new planet is what we need to measure content on. Not on actual facts and experience from what we have in game now and how the other 99% of the players play this game.
Speaking of hyperbole. Dont you ever get tired of biodefending and making crap up because you cant handle this game has more than its fair share of flaws?

Devlonir's Avatar


Devlonir
12.27.2012 , 06:03 AM | #518
Quote: Originally Posted by Kazaganthis View Post
Speaking of hyperbole. Dont you ever get tired of biodefending and making crap up because you cant handle this game has more than its fair share of flaws?
How is it hyperbole? It is a well known fact that less than 1% of all players rush to go through all content as quickly as possible just to be back at endgame level. WoW itself often said statistics along the lines of: Even now, 2 months after Wrath launch, only 20% of all accounts have a level 80 character. And that game was all about being endgame, the actual levelling is nothing near the quality that this game has.
My 1% was pointed at the group of people who focus solely on being max level as quickly as possible, leaving all other things aside, after a level cap raise. This is a very, very small minority. Just because you and your guild/group of friends are (possibly) a part of it, doesn't mean that most people play these games that way.

I can handle all flaws in this game, but stating that a small minority of players will rush through content and that content, therefore, will not be enough is much more 'made up crap' than what you accuse me of.

But yeah, being fully anti (or fully supporting) something beyond all reason is something too much posters on this forum prefer over an honest debate on the facts we do have. Facts like the amount of times it takes to do 45-50, how much time the largest planets with most quests can take, and experience from other, similar, MMO's and how the levelling curve is among players in those. All of those things are points I put forward.

I refer to my non-PVP quote in my sig and bid you farewell sir.
"Cows go 'Moo', Dogs go 'Woof', MMO Players go 'The PVP is unbalanced!" - Yahthzee
"I'm starting to get the feeling that BW and their MMO are not the dysfunctional ones." - Rafaman

Oggthebase's Avatar


Oggthebase
12.27.2012 , 07:17 AM | #519
The issue here is not about:
- the content of the so-called expansion
- the amount of money it is being charged for

The issue is that Makeb was developped with our 2012 subscription money and planned as being included in that subscription model.

I understand that F2P came crashing in the middle of summer and sent all developers working on F2P instead of Makeb, but it's still the subscribers money that went into both projects.

Making subscribers pay a second time for something they've already paid is really a low blow to people who've supported the game throughout the year and I don't intend to give anymore money to Bioscrooge for Makeb.

Mercathode's Avatar


Mercathode
12.27.2012 , 11:08 AM | #520
Quote: Originally Posted by Oggthebase View Post
The issue here is not about:
- the content of the so-called expansion
- the amount of money it is being charged for

The issue is that Makeb was developped with our 2012 subscription money and planned as being included in that subscription model.

I understand that F2P came crashing in the middle of summer and sent all developers working on F2P instead of Makeb, but it's still the subscribers money that went into both projects.

Making subscribers pay a second time for something they've already paid is really a low blow to people who've supported the game throughout the year and I don't intend to give anymore money to Bioscrooge for Makeb.
When they went F2P all that **** they said before that went out the window. I agree, it kinda sucks but that's the new business model. Not complaining really as $10 is just $10 but they should throw the loyals a bone though.