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Malavai Quinn


Perihelion's Avatar


Perihelion
12.18.2012 , 08:47 PM | #31
Eh, after my initial anger and disappointment, I've reconsidered my position. Quinn is nothing but a pawn, albeit a useful one. I'd keep him alive, now, because with his failure, I believe he would be utterly loyal now. His biggest thing is his career, and face it, he killed a Moff (even though its a useless Moff) and killing a superior officer is something that he would most likely be executed for. His career would be over just due to that, he failed Baras, he failed the SW, he failed the Imperial Military that he loves so much. Who knows that he killed a moff? No one yet, except my SW. My SW would keep him alive and hold that little secret against him. He would be an ideal tool. My SW now has a hold on him, much like Baras had a hold on him before. He is more useful to my SW then Jaesa and Broonmark are. I would rather get rid of them, quite frankly. Jaesa is a giant disappointment, what good is her special power?

_Darkstar's Avatar


_Darkstar
12.19.2012 , 06:30 AM | #32
Quote: Originally Posted by Perihelion View Post
Jaesa is a giant disappointment, what good is her special power?
And more importantly, why weren't you given the option for her to use it on all yuor companions, thus getting to the bottom of the whole Quinn thing.
British by act of union, English by grace of God, Northern by pure good fortune!

Xonell's Avatar


Xonell
12.19.2012 , 06:48 AM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by _Darkstar View Post
And more importantly, why weren't you given the option for her to use it on all yuor companions, thus getting to the bottom of the whole Quinn thing.
Oh heck yeah. The first thing my SW would have done is ask her to use that power on everyone.
X0-NL, Archivist and Librarian Droid.

Xonell's Avatar


Xonell
12.19.2012 , 07:11 AM | #34
Quote: Originally Posted by Phyreblade View Post
... There is so much that isn't captured in the in-game scenes, enough I can only assume the developers themselves left it fairly open-ended so that we could RP it ourselves, shrug.
That's what I mean by head-canon. It's very easy to spin the event several different ways. That doesn't make it bad. However, players do need to recognize where the writing stops and their own version begins.

Quote:
However, given the fact we KNOW that Baras is a master manipulator AND a liar AND a betrayer AND the sort of fellow who'll pull whatever string he possibly can in order to further his own goals -- it's simply not reasonable to think he wouldn't coerce Quinn into doing as he wanted.
Let's put it this way -- unless it was outright mind control, which it wasn't -- Quinn is a genuine traitor. He wasn't passively siding with Baras. He actively sided with him. He believed in Baras so much that he was willing to betray the Emperor. That's a huge deal. The cool, smug way he speaks to you in the betrayal scene is the real Quinn.

Quote:
Also, given the fact that Quinn does NOTHING through nearly the entire game that paints him as anything less than truly respectful of the warrior, even loving if the warrior is a female
Because Baras told him to! Everything Quinn said to you was based on a lie. Baras wanted a mole on your ship and he got one. Baras can't tell you to accept this stranger outright. You'd never trust him. So Quinn and Baras put on a little show on Balmorra. Quinn pretends to choose to serve you because he finds you inspiring. Quinn helps you because that's what Baras needs. It was all a setup. It was Quinn's job. Maybe some of the personal stuff was genuine but, ultimately, it was meaningless if he doesn't side with you when the chips are down.

Quote:
... it's not unheard of to consider that ANYTHING he had to say during the events on the Transponder Station was complete and utter hogwash. Either he was putting on show for Baras, if that's what you want to RP. Me, I tend to believe he said whatever he had to in order to make the warrior angry, because that's easier for him to face than her being hurt. It's totally up to you.
If Quinn were loyal to you over Baras, or coerced, you would have been told somehow. The writer would have made it clear. Quinn had every chance to work with you, to warn you, to set something up, but he doesn't. I think Quinn was just hoping things would work out between you and Baras, but when it doesn't, oh well. He "regrets" it, and rather unemotionally at that.
X0-NL, Archivist and Librarian Droid.

JamieKirby's Avatar


JamieKirby
12.19.2012 , 07:46 AM | #35
Well, if bioware did the companion system correctly where you could use any companion and not have the gameplay adversely affected by it, then i would have killed him for betraying me.

Raynezazki's Avatar


Raynezazki
12.19.2012 , 10:59 AM | #36
Quote: Originally Posted by Bleeters View Post
Eh. He was rude to Vette. I've killed people for less.
and my SW killed people for being less rude to him than Vette but for some reason she gets a free pass

Honestly if I wanted to gimp myself and have no crafting horses the game should've let that happen. It's called CONSEQUENCES.

kalistea's Avatar


kalistea
12.19.2012 , 01:12 PM | #37
Quote: Originally Posted by Xonell View Post
Because Baras told him to! Everything Quinn said to you was based on a lie. .
I disagree on this, I also went through the whole SW story twice and recorded all the vids. If you look into it you can find several proofs that Quinn is genuinely loyal to the SW.

A few examples (spoilers there) :

On Tatooine
Spoiler


On Hoth, the second time you get there :
Spoiler


I guess it's not so much an issue of headcanon versus canon, but more how biased you are towards the character and how you choose to focus on what's good or what's bad about him.


Quote: Originally Posted by Phyreblade View Post
I've enjoyed two seperate warrior playthroughs and watched countless youtube videos describing the incident itself, actually. I ultimately played it the way that made the most sense to me, anyway. There is so much that isn't captured in the in-game scenes, enough I can only assume the developers themselves left it fairly open-ended so that we could RP it ourselves, shrug.

However, given the fact we KNOW that Baras is a master manipulator AND a liar AND a betrayer AND the sort of fellow who'll pull whatever string he possibly can in order to further his own goals -- it's simply not reasonable to think he wouldn't coerce Quinn into doing as he wanted. Also, given the fact that Quinn does NOTHING through nearly the entire game that paints him as anything less than truly respectful of the warrior, even loving if the warrior is a female -- i.e. he didn't attack the warrior, fail the warrior, stab the warrior in the back, try in any way to undermine the warrior, and certainly didn't try to kill the warrior even given the numerous opportunities available in which he could have -- it's perfectly reasonable to assume he was coerced.

No way to know what form that coercian took, mind you. There are any number of coercive tactics that Baras might have employed, though. Having watched Baras turn a man's brain into a puddle of goo, though, I don't imagine he would've (1) hesitated or (2) been kind about it.

Finally, if we're to buy into the notion that Quinn was coerced, it's not unheard of to consider that ANYTHING he had to say during the events on the Transponder Station was complete and utter hogwash. Either he was putting on show for Baras, if that's what you want to RP. Me, I tend to believe he said whatever he had to in order to make the warrior angry, because that's easier for him to face than her being hurt. It's totally up to you.
I agree with you on this Phyreblade

Phyreblade's Avatar


Phyreblade
12.19.2012 , 01:15 PM | #38
Quote: Originally Posted by Xonell View Post
That's what I mean by head-canon. It's very easy to spin the event several different ways. That doesn't make it bad. However, players do need to recognize where the writing stops and their own version begins.
Indeed.

Quote: Originally Posted by Xonell View Post
Let's put it this way -- unless it was outright mind control, which it wasn't -- Quinn is a genuine traitor. He wasn't passively siding with Baras. He actively sided with him. He believed in Baras so much that he was willing to betray the Emperor. That's a huge deal. The cool, smug way he speaks to you in the betrayal scene is the real Quinn.
Shrug, Sith can pull some pretty nifty mind tricks. They're not even bothered by the use of such methods, as the Jedi might be, in fact. There's just no way, whatsoever, to know what Baras asked of Quinn, directed Quinn to do, or otherwise made of Quinn, though. Not ever. You simply can't say Quinn wasn't coerced or tricked or otherwise manipulated, not enough to declare "it never happened."

Quote: Originally Posted by Xonell View Post
Because Baras told him to! Everything Quinn said to you was based on a lie. Baras wanted a mole on your ship and he got one. Baras can't tell you to accept this stranger outright. You'd never trust him. So Quinn and Baras put on a little show on Balmorra. Quinn pretends to choose to serve you because he finds you inspiring. Quinn helps you because that's what Baras needs. It was all a setup. It was Quinn's job. Maybe some of the personal stuff was genuine but, ultimately, it was meaningless if he doesn't side with you when the chips are down.
My warrior knew exactly what Quinn was doing on her ship, pretty much from the get-go. Common sense dictates that the master who routinely directs spies across both the Empire and the Republic is going to have a spy watching her own rear-end, too. Quinn's request to join her crew is taken precisely in full understanding of his real purpose, there.

So ask yourself, as I did:

Spoiler


Seriously, how do you imagine Baras told him to do THAT? And why, for pete's sake?

Spoiler


The only thing that makes sense, honestly, is that by that point in the game, no, Quinn is NOT more loyal to Baras anymore. Even if he initially approached the warrior because Baras demanded it of him. That means that sometime after Belsavis, Quinn had to be approached and somehow coerced by Baras to act as he was told to. It's just the only thing that makes sense, is all.

Quote: Originally Posted by Xonell View Post
If Quinn were loyal to you over Baras, or coerced, you would have been told somehow. The writer would have made it clear. Quinn had every chance to work with you, to warn you, to set something up, but he doesn't. I think Quinn was just hoping things would work out between you and Baras, but when it doesn't, oh well. He "regrets" it, and rather unemotionally at that.
Quinn makes it a point to tell your warrior of his devotion, respect, and loyalty, funnily enough. My warrior was told he'd serve even her legacy, in fact.
"Why can't things be easy? Just once!"
-- Gaibriel, Sawbones Scoundrel on the Shadowlands Server

Xonell's Avatar


Xonell
12.19.2012 , 09:51 PM | #39
Wow. There's some serious fan-girling going on in this thread.

Rather than argue all day about an awful character and poorly-thought out writing and numerous plot holes, I will just say this.

Quinn is poop.
X0-NL, Archivist and Librarian Droid.

Surinen's Avatar


Surinen
12.19.2012 , 09:53 PM | #40
Quote: Originally Posted by Xonell View Post
Wow. There's some serious fan-girling going on in this thread.

Rather than argue all day about an awful character and poorly-thought out writing and numerous plot holes, I will just say this.

Quinn is poop.
and I should be able to put the samer collar that Vette wears and choke him from time to time and then choke him a little bit more until he expires. Pity that he is unkillable