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Gamasutra: The Burning of Star Wars - The Old Republic

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Gamasutra: The Burning of Star Wars - The Old Republic

SaijaRii's Avatar


SaijaRii
12.17.2012 , 07:35 PM | #101
I agree with the article.
There is nothing older than the idea that this is new. ~ Thomas Sowell.

Urael's Avatar


Urael
12.17.2012 , 07:39 PM | #102
Quote: Originally Posted by Korrlen View Post
I read through the article when it was released, and through the comments once those picked up later.
I have to say, I'm disappointed with Gamasutra for approving this article. While there are great points contained within, it's hidden within hyperbole, ranting, and tacky internet memes. Keep in mind Gamasutra is a website for professional game developers and designers.

He could have taken an unbiased analysis of the game, but instead opted to post a long negative diatribe. The fact that he posts much more eloquently within the comment section supports the idea of the article simply being click bait.
I will leave it to you to find. But, I posted his comments regarding the tone in this thread. Read that and see what he has to say.

Urael's Avatar


Urael
12.17.2012 , 07:40 PM | #103
Quote: Originally Posted by SaijaRii View Post
I agree with the article.
I read this and then your sig and honestly can't tell if you are being ironic.

Korrlen's Avatar


Korrlen
12.17.2012 , 07:41 PM | #104
Quote: Originally Posted by Urael View Post
I will leave it to you to find. But, I posted his comments regarding the tone in this thread. Read that and see what he has to say.
I will leave it for you to find, but I mentioned that I've read the article and his replies in their entirety; even making a comment on his replies.

The article was highly unprofessional on a site dedicated to professionals. It was far more suited to someplace like kotaku.

Elyxin's Avatar


Elyxin
12.17.2012 , 07:43 PM | #105
First off, while I wasn't initially a fan of the authors tone, he did explain it in a comment ( I read further as many didn't), and it makes sense. although I still feel that there is a bit of edge there most likely due to personal disappointment...which I think we all echo at certain levels, even someone like myself who still really enjoys playing the game.

While I'm not a fan of f2p myself, I have no issues with it as a mechanic...IF DONE WELL. A good example of this would be the early f2p release of LotRO, Turbines current flagship. I haven't played LotRO in awhile now (considering taking it back up), So not sure about it's current state, but when they initially introduced f2p, it was a very good design. So I'll pull a few points out of their system that I believe Bio could have done to make a very effective f2p system, but they didn't.

the biggest was that Turbine never locked stuff away from subs like Bio is doing. all the cash shop items were available in game if you took the time. whether it was a rep grind, or a seasonal quest, it was there. you want it right away and now? cash shop is to your left. Choice was they key here...and the fact that they held true to their word and never kept anything locked from the Sub's. only thing as a sub you ever HAD to pay for to get was expansions. and before someone says you don't have to pay in SW...you do. those nifty gearset designs in the cash shop? can't get them anywhere in the game. turbine NEVER did that. you could get everything in game....it just took time. anything that is a CC "exclusive" means that a sub is locked out, period.

second biggest issue is that you could earn points. Wasn't huge, and it took massive effort to get even close to what a sub did (and theoretically it was impossible to get EVERYTHING a sub had, but you could get darn close). but the time investment to do so was HUGE. most people with a life and a 9-5 couldn't do it...but it was STILL THERE. And it didn't kill Turbine...as a matter of fact, their model (used in DDO as well) really set some industry records for f2p. they essentially woke the industry up to the IDEA that f2p was a viable alternative to a full sub environment (prior to that, f2p was relegated to dying games and smaller releases).

Plus, they had a bunch of stuff in the shop that really made you want to spend money...and not in a way that focused around cash shop exclusives (horrible way to getting peeps to spend cash). it was more like cash = QoL. don't want to farm materials for crafting? by limited craft mats in the store (bound and sold for a copper, but great for leveling a craft or crafting your own stuff). want that holiday gear? wait for the holiday, or cash shop + instant results. want to unlock a side quest area? farm the points with deeds....or insta-cash. it was really the "try or buy" option. Until bio gets the point, and gives us all that stuff in game (gotta earn it tho), then the balance is off and the CC sucks. the lock out method IMO just pisses people off, it doesn't inspire them to want to try and buy.

Urael's Avatar


Urael
12.17.2012 , 07:47 PM | #106
Quote: Originally Posted by Korrlen View Post
I will leave it for you to find, but I mentioned that I've read the article and his replies in their entirety; even making a comment on his replies.
From the second paragraph that you wrote there is no supporting evidence that you did in fact "read all". I call shenanigans. In fairness to the author you should have mentioned his poor attempt at posting sarcastically on purpose as part of that paragraph to indicate that you read the authors response. Otherwise you come off as not being objective and just another "white knight" saying that anyone pointing out something about SWTOR must be wrong when SWTOR still has much to fix. Whether you agree with the tone or not. The author wrote what I have been saying all along here on these forums as many have that want SWTOR to succeed but, are not happy with the current state of the game. It surprises me how low the bar has gotten for an acceptable product. I am also surprised that people defend a souless company that is just taking their cash and not giving them a quality product in exchange. *boggle*

Korrlen's Avatar


Korrlen
12.17.2012 , 07:57 PM | #107
Quote: Originally Posted by Urael View Post
From the second paragraph that you wrote there is no supporting evidence that you did in fact "read all". I call shenanigans. In fairness to the author you should have mentioned his poor attempt at posting sarcastically on purpose as part of that paragraph to indicate that you read the authors response. Otherwise you come off as not being objective and just another "white knight" saying that anyone pointing out something about SWTOR must be wrong when SWTOR still has much to fix. Whether you agree with the tone or not. The author wrote what I have been saying all along here on these forums as many have that want SWTOR to succeed but, are not happy with the current state of the game. It surprises me how low the bar has gotten for an acceptable product. I am also surprised that people defend a souless company that is just taking their cash and not giving them a quality product in exchange. *boggle*
Perhaps you have me confused for someone else. I'm only attacking the professionalism of this journalist in the context of Gamasutra. It was an extremely juvenile article which read more like a rant (and perhaps even a convoluted request for a job). I'm certainly not what you continually refer to in this thread as a White Knight, nor have I defended anything BioWare related. But writing an objective article to spur healthy conversation about the real issues at hand used to mean something. This 3 page "Feature" (not posted as an opinion piece / in the blogs section) will spark nothing but flame warring, which you and many others have fallen for.

From my very first sentence:
"I read through the article when it was released, and through the comments once those picked up later."

And from my last sentence:
"The fact that he posts much more eloquently within the comment section supports the idea of the article simply being click bait."

Both indicate I completely read through the article and replies in the comment section. Whatever tone the author intentionally took, it was inappropriate if he genuinely wished for progress to happen with this game.

TheNahash's Avatar


TheNahash
12.17.2012 , 08:13 PM | #108
Why is this article important?
No, seriously, why?

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. You can hate or love the game. What you can't do is make it something it isn't. It's not GW2, it's not Tera, it's not Rift and it's not Wow. It's a different beast with its own high and low points. But at the end of the day a person's opinion about how much the game failed or not, is just that - his/her opinion. And it's of so little importance that it's kind of funny.

The only question you should be asking is whether you are still enjoying the game - or if you ever did. Don't expect a journalist to tell you whether you should like it or not. Do that yourself.

If you are, like I am, then his opinion is so uninteresting and unimportant, that the only thing it adds is a few bytes to the site's forum.
If you are not (and this will sound familiar) then you shouldn't be playing the game. Plain and simple. Why bother? Free or not, if you're not enjoying it you shouldn't be playing it. Let it "die".

Go try to find a game that you will like more.

Why bother beating what you consider a dead horse?

I will never understand some people's need to spoil the fun for everyone else.

PS: For the record, I'd say the exact same thing if his article was about how awesome the game is. Of course, I'd agree more than I do now, but still I wouldn't really care about some guy's opinion, whom I do not know nor care about.

Urael's Avatar


Urael
12.17.2012 , 11:49 PM | #109
Quote: Originally Posted by Korrlen View Post
Perhaps you have me confused for someone else. I'm only attacking the professionalism of this journalist in the context of Gamasutra. It was an extremely juvenile article which read more like a rant (and perhaps even a convoluted request for a job). I'm certainly not what you continually refer to in this thread as a White Knight, nor have I defended anything BioWare related. But writing an objective article to spur healthy conversation about the real issues at hand used to mean something. This 3 page "Feature" (not posted as an opinion piece / in the blogs section) will spark nothing but flame warring, which you and many others have fallen for.

From my very first sentence:
"I read through the article when it was released, and through the comments once those picked up later."

And from my last sentence:
"The fact that he posts much more eloquently within the comment section supports the idea of the article simply being click bait."

Both indicate I completely read through the article and replies in the comment section. Whatever tone the author intentionally took, it was inappropriate if he genuinely wished for progress to happen with this game.
His replay (which I posted in this thread) was a reclama. He admitted his tone, done in a jest style of "Stephen Colbert" or "John Stewart", fell short. If you say as you claim that you are being objective, then perhaps an acknowledgement of his failure in your post and a retort to his style would have helped to cement your stance as being objective. I will grant you based on your replies that you did read as you said but, I am curious why you didn't include any indication that the author did attempt to appoligize for the tone and attempt to asuage those to read his original text in a new light.

Urael's Avatar


Urael
12.17.2012 , 11:58 PM | #110
Quote: Originally Posted by TheNahash View Post
Why is this article important?
No, seriously, why?
In reply to your query, this article is important because, there are others, besides those that post on this forum, that see that SWTOR, may be in trouble. Many of us, while we post about "issues" that others would "hide", really do wish this game to succeed. The author's article merely echoed a view that is held by some on these forums. We wish the game to succeed but, on the current path that SWTOR is on, we are not confident. We still wish success for the game but, we still hold EA and BW to task to live up to what they hyped.