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PvE 1.4 DPS Numbers/Stats/Specs

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sage / Sorcerer
PvE 1.4 DPS Numbers/Stats/Specs

Pitzzin's Avatar


Pitzzin
10.06.2012 , 02:33 PM | #1
I am curious how much dps sorcerers can and should be doing, because as fully optimized and in Lightning Spec as I am, still getting my beat by the guilds sniper/mara.

I play 3/31/7 Lightning, have the following stats buffed /rakata stim:
Willpower: 2290
Power: 1062 (1050.8 bonus damage)
F. Power: 1298
Crit: 170 (34.68%)
Surge: 228 (73.64%)
Alacrity: 345 (10.39%)

With this I'm averaging about 1650 on the ops dummy and am curious were everyone else is at and if you're doing more, what are you doing differently?
Thank you!

Malinok's Avatar


Malinok
10.08.2012 , 03:07 PM | #2
Lightening can do far more if you have the option to stand still, but in most ops, especially EC and TFB you dont get that option so lightening suffers more than madness or madness hyrbid will.

I only pull 1620 on ops dummy as 1/12/28, however in raids I am out dps'ing lightening sorc by 150 or more and occassionally (but not often) Sniper/Mara depending on the fight.

Raid Buffed Stats Below

Spec - 1/12/28
(consistantly in a 5 min run on Dummy Lightening Barrage procs 19-21 times, which to me is worth it)

Bonus Damage - 955.8
Crit Chance - 38.1%
Crit Multiplier - 75.8%
Alacrity - 8.??% (its 8 something odd percent, cant remember the decimal)

Looking at classes and numbers in a vacuume top dps should be Mara then Sniper then Sorc or Merc. Not sure about Powertech. If you think about it, Sniper and Mara are only pure DPS classes anyway, so it sort of makes sense they ouput more, all 3 of their tree are dps. Where as Sorc, Merc, Operative, Jugg, BH all have option of a secondary either tanking or Healing in addition to dps.

Just throwing in extra info, I prefer Madness Sorc and Arsenal Merc because the rotation is so simple and hard to eff up. It's much less to keep track of than a sniper or mara.

It's nice to work to improve and want to be top dps, but if your guild is clearing content without struggle, and you are pulling 1250-1450 dps on Hard Mode EC/TFB (using Ask Mr Robot not Mox) than you are fine and dont need to worry too much. Sure you could do more, but that range is more than sufficient to kill bosses well before enrage.

Im sure there are people doing more, and thoe who will post saying "ZOMG YOUR DPS SUCKS* but different meters handle down time diff. Any idle time in combat using in game log loaded to ask mr robot counts against you. So if during a boss fight you have to spend 15 seconds moving or standing idle that 15 seconds is counted against your per second into it as essentually 0dps over 15 sec. Where as some other pars only calculate dps while you are physically attacking, not just in combat, which falsly inflated your dps since it essentially eliminates your downtime.

Again, if your guild is not hitting enrage, and your dps is close to or in line with others, dont worry. If in split fights you are always on the side thats behind, example zorn and toth or stormcaller firebrand, than maybe you need to work on your raid live spec/rotation.

If you are pulling 1650 in actual raids, your perfectly fine as a sorc!
Berothius - Sorc DPS - Agríŕs - Sage DPS
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schnopsnosn's Avatar


schnopsnosn
10.09.2012 , 11:24 AM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by Malinok View Post
I only pull 1620 on ops dummy as 1/12/28, however in raids I am out dps'ing lightening sorc by 150 or more and occassionally (but not often) Sniper/Mara depending on the fight.
Then I have to say you haven't played with a good Lightning-Sorc, let alone a good Marauder.

SoonerJBD's Avatar


SoonerJBD
10.10.2012 , 01:27 AM | #4
All things equal (gear, experience, etc.) a marauder or sniper will out-DPS a Sorcerer. But all things are rarely equal. I do more DPS on my sorcerer alt than the marauders I raid with even though they have better gear than me. Why? Because I know the instances like the back of my hand. I double-DoT Toth and Zorn, catch them both with Death Field when Toth jumps to Zorn. Same on Jarg and Sorno. Even on single bosses, knowing when to move and how to stay in range just makes a world of difference, not to mention mechanics that take melee players out of the fight for short periods.

All that said, it would be nice if they tuned the DPS specs so that they are all within 5 percent of each other, as they said they intended a while back.

TRUEJEDIBLOOD's Avatar


TRUEJEDIBLOOD
12.16.2012 , 10:41 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by SoonerJBD View Post
All things equal (gear, experience, etc.) a marauder or sniper will out-DPS a Sorcerer. But all things are rarely equal. I do more DPS on my sorcerer alt than the marauders I raid with even though they have better gear than me. Why? Because I know the instances like the back of my hand. I double-DoT Toth and Zorn, catch them both with Death Field when Toth jumps to Zorn. Same on Jarg and Sorno. Even on single bosses, knowing when to move and how to stay in range just makes a world of difference, not to mention mechanics that take melee players out of the fight for short periods.

All that said, it would be nice if they tuned the DPS specs so that they are all within 5 percent of each other, as they said they intended a while back.
The marauders you play with must be shocking cause the Mara/ pwertech we use destroys sorcs in dps.
If ur not healing in pve, or dps just for pvp re-roll cause that's about all sorcs are good for raid wise.
And as for the 5 percent within eachother then maybe sorcs would be useful in pve raids

Suzina's Avatar


Suzina
12.17.2012 , 03:29 PM | #6
DPS differs from boss to boss.
DPSing in Karagga nightmare against G4 is going to yield you better DPS numbers than the dummy. Most raids your dps numbers should absolutely go down.

Dps also differs from group to group.
If you believe you can make a judgement about a DPS number in-raid without first hearing what armor debuffs were used in the group and how consistently they were applied, then you are either psychic or rush to judgement with inadequate data.

DPS numbers also differ depending on your equipment.
If you can determine someone's skill based on a DPS number (especially determine they are "bad") without first knowing what they are wearing, you are either psychic or rush to judgement with inadequate data.


Here's my take: comparing yourself to your guild/group mates is definitely the way to go. You and your fellow raiders are doing the same content together and therefore likely wearing the same level of gear and obtaining their numbers under similar conditions. Sometimes, there's a disparity (example, marauder is next to you armor debuffing stormcaller but your buddy is off fighting firebrand). But generally speaking it's an apples-to-apples comparison. Comparing your dummy-tests to your friend's dummy tests is also an apples-to-apples comparison.

Expect numbers will be different in the field. Sometimes a person in the field can buff their numbers in a way that doesn't help the raid (AOEing twisted spawn during the burn phase of Writhing Horror), sometimes a person will think of a great innovation to help their DPS (adding affliction to multiple tentacles or onto the boss himself to get more lightning barrages in TFB last boss). Whatever the numbers say, here's the bottom line:

There is no skill meter in this game.
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SoonerJBD's Avatar


SoonerJBD
12.17.2012 , 04:25 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by TRUEJEDIBLOOD View Post
The marauders you play with must be shocking cause the Mara/ pwertech we use destroys sorcs in dps.
If ur not healing in pve, or dps just for pvp re-roll cause that's about all sorcs are good for raid wise.
And as for the 5 percent within eachother then maybe sorcs would be useful in pve raids
You are bad. Go away.

Sorcs are perfectly viable for DPS in raids. I've cleared TFB HM and I do 1700 DPS on Writhing Horror and Dread Guard, for example. You can clear any available content with Sorc DPS. They are fine for raiding.

MisterMuse's Avatar


MisterMuse
12.18.2012 , 05:05 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by SoonerJBD View Post
You are bad. Go away.

Sorcs are perfectly viable for DPS in raids. I've cleared TFB HM and I do 1700 DPS on Writhing Horror and Dread Guard, for example. You can clear any available content with Sorc DPS. They are fine for raiding.
How are your stats optimized, I myself get around 1400-1500 on those with Madness or 1-12-28 hybrid and I'm somwhere around 35 %crit, 76% Surge, 1030 bonus damage and 9% Alacrity.
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Fahér - Combat Sentinel
Jahír - Vigilance Guardian
Sahír - Assault Vanguard

Sacery's Avatar


Sacery
12.19.2012 , 12:53 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by SoonerJBD View Post
You are bad. Go away.

Sorcs are perfectly viable for DPS in raids. I've cleared TFB HM and I do 1700 DPS on Writhing Horror and Dread Guard, for example. You can clear any available content with Sorc DPS. They are fine for raiding.
You talk about encounters where you´re able to push your dps through multi-dotting but single target DPS of a sorc is about 1500-1700 MAX (depending on situation and setup and a bit of crit luck btw: TFB Boss 1 and 2 you can do way more than 1700). But you´re right, sorc is fine up until Kephess NiM. Without PT AND a Marauder dps (both 2100++) the sorc is useless and other classes are prefered because even a merc is able to do 1800-1900dps much easier than a sorc can do 1600-1700. To kill kephess NiM you need 7600-8200 SINGLE target raid dps - Sorcs get around 1600 to a MAX of 1680 at that encounter (depends on movement) and if your raid aint got one or two dps classes at 2000+ dps you´ll end up enraged at 10-20%.

You can push your dps with AOE and multi-dotting on every mob (i confess i do that with the dread guard encounter even if it is not recommended). But tbh Sorc is FAR away from "just fine" or "work as intended" because every other class can out-dps you if they can play thier class. Talking about future content you can´t deny the sorc class NEEDS a buff concerning DPS output. If others dont take care of your dps loss you´re lost as a sorc and if the next encounters coming require the same or even more dps to even avoid Enrage at all, sorcs might become even more useless. Mercs can do more AOE damage. Even with a lightning strike build mercs do more AOE than a sorc - thats just a matter of numbers not of skill. You cannot do more than keep your rotation/prio up and have a perfect movement at the encounter. In the end it all comes down to numbers. Considering Inquisitor is the ONLY class using light armor and is pretty much onehit by every boss if you over-aggro, doesn´t have a strong def-cd or anything to protect himself AND dealing the weakest damage of all classes since 1.2 there have to be a dps buff about 35-40%. Make one misstake at any encounter every class deals more damage than you do - do a misstake with marauder or pt or even merc or sniper they still deal more dps than needed - that is just NOT fair at all. Rule #1 for MMO classes - weakest armor and deff, most aggro production must be one of the top DPS/HPS classes - that makes sense pvp/pve and even story wise - take them out quick because they are dangerous.

TLDR: Average 1650-1700 dps might be enough for now if others deal even more than they have to, but end up as the weakest dps class at most encounters (single target-dps is what matters!) , wearing light armor easy to over-aggro a jugg and sometimes even assassins without any real deff-cd is just ridiculous - you work your *** off and do everything perfect but not able to do top dps is just a big design/balance fail.

sorry for my english - lack a bit of practice these days.
"Since Oct. 2008"

veyl's Avatar


veyl
12.19.2012 , 01:14 PM | #10
^ @ this guy. The amount of people doing 2k+ on kephess can be counted on one hand and those "high" parses are because of AOE phases during the Trandoshans.

If you're talking about doing 2k while the warstrider is on the ground, that's another story... because you have bloodthirst + trinket + adrenal..etc..etc. Even sorcs should be able to topple over 2k during the down phases.