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Kaggath Series: Darth Sidious vs Sith Emperor

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > STAR WARS Discussion
Kaggath Series: Darth Sidious vs Sith Emperor

Rayla_Felana's Avatar


Rayla_Felana
12.14.2012 , 01:49 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by MasterMe View Post
I don't mean to be snappish, but there seems to be a lot of speculation here due to not having info regarding the SE.

1. Sidious's ships get zero tech advantage per Kaggath rules. They only get to be better tech-wise if they were awesome in their time (they were awesome for their time, but so were the SE's ships)

2. GE's won't have more ships then the SE. The SE has been building for a thousand years I think? They're be making ships just as, if not faster, then the GE's ships.

I just can't think of anything that would suggest that Sidious's fleet would be bigger then Vitiate's. Heck, I would think Vitiate's fleet would be bigger since they'd been growing for a thousand years.
The Star Destroyers are bigger, have more guns, have more shield generators and can carry more fighters, there are also well over 20,000 of them, The main Imperial Navy for the SE is seen right there in the game and then you have the Dark Council's fleets, twelve of them, a real match for the 20,000 SDs on the Empire's side.

You really think that the SE has a larger industry than the GALACTIC Empire? I would suggest looking it up, do remember that the Sith didn't take any of the Republic's industry, they blew it to hell, which is mused on as a fool's mistake later on in the Cold War by Malgus, doesn't matter how much time you have when your opponent has far more shipyards, most of which is run by the Kuat Drive Yards, a monster organization by the time of the galactic Civil War, the same organization that was part of the ship building industries used by the Republic Navy at the time of the Great galactic War, where the Republic Navy effectively equalled the SE in size.

If the Sith Empire only managed to get as far as the Mid-rim worlds, the deepest of which was Alderaan, before they met high resistance and even started losing ground up to Korriban, how well do you think they'd do against the Empire which replaced a Galactic Republic that had a thousand years of relative peace and time to build infrastructure, only the CIS could rival them because their forces were made up of the most easily produced droids in the Galaxy and they still lost.

Then the Empire itself that was so big, the New Republic didn't actually believe they could take on the Imperial Remnant until they realised the Empire had devolved into a Warlord like state that was too busy fighting each other, until of course Thrawn came along and became the Supreme commander of the Empire and was handily thrashing the New Republic again, because they'd stopped fighting themselves.

Rayla_Felana's Avatar


Rayla_Felana
12.14.2012 , 01:52 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Losh View Post
I totally agree that in a full scale battle of empires, the Galactic Empire would win. I just question whether Sidious could really be more powerful than a guy who consumed the power of all the individuals in his home planet (N-something?). Besides, lightsaber combat between two Sith Sorcerers (I think they'd both fall under that category) is pretty pointless. It'd be a contest of will and force power.
Darth Sidious did the same thing on Byss, with 16 billion people who didn't even realise it was happening, he did this slowly, with his own power and no rituals, whilst basically on vacation relaxing in his armchair, he also managed to mindwipe the entire of Coruscant so they didn't remember a Super Star Destroyer being parked underneath the Imperial Palace.

Oh and Darth Sidious was an ambidextrous master of every lightsaber form whilst Vitiate is noted as being no combatant at all and relatively useless with a lightsaber in the Revan novel.

Aurbere's Avatar


Aurbere
12.14.2012 , 02:37 PM | #13
Could I just say one thing: ...Dark Troopers.

The answer to the SE's Sith forces.
Added Chapter 35 to The Shadows Fall
"Your only hope to survive is to give in to the rage boiling within you, to acknowledge the Dark Side you deny, and tap into it!"--Darth Tyranus

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
12.14.2012 , 02:53 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Aurbere View Post
Could I just say one thing: ...Dark Troopers.

The answer to the SE's Sith forces.
Do you one better, Shadow Guard or Sovereign Protector.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.

Aurbere's Avatar


Aurbere
12.14.2012 , 03:00 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Wolfninjajedi View Post
Do you one better, Shadow Guard or Sovereign Protector.
I was speaking from a military perspective, but "Oh Yeah!" those guys are beast.

But would the Dark Troopers, Shadow Guard and Sovereign Protectors be enough to counter the SE's Sith? I think so, though it will be a bloodbath.
Added Chapter 35 to The Shadows Fall
"Your only hope to survive is to give in to the rage boiling within you, to acknowledge the Dark Side you deny, and tap into it!"--Darth Tyranus

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
12.14.2012 , 03:10 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Aurbere View Post
I was speaking from a military perspective, but "Oh Yeah!" those guys are beast.

But would the Dark Troopers, Shadow Guard and Sovereign Protectors be enough to counter the SE's Sith? I think so, though it will be a bloodbath.
Well the Shadow and Sovereign are special military. :P But ya I would think so, moreso the latter seeing as they would have at least basic training in using The Force(heightened reflexes/senses, maybe a force power or two) so they could be put on the level of a Sith or at least the average sith warrior, against a true Sith Lord though they could be in trouble.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
12.14.2012 , 03:10 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by MasterMe View Post
Wait a second; isn't that against the Kaggath rules?

People like Revan weren't allowed generals like Saul Karath before. How come Sidious is getting his generals?
This fight is a little difference, for one they won't appear in the tournament because they are simply too powerful, and secondly its the grand finally - so I thought I'd up the anti here. And besides, in the scale of things - how promiment is a few Moffs in comparison to the galaxies greatest Sith Lords?

We also need to really consider the importance of having a sith army - Sidious has few if any weapons to defend against the full might of a Sith - apart from himself and sheer firepower.

EDIT: People have mentioned Dark Troopers, Shadow Guard, etc. but how do they match up in terms of numbers and power?

Aurbere's Avatar


Aurbere
12.14.2012 , 03:13 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Wolfninjajedi View Post
Well the Shadow and Sovereign are special military. :P But ya I would think so, moreso the latter seeing as they would have at least basic training in using The Force(heightened reflexes/senses, maybe a force power or two) so they could be put on the level of a Sith or at least the average sith warrior, against a true Sith Lord though they could be in trouble.
Against your average rank and file Sith Warrior, the Shadow, Sovereign and Dark Troopers will be fine, but the Sith Lords will prove difficult. I'm thinking the Dark Troopers will be the most effective just because the the sheer firepower they can put out.

Or the AT-AT's can kill the Sith
Added Chapter 35 to The Shadows Fall
"Your only hope to survive is to give in to the rage boiling within you, to acknowledge the Dark Side you deny, and tap into it!"--Darth Tyranus

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
12.14.2012 , 03:20 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
This fight is a little difference, for one they won't appear in the tournament because they are simply too powerful, and secondly its the grand finally - so I thought I'd up the anti here. And besides, in the scale of things - how promiment is a few Moffs in comparison to the galaxies greatest Sith Lords?

We also need to really consider the importance of having a sith army - Sidious has few if any weapons to defend against the full might of a Sith - apart from himself and sheer firepower.

EDIT: People have mentioned Dark Troopers, Shadow Guard, etc. but how do they match up in terms of numbers and power?
The number of Guardsmen are unknown, but speculated to be less then fifty to tens of thousands, but at any one point were estimated to be at 400. This is just the regular Royal Guard however, the exact numbers for the specialized variants are unknown but I guess if we take from what is said of the Royal Guard we could try and estimate, though it would be an estimation of...well an estimation.

The Dark Trooper is the same way.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
12.14.2012 , 03:35 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Aurbere View Post
Or the AT-AT's can kill the Sith
Lol, you obviously haven't played TFU! But seriously, Force jump, lightsaber that can cut through anything, force lighting and Force push etc vs big walker with long, thin legs and a body just begging to be ripped apart.

I thought I might put by SWTOR Encloypedia to use and compare an Imperial Star Destroyer with a Harrower-Class Dreadnought:

Length
Harrower: 800 metres
Star Destroyer: 1600 metres

Troop Capactiy
Harrower: 7300
Star Destroyer: 9700

Starfighter/bomber Capacity
Harrower: 127 (35 shuttles)
Star Destroyer: 72 (23 shuttles)

Standard Armament:
Harrower: Turbolaser cannons, Quad-laser turrets, ion cannons, proton torpedo tubes, concussion missile launchers
Star Destroyer: ion cannons, turbolaser batteries, heavy turbolaser batteries, heavy ion cannons, tractor beams.

Overall the Star Destroyer is superior to the Harrower, but not by a considerable amount, a harrower could still take on a Star Destroyer and win. After destroyers displayed themselves to be vulnerable to star fighters in the Battle of Endor...

I may do some more of these on troops etc at a later date.