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Pay2Win Space Missions ???

First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Felioats's Avatar


Felioats
12.13.2012 , 12:22 PM | #561
Quote: Originally Posted by JovethGonzalez View Post
Hi everyone,

I've spoken to the design team about the issue of Grade 7 ship upgrades and the cost in game...
Just see to it that those of us who already spent commendations/materials see some of them refunded if the costs are reduced, please.
>

Ansalem's Avatar


Ansalem
12.13.2012 , 12:25 PM | #562
So basically the devs put in p2w saw the outrage by players mass quitting their subs and are now saying sorry we are working on a way to fix this? how exactly are you going to fix it?!?! the market is flooded with grade 7 ship parts already from people buying bags! You ruined it! If you want to salvage anything you will remove the space bags from Cartel shop immediately. At least then you can limit it!

recsa's Avatar


recsa
12.13.2012 , 12:29 PM | #563
Quote: Originally Posted by JovethGonzalez View Post
Hi everyone,

I've spoken to the design team about the issue of Grade 7 ship upgrades and the cost in game (resources and time) versus the cost on the Cartel Market, since this concern was raised by a number of people on our forums.

Our Lead Designer for the game, Damion Schubert, has this to say:

Unfortunately, there is, in fact, a great disparity between these two costs. We want to apologize for this, as there was a miscommunication internally on how valuable these upgrades were, how challenging they should be to earn, and how fast a player should be able to earn them.

We are currently looking at solutions that cause the least amount of frustration for all players affected, while keeping the integrity of both the Cartel Market and the game intact.

It is not our intent to make the Cartel Market the “way to play" the game—we want you to feel that both the Cartel Market and earning gear in game are viable options as far as value goes, neither being far more efficient or effective than the other.

We truly hope you enjoy the challenge of the new Heroic Space Missions and apologize again for what we hope is a small distraction.

I want to reiterate that we are actively looking at solutions and they will be communicated to you as soon as we have a solid plan.


Thank you for your patience.
Nice to see a Dev reply here, it's most welcome, but still ... you are circumventing the true question, the problem is not to raise the CC cost or lower the in-game requirements, the problem is the pure existence of those items on the market, it's BiS gear for the ship that you can buy with real money. From now on, can we expect to see more high end items for money? (whatever the CC/effort balance) thats not what you said about the Cartel Market, if you have change your mind, please tell us.
A long time from now, in a galaxy far, far away, fanbois will realize they hurt games they love in a way no troll could ever dream of.

DarthBuckets's Avatar


DarthBuckets
12.13.2012 , 12:30 PM | #564
One possible solution out of this hole could be the following:
1. Lower material cost of the crafted upgrades.
2. Buff the non-Cartel Market pieces a bit to be better than those in the Cartel Market. It does not need to be a huge bump.
3. Learn from this situation in the future.

If all we get is #3, I'm content.

Slowpokeking's Avatar


Slowpokeking
12.13.2012 , 12:30 PM | #565
I don't think many people really care about the space mission, they are afraid of Bioware will put more top tier items in cartel market only to force players to buy it to get the best gear. Glad from the reply it's not their intention.

LegendaryBlade's Avatar


LegendaryBlade
12.13.2012 , 12:33 PM | #566
Quote: Originally Posted by Slowpokeking View Post
I don't think many people really care about the space mission, they are afraid of Bioware will put more top tier items in cartel market only to force players to buy it to get the best gear. Glad from the reply it's not their intention.
This ^^

Putting endgame game in the cash shop has been the definition of pay2win since it became a common phrase for MMOs, and that's what people are afraid of. The idea that this is 'just the start'. Even the dev post kind of insinuates that they don't plan to stop going in this direction; because they want it to be "equally viable" to in game methods.

For what it's worth though, EAware just saw the backlash it causes and if they have any sense it'll show them that it's not a worthwhile venture to put more endgame gear in the shop.
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Slowpokeking's Avatar


Slowpokeking
12.13.2012 , 12:35 PM | #567
Quote: Originally Posted by LegendaryBlade View Post
This ^^

Putting endgame game in the cash shop has been the definition of pay2win since it became a common phrase for MMOs, and that's what people are afraid of. The idea that this is 'just the start'. Even the dev post kind of insinuates that they don't plan to stop going in this direction; because they want it to be "equally viable" to in game methods.

For what it's worth though, EAware just saw the backlash it causes and if they have any sense it'll show them that it's not a worthwhile venture to put more endgame gear in the shop.
I just hope they will put more speeders in the Cartel Market.

recsa's Avatar


recsa
12.13.2012 , 12:37 PM | #568
Quote: Originally Posted by Slowpokeking View Post
I don't think many people really care about the space mission, they are afraid of Bioware will put more top tier items in cartel market only to force players to buy it to get the best gear. Glad from the reply it's not their intention.
100% agree on the first 50% of your post XDDD.

Yes, i dont care about spaceship parts
Yes, im worried about future BiS items on shop

But ... second 50% .... you said "Glad from the reply it's not their intention"

While Dev said
Quote:
It is not our intent to make the Cartel Market the “way to play" the game—we want you to feel that both the Cartel Market and earning gear in game are viable options as far as value goes, neither being far more efficient or effective than the other.
Here i read: "we want market and in-game effort to be equally effective"
And it worries me.
A long time from now, in a galaxy far, far away, fanbois will realize they hurt games they love in a way no troll could ever dream of.

DAMossimo's Avatar


DAMossimo
12.13.2012 , 12:39 PM | #569
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthBuckets View Post
One possible solution out of this hole could be the following:
1. Lower material cost of the crafted upgrades.
2. Buff the non-Cartel Market pieces a bit to be better than those in the Cartel Market. It does not need to be a huge bump.
3. Learn from this situation in the future.

If all we get is #3, I'm content.
My preference would be #1. This would soothe the crafters plight as well.

#2 seems like a good idea but I fear the implementation would be complicated and require too much time to "fix" this in a timely manner.

And, I would be happy with #3 as well if that's all we got.

Aelrail's Avatar


Aelrail
12.13.2012 , 12:41 PM | #570
Quote: Originally Posted by Lostpenguins View Post
You cheapened the integrity of the market once you started putting top tier gear (of any kind) for sale on the Cartel Market.

That is the fundamental problem here. If you guys want to start selling more top-tier gear on the Market... and I don't care what the cost is... if you want to sell ANY top-tier gear on the Market on a go-forward basis, just come out and say it so that I can unsub because that isn't the MMO I signed up for.
^This a thousand times.

Let us know if this P2W crap is the way you are going forward so I can unsub and go play something else. Your greedy asses will loose a subscriber and a cartel shop customer for cheapening the game. There is absolutely NO reason to put end game gear (either player, companion or ship) in the cartel market, none at all.

IT IS P2W, the exact same thing you said will not be done.
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