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Pay2Win Space Missions ???

First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

iamthehoyden's Avatar


iamthehoyden
12.12.2012 , 08:58 PM | #491
Quote: Originally Posted by BJWyler View Post
But when someone buys their way to the top, they are in fact not getting better. By virtue of spending time and effort in game, learning to play and learning the mechanics they will become better skilled. Those who do not spend such time and effort will not be better skilled, therefore your accomplishments and skills cannot be cheapened because you still end up being the better player.
Look, I get what you're saying, I really do. I'm just saying that I see end-game gear as a reward. If people can buy it instead of earning it, it means less to me.
aren't you a little short for a stormtrooper?
---------------
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notalkjustrock's Avatar


notalkjustrock
12.12.2012 , 08:58 PM | #492
Quote: Originally Posted by Guinnessmonkey View Post
Well, feel free to play the space missions then. You can totally try them out without the gear. If you absolutely refuse to buy 'em (don't you have coins from subscribing?), grind away. Be my guest.
It's clearly not balanced without CM content. If there was no CM they would have either made level 6 missions, instead of jumping form level 5 to level 7, or made it easier to get the level 7 stuff. If they are going to implement an unbalanced, unfun grind in an attempt to extract fees from me for content I have already paid for then I am going elsewhere.

If I went to a movie theatre and bought a ticket at the box office, but then when I went to theatre the usher told me that there was a seat fee, I would not go to that movie theatre again. That's what I'm doing. I guess you'd be the guy who points out that I could just stand for the entire movie.

Clevelandboy's Avatar


Clevelandboy
12.12.2012 , 09:09 PM | #493
Quote: Originally Posted by notalkjustrock View Post
It's clearly not balanced without CM content. If there was no CM they would have either made level 6 missions, instead of jumping form level 5 to level 7, or made it easier to get the level 7 stuff. If they are going to implement an unbalanced, unfun grind in an attempt to extract fees from me for content I have already paid for then I am going elsewhere.

If I went to a movie theatre and bought a ticket at the box office, but then when I went to theatre the usher told me that there was a seat fee, I would not go to that movie theatre again. That's what I'm doing. I guess you'd be the guy who points out that I could just stand for the entire movie.
I maybe mistaken but the crafted ship parts are more like Grade 6. So they went from 6 to 7 not 5 to 7

notalkjustrock's Avatar


notalkjustrock
12.12.2012 , 09:11 PM | #494
Quote: Originally Posted by Clevelandboy View Post
I maybe mistaken but the crafted ship parts are more like Grade 6. So they went from 6 to 7 not 5 to 7
By grade 6 I mean grade 6 missions. They have grade 6 parts, but they never made content balanced around those parts. The grade 5 missions are loleasy with grade 6 parts.

Clevelandboy's Avatar


Clevelandboy
12.12.2012 , 09:12 PM | #495
Quote: Originally Posted by notalkjustrock View Post
It's clearly not balanced without CM content. If there was no CM they would have either made level 6 missions, instead of jumping form level 5 to level 7, or made it easier to get the level 7 stuff. If they are going to implement an unbalanced, unfun grind in an attempt to extract fees from me for content I have already paid for then I am going elsewhere.

If I went to a movie theatre and bought a ticket at the box office, but then when I went to theatre the usher told me that there was a seat fee, I would not go to that movie theatre again. That's what I'm doing. I guess you'd be the guy who points out that I could just stand for the entire movie.
**** double post

Guinnessmonkey's Avatar


Guinnessmonkey
12.12.2012 , 09:14 PM | #496
Quote: Originally Posted by notalkjustrock View Post
It's clearly not balanced without CM content. If there was no CM they would have either made level 6 missions, instead of jumping form level 5 to level 7, or made it easier to get the level 7 stuff. If they are going to implement an unbalanced, unfun grind in an attempt to extract fees from me for content I have already paid for then I am going elsewhere.

If I went to a movie theatre and bought a ticket at the box office, but then when I went to theatre the usher told me that there was a seat fee, I would not go to that movie theatre again. That's what I'm doing. I guess you'd be the guy who points out that I could just stand for the entire movie.
No, but I'll point out that there's another way to get a seat. A better metaphor is that you got to the theatre early and stood in line, and are angry that other people just went online, paid a few bucks extra, and got their tickets at home without having to stand in that long line. You're both seeing the same movie with seats of the exact same quality, they just paid more money for the convenience. If you think they're suckers for paying for for the same ticket, that's your right. That doesn't mean that you should boycott the theatre or try to ban online ticket sales.

What makes this even more of a non-issue for me is that if you're one of the small minority who really, really likes the space missions, then you probably have a ton of comms sitting around anyway. I know i have guildies who did enough space missions to earn a Grade 8 box every few days or so, and that's well on the way to purchasing one of these new T7 items (this isn't to say that I don't agree that the price for the T7 space items is too high. I think they should be cut in half or so, but I think they should also be on the cartel and GTN as they are now). For those who stopped doing space missions after they finished the original missions, however, I think the ability to jump straight to the new missions without suddenly grinding a ton is great.

After all, when a new Operation launches, they don't require a new tier of gear to run it; they have it DROP the new tier of gear. That wasn't the way the space missions were set up, however. Personally, I think making the Cartel an option was a pretty great solution.

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DAMossimo's Avatar


DAMossimo
12.12.2012 , 09:14 PM | #497
Quote: Originally Posted by notalkjustrock View Post
It's clearly not balanced without CM content. If there was no CM they would have either made level 6 missions, instead of jumping form level 5 to level 7, or made it easier to get the level 7 stuff. If they are going to implement an unbalanced, unfun grind in an attempt to extract fees from me for content I have already paid for then I am going elsewhere.

If I went to a movie theatre and bought a ticket at the box office, but then when I went to theatre the usher told me that there was a seat fee, I would not go to that movie theatre again. That's what I'm doing. I guess you'd be the guy who points out that I could just stand for the entire movie.
Yes! This is exactly how I feel about these new space missions - they should have been at least doable with T6 parts, and rewarded T7 parts (or at least a reasonable grind towards them).

The fact that they introduced a discontinuity in progression is what bothers me the most about it. The rewards for obtaining the gear and successfully running the missions is nowhere near the cost of getting set up do run them.

I won't be running them myself in their current form. I wouldn't categorize this move as Pay2Win, it's really just a big middle finger to those of us who were interested in getting new space missions.

Seems to me like they were made this way stemming from a combination of spite & greed. Kinda to just shut everyone up about even daring to ask for more content.

notalkjustrock's Avatar


notalkjustrock
12.12.2012 , 09:24 PM | #498
Quote: Originally Posted by Guinnessmonkey View Post
A better metaphor is that you got to the theatre early and stood in line, and are angry that other people just went online, paid a few bucks extra, and got their tickets at home without having to stand in that long line. You're both seeing the same movie with seats of the exact same quality, they just paid more money for the convenience. If you think they're suckers for paying for for the same ticket, that's your right. That doesn't mean that you should boycott the theatre or try to ban online ticket sales.
No, this is not at all what happened. They're trying to charge me one more time when I already bought the space missions.

Quote:
After all, when a new Operation launches, they don't require a new tier of gear to run it; they have it DROP the new tier of gear. That wasn't the way the space missions were set up, however. Personally, I think making the Cartel an option was a pretty great solution.
BW created this discontinuity, I'm not going to applaud them for solving their own problem via cash-shop.

If they're willing to do this with the space missions, soon enough we'll start seeing more skippable grinds whenever new content comes out. Expect to see more new content gated by obnoxious grinds or cartel-market purchases. Space mission is their first foray into this.

DAMossimo's Avatar


DAMossimo
12.12.2012 , 09:33 PM | #499
Quote: Originally Posted by notalkjustrock View Post
No, this is not at all what happened. They're trying to charge me one more time when I already bought the space missions.


BW created this discontinuity, I'm not going to applaud them for solving their own problem via cash-shop.

If they're willing to do this with the space missions, soon enough we'll start seeing more skippable grinds whenever new content comes out. Expect to see more new content gated by obnoxious grinds or cartel-market purchases. Space mission is their first foray into this.
This is my worry too. Imagine:

Makeb = free to subscribers

Special Crystal that allows you to survive for more than 30 seconds on Makebs surface = 1200 Cartel Coins.

Ultramecha's Avatar


Ultramecha
12.12.2012 , 10:18 PM | #500
Quote: Originally Posted by notalkjustrock View Post
No, this is not at all what happened. They're trying to charge me one more time when I already bought the space missions..
So let me get this straight... your too lazy to grind out to earn the Grade 7 stuff so that means because you cant do the new space missions in Grade 1 Space gear that means Bioware is screwing you over Gotcha...

Buying grade 7 on the CM simply provides the convenience not having to grind for them... if the only way to obtain Grade 7 was only on the CM then your point would be valid.