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Afraid to put their big boy/girl pants on. Fix this please. Peter Pan isn't in SWTOR

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Afraid to put their big boy/girl pants on. Fix this please. Peter Pan isn't in SWTOR

Zunayson's Avatar


Zunayson
12.05.2012 , 09:36 PM | #431
Quote: Originally Posted by Technohic View Post
Before you say that; I think you should see the definition of "Twink"

thanks to this thread; we know who you are. Not that there is anything wrong with that.
I don't think you understood the essence of my post.
Quote: Originally Posted by Uber_the_Goober View Post
Bioware couldn't balance a sheet of plywood if it were laying [sic] on the ground.
Quote: Originally Posted by Aragost View Post
Make sure you take 3/3 in the "knowing how to play" box

Doomsdaycomes's Avatar


Doomsdaycomes
12.06.2012 , 12:41 AM | #432
Quote: Originally Posted by Smashbrother View Post
Quests, missions, FPs give you credit, xp, items as reward. In the process you get credit, xp, items.

So it's only consistent if you make medals give comms, credits, xp, valor.
We're just going to have to agree to disagree. Of the "leveling activities" nothing can ever be completely balanced, it can just be mostly balanced. For example, Space gives exp during the mission, but not credits, items, or social. Questing/Class missions give during exp, credits, a chance at an item (usually green, which is useless post 50) and/or social if you are grouped. Flashpoints are the same, except their chance at "better" items is slighlty higher. Killing "Bosses" are considered part of completion, so their chance at items is not included as "things given during the activity."

I guess it would be up to the dev's then to decide how much they would add into "during rewards" for pvp, but currently pvp is the only leveling activity that has -all- of it's rewards back loaded.

(Imo, if they decided to reward comms it would have to be something like +2 instant comms per medal, as even if you gain 8 medals in 3 minutes, 16 comms is not worth the effort of quitting, and then waiting for a new warzone.)

Atramar's Avatar


Atramar
12.06.2012 , 03:30 AM | #433
Quote: Originally Posted by Seena View Post

Now - instead of wasting YOUR time in my thread -- why don't you take your twink, gained through exploiting (vs a legitimate twink, of which there are plenty), and go beat up some low levels instead of asking questions with moot answers?
Soo reasoning is 100% waste of time since you 'in your thread' assume all who dissagree are 'twinks' who harras poor low level ppl and at best you put all of us on 'ignore' so whole internet has same opinion as you.My level 40 'twinki' is in wz que eu time, beware mua ha ha ha
cought Bolster cought skills cought .

edit:again, where can I sign under 'medal giving exp,comms and creds?
Tracer Legacy, The Red Eclipse.
Not reading colored text, it hurts my eyes. Sorry (unless it's a dev post)
L55:Sniper,Operative,Juggernaut,Assassin,Marauder, Powertech,Guardian,Commando,Scoundrel
to finish:Shadow(41),Sage(53),Merc(39). 29.07.2013

CommanderKeeva's Avatar


CommanderKeeva
12.06.2012 , 06:55 AM | #434
Experience and Valor should reward the effort. Commendations and credits should reward the result, I think.

Kills and medals should award experience and right away - in fact in most MMO games it works that way. If you kill someone in PvE (be that a class quest, planetary quest, fp, op or space mission), you get exp right away, why should it be different in PvP? A simple change, have kills award experience, and this thread will become unnecesarry. You are entitled to your experience right away for killing something.

EDIT: A larger experience boost should still be given out at the end of the match, based on medals and mvps, but xp for kills would ensure that no one can perpetually stay at a certain level.

I would also give out valor points on the fly. Say 1 for the first kill, 2 for the second, 5 for the third, 10 for the fourth and 20 for the fifth and each consecutive kill thereafter. If you die, you start from 1 again.

As for Medals awarding credits and comms right away? No, I think this wouldn't be a particularly good idea because some medals are notoriously easy to get. (2,5k dmg, 5k dmg, 2,5k heal, 5k heal, def medals etc.) If this was the case, there would be no incentive to remain in a losing warzone once you get 8 medals. We'd see entire teams desert once they realize that they cannot turn the match around. (It is already happening to a certain extent but instant credits and comms would aggravate the issue.)

I realize that it would help people who accidentally disconnect in the middle of a match not leave empty-handed for their effort, but in the case of credits and commendations, I think the potential of their misuse far outweighs the potential of their usefulness.
BEING A GOOD SOLDIER COMES DOWN TO ONE THING, ONE SINGLE QUESTION:
WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO SACRIFICE?

Atramar's Avatar


Atramar
12.06.2012 , 07:10 AM | #435
@CommanderKeeva:

about medals giving exp, cash and comms, it could be ratio, like only 1/4 of normal value, and rest 3/4 would be given on end of match, that would stop 'infinite' L 49, would help people who DC, and would be not enouth to exploit 'get into wz, 8 medals, leave' .
or 1/5 on the spot and 4/5 + win/loose reward + mvp
Tracer Legacy, The Red Eclipse.
Not reading colored text, it hurts my eyes. Sorry (unless it's a dev post)
L55:Sniper,Operative,Juggernaut,Assassin,Marauder, Powertech,Guardian,Commando,Scoundrel
to finish:Shadow(41),Sage(53),Merc(39). 29.07.2013

Seena's Avatar


Seena
12.06.2012 , 07:18 AM | #436
Quote: Originally Posted by CommanderKeeva View Post
Experience and Valor should reward the effort. Commendations and credits should reward the result, I think.

Kills and medals should award experience and right away - in fact in most MMO games it works that way. If you kill someone in PvE (be that a class quest, planetary quest, fp, op or space mission), you get exp right away, why should it be different in PvP? A simple change, have kills award experience, and this thread will become unnecesarry. You are entitled to your experience right away for killing something.

EDIT: A larger experience boost should still be given out at the end of the match, based on medals and mvps, but xp for kills would ensure that no one can perpetually stay at a certain level.

I would also give out valor points on the fly. Say 1 for the first kill, 2 for the second, 5 for the third, 10 for the fourth and 20 for the fifth and each consecutive kill thereafter. If you die, you start from 1 again.

As for Medals awarding credits and comms right away? No, I think this wouldn't be a particularly good idea because some medals are notoriously easy to get. (2,5k dmg, 5k dmg, 2,5k heal, 5k heal, def medals etc.) If this was the case, there would be no incentive to remain in a losing warzone once you get 8 medals. We'd see entire teams desert once they realize that they cannot turn the match around. (It is already happening to a certain extent but instant credits and comms with aggravate the issue.)

I realize that it would help people who accidentally disconnect in the middle of a match not leave empty-handed for their effort, but in the case of credits and commendations, I think the potential of their misuse far outweighs the potential of their usefulness.
I think this is an adequate solution - similar to one Doomsday presented earlier I believe. A slow leak of xp, a chunk rewarded at the end. I agree that Comms and credits right away would encourage people quitting early even more.
MAINGEAR Gigabyte-Z68X-UD7-B3 MB; i7 2600K OC @ 4.8Ghz; (2) NVIDIA gtx 680 in SLI; 16Gb 1866Mhz Corsair Vengeance mem; HD1: Intel 510 Series SSD 250GB SATA III HD2: SAMSUNG 1 Tb; ASUS Xonar Audio, 1200W Silverstone PS, With GPU and CPU liquid cooling......

Doomsdaycomes's Avatar


Doomsdaycomes
12.06.2012 , 09:23 AM | #437
Quote: Originally Posted by CommanderKeeva View Post
Experience and Valor should reward the effort. Commendations and credits should reward the result, I think.

Kills and medals should award experience and right away - in fact in most MMO games it works that way. If you kill someone in PvE (be that a class quest, planetary quest, fp, op or space mission), you get exp right away, why should it be different in PvP? A simple change, have kills award experience, and this thread will become unnecesarry. You are entitled to your experience right away for killing something.

EDIT: A larger experience boost should still be given out at the end of the match, based on medals and mvps, but xp for kills would ensure that no one can perpetually stay at a certain level.

I would also give out valor points on the fly. Say 1 for the first kill, 2 for the second, 5 for the third, 10 for the fourth and 20 for the fifth and each consecutive kill thereafter. If you die, you start from 1 again.

As for Medals awarding credits and comms right away? No, I think this wouldn't be a particularly good idea because some medals are notoriously easy to get. (2,5k dmg, 5k dmg, 2,5k heal, 5k heal, def medals etc.) If this was the case, there would be no incentive to remain in a losing warzone once you get 8 medals. We'd see entire teams desert once they realize that they cannot turn the match around. (It is already happening to a certain extent but instant credits and comms would aggravate the issue.)

I realize that it would help people who accidentally disconnect in the middle of a match not leave empty-handed for their effort, but in the case of credits and commendations, I think the potential of their misuse far outweighs the potential of their usefulness.
An excellent idea, and I am in agreement for most of it.

The only thing I would point out is exp for kills has a few issues that I think would be better handled by medals instead.

Exp for kills is exploitable because people could ignore objectives and just farm each other if they ended up on opposite teams. Since there is no limit to kills you can achieve (and some matches have no time limit) this could cause a potential "super match" if both teams agreed to just farm.

Medals (even without the 8-limit) are a finite number instead, and thus are less exploitable.

Other than that, I like the Exp+Valor per X, then a comm, exp, valor, and credit reward at the end.

@Seena, I believe the idea was actually posted first by Uglymjr, but I could be incorrect. I only reitterated it in a clearer context.

Seena's Avatar


Seena
12.06.2012 , 12:03 PM | #438
Quote: Originally Posted by Doomsdaycomes View Post
An excellent idea, and I am in agreement for most of it.

The only thing I would point out is exp for kills has a few issues that I think would be better handled by medals instead.

Exp for kills is exploitable because people could ignore objectives and just farm each other if they ended up on opposite teams. Since there is no limit to kills you can achieve (and some matches have no time limit) this could cause a potential "super match" if both teams agreed to just farm.

Medals (even without the 8-limit) are a finite number instead, and thus are less exploitable.

Other than that, I like the Exp+Valor per X, then a comm, exp, valor, and credit reward at the end.

@Seena, I believe the idea was actually posted first by Uglymjr, but I could be incorrect. I only reitterated it in a clearer context.


Duly noted. Thanks for giving credit where credit is due.
MAINGEAR Gigabyte-Z68X-UD7-B3 MB; i7 2600K OC @ 4.8Ghz; (2) NVIDIA gtx 680 in SLI; 16Gb 1866Mhz Corsair Vengeance mem; HD1: Intel 510 Series SSD 250GB SATA III HD2: SAMSUNG 1 Tb; ASUS Xonar Audio, 1200W Silverstone PS, With GPU and CPU liquid cooling......

rpeplins's Avatar


rpeplins
12.06.2012 , 07:31 PM | #439
I patiently waded through all the pages of this topic.

I agree that what the perpetual 49's are doing (which I have personally encoutered on The Shadowlands) is not what was intended by the game design. I played DAoC which had an xp-off feature so you could stay at the battleground of your choice forever (Molvik was the favorite) and the feature has been present in many other games. The fact that the feature is not present here leads me to believe that Bioware does not expect you to be able to engage in normal experience earning activities and not advance towards your next level. Especially with the broad level range PvP bracket currently in place, which I think works pretty well overall.

The thing that I find most telling about this whole discussion has been the lack of attention paid to the effect on new players if this behavior flourishes. We want to encourage new players to PvP and to make it enjoyable for them so that they continue and the community grows. The demoralizing effect of walking into a Warzone as a new player and getting stomped can not be trivialized. While it could happen regardless, it's much more likely to happen if you have a great deal of "professional noob-stompers" on the other side. Having them on your own side won't matter, that won't be the experience they remember. Especially since the sub-50 PvP design encourages people to PvP at very low levels, the chance of having a good experience running into a decked out level 49 toon is pretty slim. If they have bad early experiences in sub-50 PvP, they are going to not participate in it, which means they will likely not participate in 50 PvP, and you have lost the chance to grow the PvP community.

If you want to gear up a lower level toon to have a gear advantage, that's fine, go for it, enjoy. But I would not be suprised to find that Bioware institutes a change that makes the ability to play warzones continually without gaining experience disappear.

Smashbrother's Avatar


Smashbrother
12.06.2012 , 08:14 PM | #440
Quote: Originally Posted by rpeplins View Post
I patiently waded through all the pages of this topic.

I agree that what the perpetual 49's are doing (which I have personally encoutered on The Shadowlands) is not what was intended by the game design. I played DAoC which had an xp-off feature so you could stay at the battleground of your choice forever (Molvik was the favorite) and the feature has been present in many other games. The fact that the feature is not present here leads me to believe that Bioware does not expect you to be able to engage in normal experience earning activities and not advance towards your next level. Especially with the broad level range PvP bracket currently in place, which I think works pretty well overall.

The thing that I find most telling about this whole discussion has been the lack of attention paid to the effect on new players if this behavior flourishes. We want to encourage new players to PvP and to make it enjoyable for them so that they continue and the community grows. The demoralizing effect of walking into a Warzone as a new player and getting stomped can not be trivialized. While it could happen regardless, it's much more likely to happen if you have a great deal of "professional noob-stompers" on the other side. Having them on your own side won't matter, that won't be the experience they remember. Especially since the sub-50 PvP design encourages people to PvP at very low levels, the chance of having a good experience running into a decked out level 49 toon is pretty slim. If they have bad early experiences in sub-50 PvP, they are going to not participate in it, which means they will likely not participate in 50 PvP, and you have lost the chance to grow the PvP community.

If you want to gear up a lower level toon to have a gear advantage, that's fine, go for it, enjoy. But I would not be suprised to find that Bioware institutes a change that makes the ability to play warzones continually without gaining experience disappear.
Twinks were rampant in WoW looooooooooong before Blizz finally made twinking a "feature". If anything, BW will do the same here and have twink only Qs.

Anyone who is going to quit the game because they got stomped in pvp already has quit. You don't need 49 twinks on your team to completely stomp the enemy. Whiners like that never sub for any length of time--if they sub at all--and only add to more QQ on the forums.