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Kaggath Series: Exar Kun vs Mandalore the Ultimate

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > STAR WARS Discussion
Kaggath Series: Exar Kun vs Mandalore the Ultimate

Eightus's Avatar


Eightus
12.01.2012 , 07:47 PM | #131
Quote:
We could have a tournament style Kaggath going on!
This is a great idea!

Just saying

mothermoy's Avatar


mothermoy
12.01.2012 , 09:49 PM | #132
Actually i think this comes down to whos power base is stronger and more resilient. Kun or Mandalores. Its one of the most very basic and universal military strategy, your army can be as strong as anything, but it the people behind it that are the key. Could one side destroy the other sides power base. in a war like this, thats what i believe it would come down to. Sith rule by fear and intimidation. Mandalorians on the other hand, actually believe in what they do. i think that Mandalores power base would hold up much better then Kuns.

Aurbere's Avatar


Aurbere
12.01.2012 , 09:52 PM | #133
Quote: Originally Posted by mothermoy View Post
Actually i think this comes down to whos power base is stronger and more resilient. Kun or Mandalores. Its one of the most very basic and universal military strategy, your army can be as strong as anything, but it the people behind it that are the key. Could one side destroy the other sides power base. in a war like this, thats what i believe it would come down to. Sith rule by fear and intimidation. Mandalorians on the other hand, actually believe in what they do. i think that Mandalores power base would hold up much better then Kuns.
This would work in any other scenario. However, the Krath and Massassi are fanatically loyal to Kun. When one dies, the others don't care, they just keep going. Not to mention Kun has War Beasts that are bound to his will.
Added Chapter 29 to The Shadows Fall
"My ultimate goal is the secret of life-that life that gives us consciousness, for without consciousness each of us is nothing. Through science, i will create new life and sustain my own. There is no reason Darth Plagueis could not live forever."

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
12.02.2012 , 05:50 AM | #134
Quote: Originally Posted by Maaruin View Post
I really like this series, but I think some rule changes in these directions would make it more like a real Kaggath (instead of a simple war between two power bases.)


You also asked for suggestions. So here are mine:
  • Jedi Consular vs Sith Inquisitor
  • Master Oteg (his Fleet + the Strike Team) vs Master Kenobi (his Forces on Utapau)... in general, two good characters against each other
  • Queen Talia of Onderon vs Queen Amidala of Naboo
You make good points but the purpose of the rules are to:
ensure that combatants can't play instakill moves which render them indestructible (Malachor V came close to this).
ensure the combatants aren't restricted by the arena, and can bring the full force of their power bases into play
ensure no one has an unfair advantage because they have a powerful ally, and ensure the debate doesn't become a duel between two characters in the power base.
ensure there is a clear winner
ensure that victory is achieved through the combatants own skills rather than the ability of their allies.

I understand that in a real Kaggath things would be different, but for the purpose of debate things have to be modified. In the future however, some rules might be removed to make the duel more interesting.

And Barsenthor vs Darth Nox sounds like a very interesting duel...

Rayla_Felana's Avatar


Rayla_Felana
12.02.2012 , 08:08 AM | #135
Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
But here in lies the problem, from my knowledge of the Great Sith War, he didn't. The only battle Exar Kun led was the invasion of Ossus. The Krath Holy Crusades began before Kun was seduced to the dark side and were led by the Keto's. Then Kun goes to Cinnagar to confront Keto and Ulic alone. Not a battle here, a duel. The Dark Reaper Campaign was led by Ulic after this. Then Kun went to Ossus personally and killed Odun-Durr - again this was a duel not a battle. It was Ulic who subjugated the Mandalorians, which began the Mandalorian Crusdades led by Mandalore. Ulic invaded Coruscant, then Kun comes along and kills his Master. Again a duel. And then finally Kun takes up the reigns and invade Ossus. After that he retreats back to Yavin 4, leaving command to Ulic once more - who betrays him and has him defeated. Kun spends all his time searching for the secrets of Freedon Nadd, tracking down and dueling people, and then establishing his brotherhood. The way I see it, he was the Vitiate of the Great Sith War - hiding away in his fortress while his minions waged war which he wasn't even concerned about, it was obvious all Kun wanted was power in the dark side.
Oh I wasn't suggesting he led all of those campaigns personally, but this is how he would lead them, just massive invasions with carnage as his main weapon, I doubt there would be many tactics beyond the basic that Kun would employ, but I would wager that eventually he'd seek out Battle Meditation, something he showed when he empowered all his acolytes before they went on the whole night of the long knives deal.

Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
Again I'm unsure. The Krath were a secret society who conquered one system. How could they possibly have so many warriors? And why did they retreat to Teta and hope their presence would go unnoticed, when they supposedly had billions of warriors under their banner?
Basically, I am not saying the mighty Krath Warriors just have hordes after hordes, we know they had three separate massive forces that made up different parts of Kun's Empire, but we also know that they did conscript regular men into your typical army, when the war against the Republic intensified.

Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
This is the only evidence that the Krath had numbers, and don't forget the Mandalorians were just as fanatic.
The Mandalorians were fanatic yes, but not all of them, the proper Mandalorians were, but many of the Neo-Crusaders gave up in battle, we see this at the Second Battle of Dxun when the Exile used a trap to cut off their escape, we also saw such a thing in latter stages of the war, which is commented on in the KotOR comics, I believ by the Republic officer before he bumps into Zarrick(?).

Now you could easily argue that given the ruthlessness of the enemy, many soldiers wouldn't just turn themselves in because they'd die anyway, but I certainly believe it would demoralise the greener crusaders.

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
12.02.2012 , 08:56 AM | #136
Quote: Originally Posted by Rayla_Felana View Post
Oh I wasn't suggesting he led all of those campaigns personally, but this is how he would lead them, just massive invasions with carnage as his main weapon, I doubt there would be many tactics beyond the basic that Kun would employ, but I would wager that eventually he'd seek out Battle Meditation, something he showed when he empowered all his acolytes before they went on the whole night of the long knives deal.
Seems Mandalore at least has a tactical advantage then. But would he be able to withstand Kun's vicious onslaught?
Quote: Originally Posted by Rayla_Felana View Post

Now you could easily argue that given the ruthlessness of the enemy, many soldiers wouldn't just turn themselves in because they'd die anyway, but I certainly believe it would demoralise the greener crusaders.
Morale is definitely important. And I believe seeing an army of massasi warriors, bloodthirsty Krath and monstrous terantenek bearing down on you would be enough to demoralize even the most fanatic of warriors. Battle meditation would definitely aid this. Did this happen at all in the Great Sith War? And was he or any of his Sith capable of battle meditation?

And Maaurin actually makes a good point. Kun could infiltrate Mandalore's forces, board his flagship and kill him while Mandalore is distracted by the war. I could definitely see the Kaggath playing out this way.

Castiel's Avatar


Castiel
12.11.2012 , 03:24 AM | #137
Kun, not even a contest.