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Same gender relationships clarifications?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Same gender relationships clarifications?
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

Zandilar's Avatar


Zandilar
11.23.2012 , 08:58 PM | #3271
Quote: Originally Posted by Tatile View Post
Exactly. We've only assumed there's a gag order as it's the only "reasonable" explanation as to why the Community Team cannot say "Yes, Mr. Erickson's comment still stands" or "No, it's delayed".
If there's a gag order, the chances are they can't even tell us that there is a gag order.

So, the old saw goes - don't presume malice where stupidity (or bureaucracy) would suffice.
Zandilar, an Australian, IN SPAAAAAAAACCCCEEEEE!!
Too many characters, most of them Chiss.

Lent_San's Avatar


Lent_San
11.24.2012 , 06:09 AM | #3272
Quote: Originally Posted by Zandilar View Post
If there's a gag order, the chances are they can't even tell us that there is a gag order.
No offense, but that sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

Tatile's Avatar


Tatile
11.24.2012 , 06:27 AM | #3273
Quote: Originally Posted by Zandilar View Post
If there's a gag order, the chances are they can't even tell us that there is a gag order.

So, the old saw goes - don't presume malice where stupidity (or bureaucracy) would suffice.
Yes, I've been trying to assume stupidity, but at this point* Bioware would have entered some sort of low-IQ induced coma and that's simply disturbing.

Really, the level of stupid detachment at this point would be reading Uluain's list of Things We Want To Know and saying "I don't know what they want!"

Also, the gag order would be like a mini version of the super injunctions we (used to?) have: not allowed to talk about the existence of the super injunction because that's also illegal.


*Not only talking about SGRA's here, take a look at the rest of the issues with the game.

Palar's Avatar


Palar
11.24.2012 , 08:07 AM | #3274
Quote: Originally Posted by Tatile View Post
Yes, I've been trying to assume stupidity, but at this point* Bioware would have entered some sort of low-IQ induced coma and that's simply disturbing.

Really, the level of stupid detachment at this point would be reading Uluain's list of Things We Want To Know and saying "I don't know what they want!"

Also, the gag order would be like a mini version of the super injunctions we (used to?) have: not allowed to talk about the existence of the super injunction because that's also illegal.


*Not only talking about SGRA's here, take a look at the rest of the issues with the game.
Sad thing is, that's exactly where we are - the optimistic option is to assume they'd have trouble lacing their own shoes in the morning, rather than think they're wilfully stringing people along to milk the subs.

Tatile's Avatar


Tatile
11.24.2012 , 08:17 AM | #3275
Quote: Originally Posted by Palar View Post
Sad thing is, that's exactly where we are - the optimistic option is to assume they'd have trouble lacing their own shoes in the morning, rather than think they're wilfully stringing people along to milk the subs.
I hate to think it's optimistic to assume that Bioware is being run by five year olds XD

(Link goes to the four year old who should be running Bioware )

Nozybidaj's Avatar


Nozybidaj
11.24.2012 , 12:29 PM | #3276
Quote: Originally Posted by Palar View Post
Sad thing is, that's exactly where we are - the optimistic option is to assume they'd have trouble lacing their own shoes in the morning, rather than think they're willfully stringing people along to milk the subs.
Hate to say it, but that is exactly what they've been doing the last 12 months. Add on another 6 or so months for the "post launch" comment from beta. They could have made all completely new companions 2 for each class and it wouldn't have taken 18 months to develop this content. The only goal I can see from the little they did say was to keep people playing (and paying) as long as possible.

Uluain's Avatar


Uluain
11.24.2012 , 03:10 PM | #3277
Quote: Originally Posted by ImperialSun View Post
"or just taken a huge risk and simply defied that directive"

You are seriously saying that the community team should have directly defied what is potentially a corportate / strategic decision, made at board / seniour management level....just to placate you personally?
No.

I suggest that it is possible that they could. Rather than taking your stance that obedience to the rules is the only applical guide to ethics, I follow a school of thought which observes that rules and laws can in some cases be wrong and that, in such circumstances, an individual must be governed by personal conscience. This can hold true even within the limited sphere of professional responsibilities, if one is given a directive at variance with one's overall duty.

I cannot and do not say what other people ought to discover when consulting their own conscience. I cannot even say that this is such a situation, because we have been told nothing about it. But I do say that if it is such a circumstance, and if conscienteous reflection results in finding that a directive is harmful to the interests of the game and its community, that one should do what one believes to be right, regardless of penalty.

Further, I would posit that if one's livelihood is at risk from doing what one believes to be right, then one does not yet have one's right livelihood. To summarize then, I don't think they should do this to placate me or anyone else. I suggest that they should do it if, in their understanding of the situation, it is the right thing to do.

Is that serious enough for you, or do I need to cite sources and footnotes from the five thousand years human minds have been weighing the idea of ethical conduct?

Also, why are you still here trolling this thread?

Eldartank's Avatar


Eldartank
11.24.2012 , 03:23 PM | #3278
I think the best way to deal with any controversy arising from this issue is to simply have the option to disable all flirt/romance options for character interaction for each individual character. If the flirt/romance option is disabled, then such options would simply not appear when your chatacter is interacting with companions or NPC's. That would please those who want a strictly "family friendly" or "PG-rated" gaming experiance, and would also please those who want a different type of gaming experience. The option to disable or enable flirt/romance options should be available to the character all the time, in case a player changes his mind during the game. The option could be automatically enabled as a default, and those who don't want it can simply go into the appropriate menu and disable it.

As for me, I'm rather enjoying playing my Jedi as strictly following the Jedi code, so I just simply ignore flirt;/romance options when they appear in character interactions with companions or NPC's.

Jedikuonji's Avatar


Jedikuonji
11.24.2012 , 04:26 PM | #3279
Been watching this thread for the better part of forever (at least it feels that way sometimes) and I just wanted to drop by and say I'm also interested in seeing some kind of update. I really like this game, but this is the one feature holding me back from long term commitment to the game. I feel limited as to what classes I can play because I'm still waiting to see if SGR content will come out.

Anyway, I paid for another month so I guess I better get in there and play.

natashina's Avatar


natashina
11.24.2012 , 06:05 PM | #3280
Quote: Originally Posted by Eldartank View Post
I think the best way to deal with any controversy arising from this issue is to simply have the option to disable all flirt/romance options for character interaction for each individual character. If the flirt/romance option is disabled, then such options would simply not appear when your character is interacting with companions or NPC's. That would please those who want a strictly "family friendly" or "PG-rated" gaming experience, and would also please those who want a different type of gaming experience. The option to disable or enable flirt/romance options should be available to the character all the time, in case a player changes his mind during the game. The option could be automatically enabled as a default, and those who don't want it can simply go into the appropriate menu and disable it.

As for me, I'm rather enjoying playing my Jedi as strictly following the Jedi code, so I just simply ignore flirt;/romance options when they appear in character interactions with companions or NPC's.

ImperialSun has been trolling the thread for about a week now. Best to ignore them.

First, as far as "family friendly," this game has the equivalent of a PG-13 rating. The "family friendly" crowd seems to forget this. This is not a game for kids, and I would assume that most teens know about the LGBT community by now. With the torture, violence and outright cruelty available to the player character, this is no family friendly game, even though apparently violence is easier to explain. So they'll have to deal with the content as it goes and it will not get a higher rating than "T"/"PEGI 16+.

As far as any toggle/opt out goes, this is from the SGRA FAQ:



1) Why do you have the quote from the moderators on page 1?(aka the T-word)



The thread is not a place for the discussion of whether SGRAs should be added to the game (again, Bioware has already committed to them), or of a SGRA “toggle” or other method of turning off this content. The OP poll is outdated and no longer relevant to this thread. On March 13, the following statement was released by the mods:

Quote: Originally Posted by Moitteva
Discussion of the implementation of toggles to filter same gender romance options is considered discriminatory language and is neither appropriate nor allowed on the forums. Posts along this vein of discussion will be removed.
The forum rules regarding these sorts of toggles came about after several months of discussion. Over time, the general consensus was that it wasn't needed, and it was agreed upon that it was discriminatory. The best filter a player can have is their own judgement. If a player doesn't wish to return a [Flirt], they can always pick a different option.

The following quote is by David Gaider, one of the former lead writers of Bioware, and he worked on the Dragon Age series. He also wrote HK-47, Jolee Bindo and Carth Onasi for Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic.


Quote: Originally Posted by David Gaider
The "rights" of anyone with regards to a game are murky at best, but anyone who takes that stance must apply it equally to both the minority as well as the majority. The majority has no inherent "right" to get more options than anyone else.

So there's that. Those that want a safe family game free of awkward talks might want to rethink having their kids play ToR, same gender romances or no.

I think I overall said it best in another post, so I'm going to copy pasta an edited version here.

Other things I wanted to add:

Some of the stories, such as the SI, give the player many many chances to randomly shock people that irritate them. Seriously, some of them are basically, "What, you have shinier shoes than I?" [shock]. 50 DS pts. And that is just a very mild example of the random pointless cruelty that can happen in the game.

There's been two of the OGR romances I have done, and one I stopped.

Now, remember I mentioned aborting a romance arc. It was my first toon, my female SW.

I'll avoid character bashing here, which is better than I used to be. Anyhow, I had starting flirting with Quinn, but it didn't take long before the character kind of bored me. He didn't ask to flirt too much, in game he seemed too much of a brown-noser and was overly shy about returning my SW's advances. I frankly didn't think too much of it and I knew I could end the romance at any point as long as I wasn't silly enough to choose any sort of marriage proposal.

Spoiler


After that part of the story happens, I ended the romance. That didn't stop the flirts for about 2 more conversations though. I find it a little annoying, since I had already broken things off. However, I exercised the freedom the developers gave me.

I ignored him.

I really still don't like the character, I am still kinda ticked he's the only full romance option for females, and I was annoyed that it took a bit for the flirts to stop. Don't get me wrong, I would like more options for the lady SW (and other classes.) Pierce..isn't fair, and I would like to see Jaesa without rerolling.

PS: I've been playing a very LS Jedi (LS IV, 50 DS pts total, lvl 35) and she ended up doing a FTB with Cedrax. It was a calculated move. She knew Cedrax wouldn't commit and wanted to lose her virginity. When it ended, she just shrugged and went back to her current traditional Jedi ways.