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PvP: Gear or Skill?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
PvP: Gear or Skill?

Juzzyx's Avatar


Juzzyx
11.22.2012 , 06:49 AM | #21
Love all these people who have never ran with a descent premade in their life saying "they get killed in equal footing" lol no they don't 8v8 is equal footing and good premades win every game. If you positioned yourself up for a 1v4 then that's why you aren't allowed to play with the good premades.
Dangerous missions are what I do best.

Juzzyx's Avatar


Juzzyx
11.22.2012 , 06:52 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Hystorian View Post
LOL bolster system anyone? LOL
Get yourself to 50, put your recruit gear on and then post here.
Recruit gear is for scrubs though. I beat people up equally. Doesn't matter how good or bad their gear is. I kill them all the same. I think pre 50 wzs are much worse when you're level 15 without any cc and you fight a lvl 40 of your class abusing the CC advantage because they have all of their CC learned. Oh and defensive cds and whatnot.
Dangerous missions are what I do best.

Doomsdaycomes's Avatar


Doomsdaycomes
11.22.2012 , 06:59 AM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by Kalfear View Post
Either your farming under geared players (and its literally no fun or challenge) or your going up against the ranked rejects that run premades 24/7 in unranked WZs because they cant hack the challenge on equal footing (and if you do catch one of them alone they die pretty easy to be honest. They only excell when its 4 on 1 or 4 with gear advantage. Just no class losers really).
Ah... someone's a little butt hurt...

=P I'll let you in on a little secret. 9 times out 10, that premader you managed to "Get alone" isn't actually fighting back.

They're either:

1. Stalling you till help comes if they're in a critical locaiton. They -could- try an all out dps race with you and maybe even kill you, but doing so leaves them vunerable if your buddies show up. (Can't remember how many times a solo guard doesn't bother to call incs cause he can take the 1 attacker, kills my team mate, and then dies when I pop out of stealth cause he's only got 10% left.)

2. Moving to a critical location. Again, I know I'll personally ignore you (or cc/slow you) if I'm moving to a critical location. It will take longer for me to kill you in the middle of no where and the get there, then to just die and respawn to the critical location.

=P not saying there aren't sucky players getting carried by premades, but you really just sound butt hurt at this point. Oh noes, them big bad premaders beats me in my PuG teams. Damn those unskilled jerks with their guarded healers, focussed dps, cross healing, objective oriented strategies. Shame on them for not being a 1 v 1 hero like me!

robotkar's Avatar


robotkar
11.22.2012 , 07:09 AM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by MidichIorian View Post
50 % class/spec
40 % skill
10 % gear
true.
That's why i dont understand why the Wh gear will be equal to the Ewh gear. I guess the noobs are crying that it takes too much time to grind it
Marsellus Wallace <HUN>
I want my rancors back
SWTOR Open PvP Concept - Faction Base System, Please /SIGN

Wainamoinen's Avatar


Wainamoinen
11.22.2012 , 08:47 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by Doomsdaycomes View Post
=P I'll let you in on a little secret. 9 times out 10, that premader you managed to "Get alone" isn't actually fighting back.

They're either:

1. Stalling you till help comes if they're in a critical locaiton.
2. Moving to a critical location.
You missed out:
3. Letting himself die so he can respawn somewhere useful quicker than running 5 miles. Voidstar and Huttball in particular, but also the other maps.

Also, poster you quoted still seems to riding that rather tired pony, Haxencheats.
It's a small world and it smells funny, I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money.
Ilmarinen 55 Scoundrel (Red Eclipse)

Zunayson's Avatar


Zunayson
11.22.2012 , 08:58 AM | #26
It would seem that it's gear over skill, and in the 49 bracket, it seems like that more because people are garbage... I mean... really bad. Now I pretty much always top the charts on my team whether I'm on my twink or my lv 15 assassin or something.

Now, the skillcap for a game like this is dangerously low. If you come across a good player, there's not much you can do to stop him. Unfortunately, his success, while some of it is gear, is also based on some skill. It's true that sometimes you just cannot react because you're stunned, or you got insta-killed, or something like that. It may seem that the person who killed you is most likely unskilled. However, people usually become pretty decent at the game after awhile of grinding their war hero gear lol. Anyways, just know that once you're in augmented BM (Don't do it! The next patch removes bm! Just save up on credits and comms, and be ready to buy a full set of war hero gear!), you'll be tearing up war hero people if you're really good (And by really I mean "actually", not "very" :P).

Simply put, the game is about skill a good amount, but gear can make a difference. Of course, luck is a great deal of a factor too, but even you can get lucky....
Quote: Originally Posted by Uber_the_Goober View Post
Bioware couldn't balance a sheet of plywood if it were laying [sic] on the ground.
Quote: Originally Posted by Aragost View Post
Make sure you take 3/3 in the "knowing how to play" box

Wainamoinen's Avatar


Wainamoinen
11.22.2012 , 09:39 AM | #27
Actually, I'm not sure the x%class/y%gear/z%skill idea captures it best. Try multipliers instead, for variety:

Multiply together a score for their class, their skill and their gear to get how dangerous a player they are. A better player can make better use of a good class or good gear. You can argue about what weight to give each score. Fractions allowed.

Class. No class can do nothing, whatever people like to say, so this doesn't begin at zero. But some are definitely easier to do well on, or harder to do much on.

7 (Arsenal Merc) to
10 (Sent/Mara).

Skill. This can go all the way from zero (did nothing all game to help you win) to 10 (the perfect player, we have never seen his - or her - like). Some people may even be such a threat to their own team's chances they deserve a negative, but I won't be so cruel as to propose it.

0 = Useless. Actually useless, nothing, an empty slot.
5 = Average player. Virtually everyone thinks they're above average. I know I do. At least I accept I may be kidding myself.
10 = The king of all PvP gods. This is not you.

Gear. All gear is some use, so again it doesn't start at zero. Let's say naked is 1. Fully (correctly) augmented War Hero with modified min-maxed mods would be 10.

1 = Naked
4 = Questing greens
6 = Recruit
8 = Battlemaster
8.5 = Augmented Battlemaster
9 = War Hero
9.5 = Augmented War Hero
10 = Min-maxed modified Augmented War Hero.

So to get a score, give some values for each category. The perfect player would get 10 in each, for a 1000 rating (10 x 10 x 10). I'll use myself as a guinea pig.

Class: 8
My main's a Scrapper. I'd argue I'm basically more use than an Arsenal Merc (7) or Lethality Operative, but most classes get more breaks than mine.

Skill: 7
I'm decent, or I wouldn't get asked to join people in PvP. What I may lack in ability I make up for in experience, having PvP'd through three servers with the moves. Elite War Hero.

Gear: 9.7
I'm in min-maxed aug WH, but I've slacked by not doing the PvE operations to get the PvE 2-piece shell bonus, so no top score.

My score: 8 x 7 x 9.7 = 543.2

Draki is a JG on my server. They're a long-timer in Nostrum Dolus, probably Red Eclipse's top PvP guild, and was scary before the buff to focus.

Draki's score: 9.5 x 9 x 10 = 855

Mr'Noob is an imaginary sorc on Jung Ma. He just made 50, and has queued for PvP for the first time without picking up any recuit gear. He knew no better.

Mr'Noob's score: 8.5 x 2 x 4 = 68

Misspvp knows what she's doing, is pretty hot at warzones, and has just rolled up a marauder to 50 to see how it plays.

Misspvp's score: 10 x 8 x 6 = 480

So Miss PvP would give me problems and murder Mr'Noob, but Draki would probably still swat her until she improved her gear.

You can argue about what score the different advanced classes or gear should get in this system. The point is that instead of adding together the different aspects as the first model does, it lets them interact, so strong skill lets you get more out of your recruit gear.

Bit OT. I was bored at lunchtime.
It's a small world and it smells funny, I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money.
Ilmarinen 55 Scoundrel (Red Eclipse)

TonyDragonflame's Avatar


TonyDragonflame
11.22.2012 , 09:51 AM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Wainamoinen View Post

Class.

Skill.

Gear. .
Voice teamspeak
Pocket healer behind your back
May the Force be with you!
Vigilance vr 100 | Scrapper vr 91 | Focus vr 91 | Assault vr 88 | Infiltration v 82 | Sharpshooter v 73
Manhunter 110+k killed imps | TRE | ToFN

Wainamoinen's Avatar


Wainamoinen
11.22.2012 , 10:04 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by TonyDragonflame View Post
Voice teamspeak
Pocket healer behind your back
I was thinking of an imaginary "dangerous" score of an individual player, outside factors like teammates or having a pocket healer aren't part of it.

I suppose you could try something different, and add a fourth factor for "teamwork", but that's going to be complicated by the fact it depends on the other players, so you have to take their abilites into account. You'd have to know their skill, their ability to work as a team, the level of teamwork (couple of mates on at the same time, or a select four-man composition with voice comms?): horrible to work out.

Would be interesting if you could determine a "force multiplier" for working as a coordinated team with tank, heals and dps though. How much more effective would it make you than the same four as random strangers? Twice, so like eight randoms?
It's a small world and it smells funny, I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money.
Ilmarinen 55 Scoundrel (Red Eclipse)

TheronFett's Avatar


TheronFett
11.22.2012 , 10:06 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by AMKSED View Post
25% Spec
35% Skill
40% Gear
The most accurate assessment ^

To all the geared out people saying that it's all about skill, I invite you to suit up in the recruit set for a week and find out just how "skilled" you really are. Unless you're a Pyro PT/Assault VG...then it has nothing to do with skill at all, or really gear for that matter. A blind kid having a seizure could play that spec.