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Same gender relationships clarifications?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Same gender relationships clarifications?
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natashina's Avatar


natashina
11.21.2012 , 05:50 AM | #3181
This has gotten too disheartening, and I think this is exactly what EA wants. To have the players pro-SGR drop out slowly and quietly, then sigh a breath of relief when they don't have to deal with this. They won't come out and say a word.

Shhhh, wouldn't want to scare any F2Ps? Even though I'm certain there are plenty of F2Ps that want this. SGRs are scary to EA/BWs nice safe bottom line.

Oh and for those that think this is like other features not put in? Do me a favor.

Do what we did; write to Allison Berryman, write to Joveth Gonzales, and write in to articles as needed. Do this for 10-13 months solid. Twitter devs a lot, only to watch vague answers. Then watch those answers deleted w/in a couple of hours, say that the information was true that a developer not involved with the department of the feature you care about, who's the only one speaking about it at all.

Watch as all the developers/writers that publicly promise the content leave the company with no one allowed to/have the courage to say whether or not those promises are still good. Watch as they make assurances of these promises on a private scale, not daring to touch it on the public scale.


Oh, bonus points if the mods bury your threads so far back that most players will never see it. Then find out that even an informal date has been broken and with no acknowledgment as such (some time this year my sorry Jedi arse.)

Then, after months of the same answers, make sure plenty of people come into those threads and tell you that your requests don't matter; that they are gross and wrong.

We didn't just sit back twiddling our thumbs or just posting about it, we wrote to mods and devs quite a bit. We've Facebook, Twittered, E-Mailed, PM'd and snail mailed. What have you (general) done to get information on your feature promised before launch?

Go do all those things and then come back and tell this group about importance.

Oh and make sure you watch for game articles stating that (in example) player housing has already made it in. It will not change unless you write to the editor.

Yes, we had to write a known gaming news site to correct an issue. They claimed that SGRs were already in The Old Republic and EA went that "go to print." We had to write in a day or so later to get it corrected. EA/BW has happy to claim that and won't come talk to us.

Only after a player does all those things can they even begin to picture what kind of a total clusterfish this really is. Glad I can still enjoy the game, unlike for some others that I want to give big hugs to.

Yeah, I'm really down tonight. Not really a huge fan of Turkey Day and going up to see my in-laws isn't fun. Oh well, take care guys, and I hope everyone has a safe and Happy Thanksgiving (in the US) or just a Happy Thursday.

ImperialSun's Avatar


ImperialSun
11.21.2012 , 05:51 AM | #3182
Quote: Originally Posted by Uluain View Post
No one will see my storyline with my companion but me. Or, were the option there, no one would see me [Flirt]ing with an NPC but me. So no, this isn't about showing off my orientation.

This content ought to have been in at launch or, failing that, all romantic options should have been delayed. It wasn't, and they weren't. Hence this thread to ask for clarification about how this content will be implemented when it is added.

I am sorry it's not content that interests you. Not everything will be. But that doesn't justify entering this thread out of all the threads out there talking about pending content or services (chat bubbles, hood toggles, paid transfers, etc.) to say that what you want should matter more.

Doing so here but not there makes your post look like a poorly disguised attack on the content itself.

Do go ahead and post in threads concerning content you do support. Or if you can't find any, make your own. But to come here, into this thread, which is one of two places on these entire forums that any discussion of pending same-gender romantic content is permitted, just to shout it down is rude. So please don't.
"This content ought to have been in at launch or, failing that, all romantic options should have been delayed"

Ahh the old 'if I dont get my specific romance content, no one should have any at all' arguement....classy

Way to champion your cause...

Driz

ImperialSun's Avatar


ImperialSun
11.21.2012 , 06:04 AM | #3183
Quote: Originally Posted by natashina View Post
This has gotten too disheartening, and I think this is exactly what EA wants. To have the players pro-SGR drop out slowly and quietly, then sigh a breath of relief when they don't have to deal with this. They won't come out and say a word.

Oh and for those that think this is like other features not put in? Do me a favor.

Do what we did; write to Allison Berryman, write to Joveth Gonzales, and write in to articles as needed. Do this for 10 months solid. Twitter devs a lot, only to watch vague answers. Then watch those answers deleted w/in a couple of hours.

Oh, bonus points if the mods bury your threads so far back that most players will never see it. Then find out that even an informal date has been broken and with no acknowledgment as such (some time this year my sorry Jedi arse.)

Then, after months of the same answers, make sure plenty of people come into those threads and tell you that your requests don't matter.

We didn't just sit back twiddling our thumbs or just posting about it, we wrote to mods and devs quite a bit. We've Facebook, Twittered, E-Mailed, PM'd and snail mailed. What have you (general) done to get information on your feature promised before launch?

Go do all those things and then come back and tell this group about importance.

Oh and make sure you watch for game articles stating that (in this case) player housing has already made it in. It will not change unless you write to the editor.

Only after a player does all those things can they even begin to picture what kind of a total clusterfish this really is. Glad I can still enjoy the game, unlike for some others that I want to give big hugs to.

Yeah, I'm really down tonight. Not really a huge fan of Turkey Day and going up to see my in-laws isn't fun. Oh well, take care guys, and I hope everyone has a safe and Happy Thanksgiving (in the US) or just a Happy Thursday.
You talk the talk but the fact is, you even refer to SGRs as "feature promised before launch"...thats where most of the problem lies IMO....you have set the wrong expectations...

The only thing promised before launch was that SGRs would NOT be in the live game and that they MAY be implemented in future. Anyone following the game knew that SGRs were NOT goin to be included in Live. And yet, because it suits your agenda and makes you sound victimised for the purposes of your spin on the situation you choose to lie about the facts surrounding SGRs being promised but not delivered.

That IMO is one of the main reasons your campaign lacks credability. The constant insistence on twisting facts and passing off statements as true when they are not has lead to you believing too much of your own spin and you have been left disappointed...

I''ve seen everything from "this is fact, SGRs are coming, its just a case of when and not if" through to....."please can devs confirm release date as promised for SGRs so that the haters know what date to cancel their subs on"....

And all of the above sensationalism with NO actual facts or official confirmation to back it up. A small minority within the SGR community have peddled this line about SGRs are promised and definitely coming so long that the rest of the SGR community now believe it to be gospel when it never has been...that has set entirely the wrong level of expectation within the rest of the SGR community IMO and is now making people even more disaapointed and disenchanted than they needed to have been, sadly

Driz

Lent_San's Avatar


Lent_San
11.21.2012 , 06:26 AM | #3184
Quote: Originally Posted by ImperialSun View Post
Ahh the old 'if I dont get my specific romance content, no one should have any at all' arguement....classy
Way to champion your cause...
Driz
Classic boring old argument of someone who simply doesn't get it. I am not interested in hetero-romancing in the game. So the content isn't specific for me, it's vital. I can't play any chars that I'm not interested in, so I'm not playing.

Furthermore, as has been stated often enough, the content has been announced from the start and has since been delayed. So it's actual content, not specific one. Specific is if I want my char to have flaming yellow hair and cry if I don't get it. That's specific. SGRAs are not.

If you need more examples of "specific" vs. "actual", feel free to contact me. I'll be happy to explain.

natashina's Avatar


natashina
11.21.2012 , 06:27 AM | #3185
If you dare, find every incarnation of this thread and read it. Like I did, before I first started posting in March, and the catching up I did before I started posting again in September. Read all of it. Then tell me what hasn't been done, what has been done, and what BW has come onto the forums and said.

They confirmed it at the Guild Summit, so that info is about 8 months old or so. They promised it at Launch and reconfirmed it at the Guild Summit. And yes, myself and others have been using every means of contacting the Devs and Mods about this.

The deleted Tweet? It's very real.

The Powers That Be (whomever controls the flow of information) not saying a word after Erickson, Reid and others left to reaffirm the statement? Real.

People writing to the devs and mods every week? Real.

If there is any scrap of direct and solid information by anyone at EA/BW regarding SGRs on ToR's site, please put it up here and I'll glad add it.

Look, what it comes down to for me is that this is promised content. Promised before the game went live and promised since. That was back in March, and it's more than fair to ask for further clarification. We have been writing steadily since January asking for any clarity, and I'll be happy to share some of my PMs to mods if anyone likes.

The one promise we were given was, "Some time this year." I can bring out the links to the Darth Hater transcription of the Guild Summit if you need proof of that statement. That promise appears to be broken, though to be fair they never did say if it was within 2012 or within a year after the Guild Summit.

This is a quote from the Guild Summit:

Quote: Originally Posted by Daniel Erickson
(The question, gathered from online submissions, was summed up as, "Is there any update on same gender romance?")


This is an interesting one because it sort of lit up, and we didn't honestly -- if we should give an update on it every single time -- We've always said the same thing with it, which is that it's coming, and it's coming with story updates. And we totally understand when people hear "soon", um, maybe I should have put the TM next to it that, "writer Soon"? The writers have a much, much larger lead time than you would expect, and we wanna do any of this stuff right. We heard suggestions, and we do read the stuff, and let's talk a little about the stuff we were not willing to do. We were not willing to go in and just change all the dialogue to work for the other gender. That is not writing. That is not good storytelling.
Here's a video from the guild summit, by Daniel Erickson:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...YvW50M#t=1357s

Here is the transcripts the PAX Q&As on Darth Hater with a mention about SGRs coming in The Old Republic:
Day One Day Two



Oh and if you're curious about the deleted Hall Hood Tweet? This is the video link to PvP developer Gabe Amatangelo's interview with a mention of SGRs.

The Tweet that was deleted confirmed that SGRs are supposed to be coming with Makeb, just as Mr. Amatangelo said. The Tweet was up for a couple of hours before being removed.


If you need further proof, please ask. I have an entire SGRA FAQ that has all the links and proof a person could want about this.


They never said one way or the other. Therein lies the problem and yes, one many of the posters here have worked hard to determine.


If anyone feels we are wasting our time, please don't come in here and say as such. I have too much respect as a gamer to do it to anyone else's thread, grow up and please don't do it here. I never lied nor exaggerated.

Lent_San's Avatar


Lent_San
11.21.2012 , 06:29 AM | #3186
Quote: Originally Posted by ImperialSun View Post
And all of the above sensationalism with NO actual facts or official confirmation to back it up.
I have contacted an in-game GM who confirmed that SGRAs are coming. There have been official statements on this, from the start.

Palar's Avatar


Palar
11.21.2012 , 06:31 AM | #3187
Quote: Originally Posted by ImperialSun View Post
The only thing promised before launch was that SGRs would NOT be in the live game and that they MAY be implemented in future. Anyone following the game knew that SGRs were NOT goin to be included in Live. And yet, because it suits your agenda and makes you sound victimised for the purposes of your spin on the situation you choose to lie about the facts surrounding SGRs being promised but not delivered.
Quote: Originally Posted by Stephen Reid
Due to the design constraints of a fully voiced MMO of this scale and size, many choices had to be made as to the launch and post-launch feature set. Same gender romances with companion characters in Star Wars: The Old Republic will be a post-launch feature. Because The Old Republic is an MMO, the game will live on through content expansions which allow us to include content and features that could not be included at launch, including the addition of more companion characters who will have additional romance options.
Oh yes, how vague a statement that was about the possibility.


Quote:
A small minority within the SGR community have peddled this line about SGRs are promised and definitely coming so long that the rest of the SGR community now believe it to be gospel when it never has been...that has set entirely the wrong level of expectation within the rest of the SGR community
Quote: Originally Posted by Daniel Erickson
It is coming and it is coming with story updates. It is something that depends on the writers and we want to do right, and writers have a long lead time. We did not want to just change all the dialogue for the other gender. That is not writing, that is not story telling. This was cut originally because of budget and time issues. We have designs, we know what romance options we want to put in for this. It is coming when full story comes, and full story is coming this year.
Oh yeah, clearly we imagined that as well.

Quote:
We are still on track IMO and is now making people even more disaapointed and disenchanted than they needed to have been, sadly

Driz
Shoving their heads in the sand and refusing to answer any of the questions raised over the last ten months does tend to create disenchantment, indeed.

"We don't know when, or who, or how, but it's still on track with what we said in March"... apparently, they couldn't even stand by that. I say apparently, because all I can do is pluck guesses from the void that passes for the 'improved communication' era of Joveth. At least we got to find out what was in Hall Hood's mug... yippee.

natashina's Avatar


natashina
11.21.2012 , 06:36 AM | #3188
Hopefully that's enough proof for you.

We look forward to your feedback, as always. Next time, make it tougher for the people that helped write and gather the FAQ to make you look silly and ill informed.

3/10 I give extra points for style, but lack of investigation just really botched the dismount. Research before you troll.

Oh wait, if you had researched and given some different views based on evidence, I would have personally welcomed that.

When it comes to this topic, we're well armed with links, videos and information. We have to be, given the nature of this.

Palar's Avatar


Palar
11.21.2012 , 06:43 AM | #3189
Before I forget, to give credit where it's due - you can see those quotes and more in Natashina's links.

natashina's Avatar


natashina
11.21.2012 , 06:50 AM | #3190
When I said, "credit where credit is due," I meant to the posters on this thread, not so much for me. Honestly, I just organized it and there is no way I could have done all that alone. I think everyone contributed, I just have the document saved on my computer when proof is needed. I know the expression is, "Links/screenshots or it didn't happen," so having that all on hand saves me some headaches.

Also, Chacc put up an excellent time line that I have linked as well. It's a good tl;dr version of the FAQ. I would recommend everyone checking that out. Chacc comes in here from time to time and keeps an eye out for further updates.

Edit: The current incarnation of the FAQ has been sent to Joveth Gonzales and Ms. Berryman multiple times, so they know what's on it. Figured I'd get that outta the way.

Edit #2: If anyone wants a copy of the SGR FAQ for themselves as I have it saved onto my computer, let me know and I can either pm or email it you.