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Slap in the face from Bioware

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Community Content
Slap in the face from Bioware

sumuser's Avatar


sumuser
11.17.2012 , 05:38 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by copperdogg View Post
thanks Bioware for the slap in the face with the new update. you might make more money off the game now but will have unhappy customers. i worked and slaved to get the credits for my rocket boots at a price of 4.5 mil credits. now you offer them to the new and free to play customers for hardly nothing. we subs that have played this game and dealt with all the glitches and broken patches and stuck by you the whole time get the shaft. things like rocket boots and speeders are a big part of this game and gives the player something to work for, things some others dont have. used to be you could look at a player and see the items and loot they had and know that person put some time in to that toon. well no more is that the case. i think it only right to refund the credits your PAYING CUSTOMERS spent for these things you almost give away now and let them have the chance to buy them from the cartel shop. what is the point of the game now, everyone has all the stuff you had to work for. a sad day for paying customes!!!! getting the shaft again..
I agree with copperdog here. The rocket pack and GTN for your ship were the two big ticket items to work for. While, if you know the "ins and outs" of what sells on the GTN, credits are hardly a big deal a lot of folks did work hard to unlock these perks by running countless dailies. Basically giving it away for a relatively small amount of CCs is bad customer service in my opinion... Not that I have any expectation EA will give a damn, let alone reimburse any players their credits back.
Jedi Covenant
Apotheosis | lvl 50 | Bounty Hunter
Utnapishtim | lvl 50 | Sith Warrior

Missandei's Avatar


Missandei
11.17.2012 , 05:44 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by copperdogg View Post
it is fake money, its not fake time i put into getting the fake money. thats the point i am trying to make here. i spent alot of time grinding to got them, and now you can create a free account and get boots just like that. not cool, oh and the nice thing about these forums is i can come in here and gripe about this as much as i want. so the get used to it statment was uncalled for.

Thanks
You gaming attitude is somewhat wrong. And a matter to consider to change.
Ask yourself - why are you playing the game?
The normal answer - is to have fun BY GAMEPLAY.
And what you are saying is that you are not having the fun in the gameplay itself... It is looked like you are in desperate need of self-confidence improve by boasting with some items. «Yay! Look at me - Im better than you because i spend a lot of time in game to grind credits, while all of you have enjoying your reallife!»

Thus if you are don`t enjoying the process of playing the game, then maybe it is time to think about something other than wasting your time on it? There is no reason to make your gameplaying as another job/work.
Missandei Shadow ...yet shadows can kill. And oft-times a very small man can cast a very large shadow.

JediMasterKevinl's Avatar


JediMasterKevinl
11.17.2012 , 05:47 AM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by sumuser View Post
I agree with copperdog here. The rocket pack and GTN for your ship were the two big ticket items to work for. While, if you know the "ins and outs" of what sells on the GTN, credits are hardly a big deal a lot of folks did work hard to unlock these perks by running countless dailies. Basically giving it away for a relatively small amount of CCs is bad customer service in my opinion... Not that I have any expectation EA will give a damn, let alone reimburse any players their credits back.
No, they won't. And they shouldn't have to, this is a stupid thing to complain about and I have no idea why anyone bothers or cares. Sure, it's a large amount of credits. But who really gives a ****?
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sumuser's Avatar


sumuser
11.17.2012 , 06:56 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by JediMasterKevinl View Post
No, they won't. And they shouldn't have to, this is a stupid thing to complain about and I have no idea why anyone bothers or cares. Sure, it's a large amount of credits. But who really gives a ****?
Because it diminishes a player's accomplishment. While I have not unlocked the rocket boost myself, I have grinded out armor, schematics, and various mods/enchancements. If EA is going to offer an alternative way of gaining these items, the cost should be a little more in-synch with the efforts players who bought / unlocked it with credits put into it. I think that's only fair.

I'm not arguing that EA shouldn't change credit costs, drop rates, ect as they deem needed for the evolving game, I'm just saying lets make sure the CC cost matches the alternative method. Otherwise the system encourages pay-to-win.
Jedi Covenant
Apotheosis | lvl 50 | Bounty Hunter
Utnapishtim | lvl 50 | Sith Warrior

Scovina's Avatar


Scovina
11.17.2012 , 11:33 PM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by sumuser View Post
Because it diminishes a player's accomplishment. While I have not unlocked the rocket boost myself, I have grinded out armor, schematics, and various mods/enchancements. If EA is going to offer an alternative way of gaining these items, the cost should be a little more in-synch with the efforts players who bought / unlocked it with credits put into it. I think that's only fair.

I'm not arguing that EA shouldn't change credit costs, drop rates, ect as they deem needed for the evolving game, I'm just saying lets make sure the CC cost matches the alternative method. Otherwise the system encourages pay-to-win.
What exactly in legacy perks give you pay to win? Rocket boots are a convenience pure and simple. Nothing in the cash shop or legacy gives a player a massive boost that suggest pay to win. It does not diminish your accomplishment that you ground out 4mil creds. The real accomplishment was that you had the patience to save for it. What price would in cartel coins do you feel would be sufficient? $10 in real money $20 perhaps. It is a nice perk to have yes but it is in no way a slap to your face. You still made the sacrifice and that still means something. However with the credit cap CC is the only way to get the f2p players to spend money. They need something to spend it on and I think $5 is pretty reasonable. Besides most of the other global unlocks are similar in price.

Taking your scenario of it needs to be in line for time invested vs cost (assuming it takes 2 hours of dailies per day at a gain of 250k per day) I would need to work at a real job for the equivalent of 18 hours. Now given that minimum wage (lets not worry about higher earners because that makes this even worse) is not an even number lets say $8/hr for just neat math sake, I would have to spend $144 in real money for the comparison to credits earned per hour. There are many variables here because I may make more in credits than you do per hour or even less which makes the real world comparison higher or lower but then this is just about an average as 250k is reasonable doing dallies. Now we are only doing some rough math here but you get the point being that it would make the game cost prohibitive and very out of sync.

sumuser's Avatar


sumuser
11.18.2012 , 12:45 AM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by Scovina View Post
What exactly in legacy perks give you pay to win? Rocket boots are a convenience pure and simple. Nothing in the cash shop or legacy gives a player a massive boost that suggest pay to win. It does not diminish your accomplishment that you ground out 4mil creds. The real accomplishment was that you had the patience to save for it. What price would in cartel coins do you feel would be sufficient? $10 in real money $20 perhaps. It is a nice perk to have yes but it is in no way a slap to your face. You still made the sacrifice and that still means something. However with the credit cap CC is the only way to get the f2p players to spend money. They need something to spend it on and I think $5 is pretty reasonable. Besides most of the other global unlocks are similar in price.

Taking your scenario of it needs to be in line for time invested vs cost (assuming it takes 2 hours of dailies per day at a gain of 250k per day) I would need to work at a real job for the equivalent of 18 hours. Now given that minimum wage (lets not worry about higher earners because that makes this even worse) is not an even number lets say $8/hr for just neat math sake, I would have to spend $144 in real money for the comparison to credits earned per hour. There are many variables here because I may make more in credits than you do per hour or even less which makes the real world comparison higher or lower but then this is just about an average as 250k is reasonable doing dallies. Now we are only doing some rough math here but you get the point being that it would make the game cost prohibitive and very out of sync.
The P2W mentality is that it is easier to buy then to grind. In other words, unless you're broke as hell, why would anyone choose to grind out 4 million over spending $5? So my point is lower the cost in legacy to say 1 or 2 million if the CC cost is goin to be at its current rate. I understand that credits - real money is a subjective topic... However my rule of thumb would be to set the cost so that an "average" player would be inclined to see the choices available to be balanced. I understand EA wants to make more money and I don't have a problem with that... But when you start to encourage a community that lacks any sense of *delayed gratification* you, IMO, start to degrade the MMO.

As an adult I completely get and agree with the argument that not everyone can grind hours of game time per day. So for us adults who can afford it, buying via CC is, IMO, fair. But when you set the price such that it would make more "average" subscribers more inclined to spend $$$ over playing the game and "working for it" (even if you have the time to do so) then you not only take away from the player who invested significant time to buy it, you encourage people to just buy things because its insane to spend days earning 4mil when for most adults, $5 isn't crap.

So if you want to sell it for $5 bucks because that's all that perk is demmed worth, then reflect that in future legacy cost by reducing the in-game credit cost to make that option more competitive.

In other words, EA shouldn't, IMO, start down the path of encouraging people just to buy perks, items, armor, ect instead of giving two "reasonable" options. Again, I conceded the final cost ratio is subjective.
Jedi Covenant
Apotheosis | lvl 50 | Bounty Hunter
Utnapishtim | lvl 50 | Sith Warrior

Scovina's Avatar


Scovina
11.18.2012 , 02:39 AM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by sumuser View Post
The P2W mentality is that it is easier to buy then to grind. In other words, unless you're broke as hell, why would anyone choose to grind out 4 million over spending $5? So my point is lower the cost in legacy to say 1 or 2 million if the CC cost is goin to be at its current rate. I understand that credits - real money is a subjective topic... However my rule of thumb would be to set the cost so that an "average" player would be inclined to see the choices available to be balanced. I understand EA wants to make more money and I don't have a problem with that... But when you start to encourage a community that lacks any sense of *delayed gratification* you, IMO, start to degrade the MMO.

As an adult I completely get and agree with the argument that not everyone can grind hours of game time per day. So for us adults who can afford it, buying via CC is, IMO, fair. But when you set the price such that it would make more "average" subscribers more inclined to spend $$$ over playing the game and "working for it" (even if you have the time to do so) then you not only take away from the player who invested significant time to buy it, you encourage people to just buy things because its insane to spend days earning 4mil when for most adults, $5 isn't crap.

So if you want to sell it for $5 bucks because that's all that perk is demmed worth, then reflect that in future legacy cost by reducing the in-game credit cost to make that option more competitive.

In other words, EA shouldn't, IMO, start down the path of encouraging people just to buy perks, items, armor, ect instead of giving two "reasonable" options. Again, I conceded the final cost ratio is subjective.
I understand the point you are trying to make but you fail to see it isn't pay to win period, end of story. You are paying for perks nothing more. Pay to win is if I don't buy this item I can't be competitive in this game. Rocket boots don't add an edge in pvp which is the only thing one might complain about. Some argument can be made to certain items we can get in the shop but they are subjective and very few. It just isn't pay to win. They aren't taking anything away from you they are making it more accessible than it was before. There are many items that they have done this with in this game. This happens in everything you do in daily life.

In order to have more people play over time things always get a bit cheaper here and there. This happened with speeders and may very well happen with some legacy items in the future. However this isn't the only instance of this happening in the game and this isn't the only game it happens in. In order to reach out to more players they have to change things up and trivializes nothing of what you accomplished before. You still have your accomplishment and if some player would prefer to buy it with cash then so be it. I see no problem here because I do feel EA should be encouraging buying of perks. I don't want it to turn into a true pay to win model and if you have played any Asian MMO's then you know exactly that you have to pay to be competitive at even a low level.

You have a right to voice your opinion on the matter to say you think credits and coins aren't comparable as far as investment and you may be right. I just happen to disagree that it in any way trivializes what you did. In fact I as most gamer's would not care how you went about getting them we just think it's cool that you have them. That doesn't mean that everyone will have to take your path. I am sure there are some people that made the credits in a day or two at most by use of the GTN. Does it trivialize what you did if it took you a month to make the same amount? And the answer is no.

TalkingDinosaur's Avatar


TalkingDinosaur
11.18.2012 , 02:47 AM | #28
How can rocket boots even be considered P2W?

Rocket Boots honestly just make you look cool. Unless you consider 110% speed boost for 12 seconds game breaking.
TALKINGDINOSAUR
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xSamuRaIxLeGeNd's Avatar


xSamuRaIxLeGeNd
11.18.2012 , 09:17 AM | #29
This is why i didn't buy them when they were availible cause i knew you rich *** noobs would get slapped for it...so now i laugh at you hahahahahah ^.^

Scovina's Avatar


Scovina
11.18.2012 , 09:49 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by xSamuRaIxLeGeNd View Post
This is why i didn't buy them when they were availible cause i knew you rich *** noobs would get slapped for it...so now i laugh at you hahahahahah ^.^
This is how I feel because if you did buy them for the accomplishment of doing it you need no other gratification than doing it for itself.