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Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones

iDraxter's Avatar


iDraxter
11.06.2012 , 12:42 PM | #421
Quote: Originally Posted by UncelSam View Post
its obvious your a premade runner, hdiing in a preamde team , fully backed by healers 24/7. Since you dont seem to seek any challange ingame you want easy runs, thats why you argue agaisnt solo players getting thier fun. All other player should bend over and let You have Your fun at the cost of thier own fun, Seem you dont want to let anyone have thier fun, if it is a threat against Your fun.

I say live and let live. Let us solo player go our way and have our way of fun, and you go your way. Go play with the other premade runners and you can take turns in hiding in preamde teams, pretending to be tough.
This is the last time i`m telling you the same thing over and over in normal wz....... a premade = 2 players minimum - 4 maximum the other 4-6 players are either other small premades or all are solo queuers like you to fill up the group! that s it, no rocket science.
And I don`t have a team i mostly solo queue my self since i`m lvling all my alts via pvp or I 2-man(which is a premade) with a friend
Firebat: Wanna turn up the heat?
It`s your money-but if I have spent as much time killing Jedi instead of your own kind...you might be winning this war

Theodulus's Avatar


Theodulus
11.06.2012 , 01:02 PM | #422
Why can't BW just allow us to queue a 8-man ops in NWZ? That will make the bad solo queuers get back to their care bear PvE game. PvP will be glorious without all the bads.

Pvtcarnage's Avatar


Pvtcarnage
11.06.2012 , 01:55 PM | #423
Quote: Originally Posted by UncelSam View Post
its obvious your a premade runner, hdiing in a preamde team , fully backed by healers 24/7. Since you dont seem to seek any challange ingame you want easy runs, thats why you argue agaisnt solo players getting thier fun. All other player should bend over and let You have Your fun at the cost of thier own fun, Seem you dont want to let anyone have thier fun, if it is a threat against Your fun.

I say live and let live. Let us solo player go our way and have our way of fun, and you go your way. Go play with the other premade runners and you can take turns in hiding in preamde teams, pretending to be tough.
I run mostly premade, so now people not to lazy to group up or people who actually have friends are hiding from challenge? You think we leave que if we run into a premade or something?

It blows my mind the rationale people will come with to justify their own short comings.

My first toon I played nothing but pug groups and ran into premades all the time and NOT ONCE did it cross my mind that it was not fair that they rolled us because they played together. I know we lost the game because half of the puggers played selfish death match 1vs1 and did not communicate and over time I realized that if I wanted to have fun I would need to not play with these puggers and would need to start a group of people that wanted a better chance to win.

Regular warzones are for everyone, just like if you que for a FP instead of making a group your chances of success will drop. You choose to solo que and you should take your own responsibility for were that leads you.

Other thought: What MMO has a single only player que that's worth playing? Does this exists?
"Equality is a perversion of the natural order!…It binds the strong to the weak. They [the weak] become anchors that drag the exceptional down to mediocrity. Individuals destined and deserving of greatness have it denied them.
-Darth Bane

Doomsdaycomes's Avatar


Doomsdaycomes
11.06.2012 , 03:52 PM | #424
First, lemme state -my- position again before making any comment, in the hopes we can avoid the usual false assumptions and petty insults.

50's pvp needs two things:

1. Cross server queueing for a great population/pool.
2. Better matchmaking that tries to match players according to group size. The typical match should be a 3-4 man premade, and then 4-5 pugs.

Yes I play in a group. I also have a 40hrs a week job, 3 hours commute, and several prior engagements/commitments, including a decent amount of time spent with my SO in Tera.


)-----------------------------------------------------------------(

Now, I wanted to comment on an argument I keep seeing, which is "PuG's just want their fun too."

Fun is a subjective term. Someone -could- find smashing their head into a brick wall fun. Someone could find anything besides eating chocolate all day "no fun."

The main reason I see these PuG's claiming PvP is "no fun" is because they are being beaten by a premade. In other words, they are -Losing.-

While we already discussed that fun is subjective, let's be real for a moment. It's very simple... people claim they are not having fun because they are losing. You can throw the usual "No, it just not fun because we don't have a chance!" but in the most basic terms, you are not having fun because you are -Losing.-

I sympathize, because I know that I do not find losing fun. A loss can be fun, but losing in general is not. It's alright to be honest and simply say: "It is no fun PuG'ing because we lose."

Once people stop trying to hide behind the facade of "just trying to have fun" and admit they want to win, then the real work can begin. How can BW fairly create a situation where a PuG's can win more often? Should they even attempt to create such a situation to appease them? Where is the line between a helping hand, and a welfare system? (Yes, this applies to real life too!)

You have to remember the current system (and a proposed split queue system) rewards players for competing. A winning team receives a higher reward (more comms) than losing team because the winners presumably put more effort in.

Are you, as PuG's willing to accept a smaller reward if the system is chained to -lower- the effort you must put in to win?

If the answer is no, then you need to raise your level of effort to win or suffer.

If the answer is yes, then that is a discussion for another time.

Theodulus's Avatar


Theodulus
11.06.2012 , 04:22 PM | #425
Quote: Originally Posted by Doomsdaycomes View Post
Are you, as PuG's willing to accept a smaller reward if the system is chained to -lower- the effort you must put in to win?

If the answer is no, then you need to raise your level of effort to win or suffer.

If the answer is yes, then that is a discussion for another time.
How about remove the queue solo button instead? As someone that premades that shouldn't affect you and the PUGs you perceive as bad would stay the hell away from your fun. Don't you agree that removing the queue solo button would enable a whole new competitive PvP in swtor? No worry about losing rank. Why not only allow 4-man and 8-man queue options to minimize queue times and maximize the competitive PvP fun? The solo queuers can go **** themselves or group up. What is your honest opinion on that?

Doomsdaycomes's Avatar


Doomsdaycomes
11.06.2012 , 04:26 PM | #426
Quote: Originally Posted by Theodulus View Post
How about remove the queue solo button instead? As someone that premades that shouldn't affect you and the PUGs you perceive as bad would stay the hell away from your fun. Don't you agree that removing the queue solo button would enable a whole new competitive PvP in swtor? No worry about losing rank. Why not only allow 4-man and 8-man queue options to minimize queue times and maximize the competitive PvP fun? The solo queuers can go **** themselves or group up. What is your honest opinion on that?
Quote: Originally Posted by Doomsdaycomes View Post
First, lemme state -my- position again before making any comment, in the hopes we can avoid the usual false assumptions and petty insults.

50's pvp needs two things:

1. Cross server queueing for a great population/pool.
2. Better matchmaking that tries to match players according to group size. The typical match should be a 3-4 man premade, and then 4-5 pugs.

Yes I play in a group. I also have a 40hrs a week job, 3 hours commute, and several prior engagements/commitments, including a decent amount of time spent with my SO in Tera.
Would you like to attempt engaging in an intelligent discussion with me again, or are you going to vomit unreasonable nonsense at me?

Pvtcarnage's Avatar


Pvtcarnage
11.06.2012 , 04:35 PM | #427
Quote: Originally Posted by Doomsdaycomes View Post
First, lemme state -my- position again before making any comment, in the hopes we can avoid the usual false assumptions and petty insults.

50's pvp needs two things:

1. Cross server queueing for a great population/pool.
2. Better matchmaking that tries to match players according to group size. The typical match should be a 3-4 man premade, and then 4-5 pugs.

Yes I play in a group. I also have a 40hrs a week job, 3 hours commute, and several prior engagements/commitments, including a decent amount of time spent with my SO in Tera.


)-----------------------------------------------------------------(

Now, I wanted to comment on an argument I keep seeing, which is "PuG's just want their fun too."

Fun is a subjective term. Someone -could- find smashing their head into a brick wall fun. Someone could find anything besides eating chocolate all day "no fun."

The main reason I see these PuG's claiming PvP is "no fun" is because they are being beaten by a premade. In other words, they are -Losing.-

While we already discussed that fun is subjective, let's be real for a moment. It's very simple... people claim they are not having fun because they are losing. You can throw the usual "No, it just not fun because we don't have a chance!" but in the most basic terms, you are not having fun because you are -Losing.-

I sympathize, because I know that I do not find losing fun. A loss can be fun, but losing in general is not. It's alright to be honest and simply say: "It is no fun PuG'ing because we lose."

Once people stop trying to hide behind the facade of "just trying to have fun" and admit they want to win, then the real work can begin. How can BW fairly create a situation where a PuG's can win more often? Should they even attempt to create such a situation to appease them? Where is the line between a helping hand, and a welfare system? (Yes, this applies to real life too!)

You have to remember the current system (and a proposed split queue system) rewards players for competing. A winning team receives a higher reward (more comms) than losing team because the winners presumably put more effort in.

Are you, as PuG's willing to accept a smaller reward if the system is chained to -lower- the effort you must put in to win?

If the answer is no, then you need to raise your level of effort to win or suffer.

If the answer is yes, then that is a discussion for another time.
Well put!! +1
"Equality is a perversion of the natural order!…It binds the strong to the weak. They [the weak] become anchors that drag the exceptional down to mediocrity. Individuals destined and deserving of greatness have it denied them.
-Darth Bane

Theodulus's Avatar


Theodulus
11.06.2012 , 04:55 PM | #428
Quote: Originally Posted by Doomsdaycomes View Post
Would you like to attempt engaging in an intelligent discussion with me again, or are you going to vomit unreasonable nonsense at me?
I asked you a question. I repeat isn't it better to just remove the queue solo button? You don't want pugs to only face pugs since that would cause long queue times for premades. You also don't want any measures taken to level 50 PvP until x-server queues and you certainly don't want to wait longer for warzone pops because you are premading (or did you change your mind recently?). I think we all know x-server queues are never going to happen after they stealth removed that particular part in the queue window. We also know that premaders don't want to wait up to 15 minutes for a 4-man premade to be freed up from an ongoing warzone so they can be queued against each other. So what you suggest is wishful thinking that never is going to happen. That train left with the other 2 mil subs that left the game.

Removing the queue solo button would force solo queuers to premade and make the premaders happy. I know you love to ignore difficult questions and spout some other nonsense. Can you just answer with a simple yes or no and then a short motivation if the solo queue button should be removed now that we know what you suggest is never going to happen. I don't need an essay or book recommendations. I probably have read them all if they are somewhat known and involve politics and sci-fi.

Muramxx's Avatar


Muramxx
11.06.2012 , 05:22 PM | #429
Quote: Originally Posted by Theodulus View Post
Removing the queue solo button would force solo queuers to premade and make the premaders happy.
Ah the Elitist attitude never gets old.
PUG's: Want equality and a resonable chance to win rather then get facerolled as soon as they leave the safe area (which I have seen 4 people sitting near the safe area waiting to burn people as they come out) If your only winning 1 out of 25 games then who is winning the other 24...? Honestly who doesn't like to win? but there is a difference between 1 in 25 and 12 in 25.

Elitists: Don't want to be forced to have to wait and think "I don't see any problem with me farming comms for my 10th char with my friends that have been playing since the start of the game, against a group of noobs that are on there first one." I use the term noob because with f2p that exactly what your getting a bunch of new people that are just learning how to play the game meaning it will take time to make friends to make premade groups.) You also belive the game should conform to what you belive because you know all. "Why should we have to wait to face other premade groups? lets force the new people that just started playing to play like us or leave."

But hey if you want the new people to leave because they feel it's rediculas they can't win (which it is) then so be it have as much fun as you can now before you can't get into a pvp or better yet they flip the switch on the servers cause no one but the hardcore I am better then you audience is all that's left. Solo Que should be just that solo and there should be a group que. If you don't like the wait for a group then play like the majority of the servers and join a solo game and take your chance just like they do. hell from what I read hardly anyone does the ranked stuff because they are to scared to face a challenge when they can farm comms for beating up noobs.

Jarfunkz's Avatar


Jarfunkz
11.06.2012 , 05:26 PM | #430
I like to form premades, because it limits the amount of you bads in my group...
VicVega