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The future of F2P -- expressed in human resources poetry

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
The future of F2P -- expressed in human resources poetry

TMar's Avatar


TMar
10.08.2012 , 01:42 AM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Yogol View Post
I strongly disagree there... There will always be a WoW... always be a type of EVE... simply because there will always be people that prefer topay 15$ a month for 20-30-40 hours of entertainement...

And yes, the new players (the current 15-year-old geeks) are looking for something else than the original MMO costumers (us, the 25-year-old-geeks). But that doesn't mean no one will pay 15$ a month anymore.

Also, in case you are following trends, the f2p revenue stream is very, very fluid. Typically, younger f2p players need to be ''milked'' as soon as possible, because they will move on to the next game very, very fast. There is certainly a place in the gaming world for half a dozen MMOs that do not follow that model and cater to the needs of people who prefer to stay in one (or two or three) places.

On top of that, I really wonder how long it will last, how long a 15-year-old will jump from game to game to game. At a certain point, even those type of people have to stay in one place, me think.
I don't see there ever being another WoW. It's still there because people are invested in it. I would love to see their numbers of new account over the past couple of years. Sadly the time of subscription based games is coming to an end. It's just too small and too unsteady of a market anymore. The attention span of gamers these day is just far too small.
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simplius's Avatar


simplius
10.08.2012 , 03:33 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthMeerkat View Post
I had a long response but deleted it to ask, why do you still post here if you hate the game so much?

I regretted purchasing MOP but you don't see me on the WoW forums yapping about it.
because i paid for a product , that is sub-standard, and worse , it has the STAR WARS name on it

sub standard, i can live with, but the NAME demands respect,,and the way, theyre treating it is a disgrace

they stole half the game from wow, but dont take the best parts?,,the parts , that made wow a success?

they cut so many corners, that its embarassing for an "experienced" dev team

yea im pissed,, and im not the only one

i have raged some against MOP too, but wow at least gave me more than 5 happy years

this one stopped after 2 months

Goretzu's Avatar


Goretzu
10.08.2012 , 03:42 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by shava View Post
For those who are versed in the terms of art of business in the games industry, here is the job posting for the architect for F2P analysis for Bioware Austin. The shaper of things to come, as it were.

https://performancemanager4.successf...327&company=EA

If you aren't versed in business terms of art, don't panic, none of this is really unusual in the industry, on a glance. The interesting thing I suppose is that they are advertising this and don't have a full complement in place. More attrition? Less preparation? Who knows.

There would be fewer rumors about this game if the EA(/Bioware) folks were just a bit more transparent. The only thing that has EVER gotten CCP in trouble are the few times they've been utter gits and held cards close. It's been over twenty years since the publication of the Cluetrain Manifesto, yet companies with online customer bases still haven't woken up.

If you haven't read Cory Doctorow's FTW, this might be a fun time to do so. Cory's site says "Download for free" but throw the chap some money, he's awesome. The book postulates (among other things) a near future where MMOs and Zynga-like social gaming marketing neuromarketing strategies have merged into drug-like cartels. You can see an article I wrote that got promoted to the front page of Gamasutra a couple years ago on this which although it didn't get much comment on that site, got me some really disturbing confessional emails from social gaming marketing people on the side...

Bioware is F2P but I assure you they will be finding ways into your pockets. The industry has recognized that F2P is the only way to get a steady revenue stream now that current fashions in MMO gaming are causing the collapse of subscription gaming. Pity really, but there it is. We've become the flavor of the month club and subs don't weather that.

And AAA budgets don't weather the migrating herds the ooo-shiny-what's-next (to put it charitably) hoard. So F2P will be what we deal with for the future, whatever anyone feels about it. That, and indy games that grow with genius and innovation (and damned strong loyal community) but not AAA launches or budget (say, Minecraft as an example).

Interesting times! If only there were a big studio that were good at creating innovative genius games with strong communities and great story. Oh...damn... That's right they sold out to the American Sith.

Return to the Light! It's not too late to revise your models!

Meh, didn't work on SOE either. Well, I'll ride this one out. They're still doing better at it than Sony, IMNSHO. But they have time to do worse.


Yeah F2P or the Cashshop model is....... insidious, to say the least.

It might keep the game alive, but it won't give the same customer experience as subscription would (we can already see this by them nerfing chest and elite drops in order to make people buy stuff off the cashshop instead - selling stuff is the only tenenat to F2P/cashshop).
Real Star Wars space combat please, not Star Wars Fox! Maybe some PvP and flight too?
Goretzu's Law: As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving "Entitled" approaches 1

Lord_of_Mu's Avatar


Lord_of_Mu
10.08.2012 , 03:44 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by simplius View Post
because i paid for a product , that is sub-standard, and worse , it has the STAR WARS name on it

sub standard, i can live with, but the NAME demands respect,,and the way, theyre treating it is a disgrace

they stole half the game from wow, but dont take the best parts?,,the parts , that made wow a success?

they cut so many corners, that its embarassing for an "experienced" dev team

yea im pissed,, and im not the only one

i have raged some against MOP too, but wow at least gave me more than 5 happy years

this one stopped after 2 months
To be fair, WoW's success has come largely from taking what ever the competition were doing and making it their own. But that alone hasn't been enough. MoP now adds Poke'mon and Farmville to the mix for added measure.

SWTOR suffers from an extreme lack of uniqueness. The VO work and cut-scenes are great but they just aren't enough. A point I think I've raised far too many times to count. >_>

simplius's Avatar


simplius
10.08.2012 , 04:01 AM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by TMar View Post
I don't see there ever being another WoW. It's still there because people are invested in it. I would love to see their numbers of new account over the past couple of years. Sadly the time of subscription based games is coming to an end. It's just too small and too unsteady of a market anymore. The attention span of gamers these day is just far too small.
not the attention span, but we have seen in wow , what can be done with a mmo,,even an old one

usuall, more competition means better products, but here it seems to have the opposite effect

now they release games, when the marketing guys wants to,,not when the game is ready

so i buy a game , and have to wait 6-12 months , before its finished? NO!!

thats the real reason for game nomads,,who wants to sit in a game , that they cant play?

so we hear about "revolutionary new mmo", we go and check that out? same deal, only theyre

X months further back , than the first one..u get the picture right?

i know theres bound to be bugs,,CoX had them after 8 years,,wow too,,in a good game

we can "close our eyes" more for them,,thats why the core gameplay is so important

and this one fails in both,,buggy AND annoying,,not a good combination

simplius's Avatar


simplius
10.08.2012 , 04:04 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Lord_of_Mu View Post
To be fair, WoW's success has come largely from taking what ever the competition were doing and making it their own. But that alone hasn't been enough. MoP now adds Poke'mon and Farmville to the mix for added measure.

SWTOR suffers from an extreme lack of uniqueness. The VO work and cut-scenes are great but they just aren't enough. A point I think I've raised far too many times to count. >_>
yea the VOs are good,,im not sure how big part of budget they were?

what??blizzard stealing? LALALALALALLAAA I CAN NOT HEAR ANYTHING

Lord_of_Mu's Avatar


Lord_of_Mu
10.08.2012 , 04:08 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by simplius View Post
yea the VOs are good,,im not sure how big part of budget they were?
Unfortunately I'm not privy to the budget and distribution of cash for the project. However, the rumor mill suggests it was considerable.

Little to now way to validate that, that I'm aware of anyway.

simplius's Avatar


simplius
10.08.2012 , 04:18 AM | #18
u would need a sound studio,,at least 2 writers,,the actors( one at a time ofc)

seeing how many hours of VOs there are,,i would guess anything from 50-150 mio

those 50 mio would have been better spend on the actual game, VOs work better

in single player games, where there are no distractions. some VOs even drowned

in background noise from nearby combat etc

Goretzu's Avatar


Goretzu
10.08.2012 , 04:18 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Lord_of_Mu View Post
Unfortunately I'm not privy to the budget and distribution of cash for the project. However, the rumor mill suggests it was considerable.

Little to now way to validate that, that I'm aware of anyway.
Yeah, you've got to pay for the voices, you've got to develop the animations (and synch with the voices or vice versa) and then on top of that you've got the normal quest development.

So it can't be cheap (in money) or quick (in time) to develop............ which is the reason why prior MMORPGs used it much more sparingly (SWTOR isn't the first MMORPG to use VO and animations, it's just the first to use it so MUCH).



I really can't see the cashshop model supporting this kind of story development in the future, even if they sell everything as adventure packs, I can't see how they can keep the price reasonable AND include fully voiced and animated quests.
Real Star Wars space combat please, not Star Wars Fox! Maybe some PvP and flight too?
Goretzu's Law: As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving "Entitled" approaches 1

simplius's Avatar


simplius
10.08.2012 , 04:29 AM | #20
STO has started doing it too,,also a little in tera,,STO version is really bad,,

horrible clipping, glitchy animations,,i hope they stop doing that bullcrap,

it doesnt belong in MMO,,for obvious reasons, to quote another post

intelligence is knowing , that tomato is a fruit
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