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I've gone through the first three pages - Queuing for WZ/FPs rationale?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Flashpoints, Operations, and Heroic Missions
I've gone through the first three pages - Queuing for WZ/FPs rationale?
First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

iamthehoyden's Avatar


iamthehoyden
10.03.2012 , 10:14 AM | #51
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
Dude.... they said in Allisons post that it was not the playstyle they wanted. It was causing unintented problems (and I'm sure, many player complaints), so they stepped in and fixed it. "
Quote: Originally Posted by AllisonBerryman View Post
Hi everyone, we asked Rob Hinkle (Senior PvP Designer) to shed some more light on why this change was made. As many of you suspected, we implemented this change to reduce the frequency with which players abandon Warzone matches mid-fight. We found that Group Finder queues popping were a major cause of players leaving, and wanted to mitigate this negative impact on Warzones.
(bolded for emphasis)
This actually doesn't say anything about stacking queues not being intended. What it indicates is that one of the undesired results from stacking queues the way they had the system set up was that people were leaving wzs when a lfg popped.

Stacking queues is not a problem. What is a problem is when the lfg pops in the middle of a wz and people leave. So supress the lfg pop for that person. Pause them in queue (they stay #34 or whatever) while they're in the wz. As it stands, the lower level fps take forever and a day to find a group for. Now that people can't kill time doing wzs while in lfg, you'll likely (not for sure, but likely) see those queues stretch out even farther. I think there are more sensible ways to fix the issue of people leaving wzs.
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
Of course we could argue back and forth all day about the fix they chose, but that would be pointless.... they addressed a problem, and installed a fix. Working as intended now, even though some people don't like being forced to not stack queues.
Actually, it's not pointless. If they see that the community is not pleased with the fix they chose and has some ideas they may not have come up with, then perhaps they will change the way the fix is implemented. Unlike some people, I don't assume they're omnipotent gods or completely deaf.
aren't you a little short for a stormtrooper?
---------------
Fan Fiction: My Name is Solomon Crae The Man in the Box

Telsnow's Avatar


Telsnow
10.03.2012 , 10:15 AM | #52
The problem with people dropping from warzones has little to do with the group finder. People quit warzones because they dont like the map, a lack of healers on their team, too many bad players, and/or going up against premade teams that are more interested in farming them than ending the match quickly. The majority of people who leave warzones immediately requeue for pvp, so why destroy the group finder queue times even further with this heavy handed change? Its not going to help the issue of people dropping for warzones at all.

NinjaApacHe's Avatar


NinjaApacHe
10.03.2012 , 10:18 AM | #53
Quote: Originally Posted by Telsnow View Post
The problem with people dropping from warzones has little to do with the group finder. People quit warzones because they dont like the map, a lack of healers on their team, too many bad players, and/or going up against premade teams that are more interested in farming them than ending the match quickly. The majority of people who leave warzones immediately requeue for pvp, so why destroy the group finder queue times even further with this heavy handed change? Its not going to help the issue of people dropping for warzones at all.
Not totally true. Usually I leave only when the LFG queue pops up. So I agree with the reason of the change.

Telsnow's Avatar


Telsnow
10.03.2012 , 10:23 AM | #54
Quote: Originally Posted by NinjaApacHe View Post
Not totally true. Usually I leave only when the LFG queue pops up. So I agree with the reason of the change.
If you really enjoy standing around on Fleet waiting for the flashpoint queue to pop, you're really going to love this change because the rest of us who don't enjoy watching paint dry aren't going to bother using the group finder as much so by all means, have fun with an even greater wait time than before.

anakedcowboy's Avatar


anakedcowboy
10.03.2012 , 10:28 AM | #55
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
So to you personally, there is nothing to do except: queue for a WZ, queue for a FP, sit in fleet and complain? I see. Thing is, not everybody has such a self-constrained playstyle.
You're right, people should go out and do their heroic dailies while they wait for the gro-

what's that? You can't group at all while you're in the group finder queue? And it can take *hours* to get a pop for a DPS?

Well... stop being so self centered and ... keep unlearning and re-learning new crew skills..? participate in open world pvp?

Gosh, why is everyone so demanding and selfish with the time they spend doing and activity they pay for, over many other competing activities and services, in their personal leisure time?

Stop mis-representing what was said. The pvp designer doesn't want people leaving warzones (completely understandable) and they put in the a fix without regard to what it would do to both the GF and PVP queue times. They presumably did this because it was the quickest and/or easiest fix or a last minute band-aid. Lending credibility to this theory are the facts that it wasn't announced or even included in the patch notes originally. A solution that had been thought through and discussed would have been on someone's radar and at least made the patch notes.

Several other alternatives have been proposed that would keep people from quitting early. The quitting is what the dev wanted to avoid, not the ability to experience both sides of the PVE and PVP game. You are really fiercely defending a position that bioware didn't actually take, and it's silly.

The correct response to all of the threads on this topic should have been:

Quote:
"We appreciate all of your suggestions about alternative ways to reduce early quitting in warzones. We have heard the frustrations of players who feel the sting of team members abandoning a warzone at a crucial moment. We also understand and are excited that our players want to participate in both the exciting PVP aspects of our game, and use our group finder to experience PVE content and complete the daily quests that require its use. We will be looking at ways to make sure both are possible, and implementing the change in an upcoming patch.

Thank you for your feedback."
Allison, Joveth, whoever - Feel free to use this word for word if you want. Just do the right thing and help the players get across the frustration with this change to the devs.

anakedcowboy's Avatar


anakedcowboy
10.03.2012 , 10:30 AM | #56
Quote: Originally Posted by iamthehoyden View Post
Stacking queues is not a problem. What is a problem is when the lfg pops in the middle of a wz and people leave. So supress the lfg pop for that person. Pause them in queue (they stay #34 or whatever) while they're in the wz. As it stands, the lower level fps take forever and a day to find a group for. Now that people can't kill time doing wzs while in lfg, you'll likely (not for sure, but likely) see those queues stretch out even farther. I think there are more sensible ways to fix the issue of people leaving wzs.

Actually, it's not pointless. If they see that the community is not pleased with the fix they chose and has some ideas they may not have come up with, then perhaps they will change the way the fix is implemented. Unlike some people, I don't assume they're omnipotent gods or completely deaf.
This exactly, thank you.

They already have the mechanic to roll someone from a GF pop to requeuing them near the top of the list - that's exactly what happens when one of the people selected declines the group.

The mechanic already exists - use it, please.

theblaznee's Avatar


theblaznee
10.03.2012 , 10:35 AM | #57
Could you make another change, as it seems like the queue for dps'ers for FP's is rediculous now..

Do it so the people playing pvp can stay in the FP queue so they don't start from the bottom after each wz.. Should make it pop much faster for everyone..
Don't mistake my silence for ignorance, my calmness for acceptance or my kindness for weakness!

Fight hard, die well!

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
10.03.2012 , 10:44 AM | #58
Quote: Originally Posted by iamthehoyden View Post
(bolded for emphasis)
This actually doesn't say anything about stacking queues not being intended. What it indicates is that one of the undesired results from stacking queues the way they had the system set up was that people were leaving wzs when a lfg popped.

Stacking queues is not a problem. What is a problem is when the lfg pops in the middle of a wz and people leave. So supress the lfg pop for that person. Pause them in queue (they stay #34 or whatever) while they're in the wz. As it stands, the lower level fps take forever and a day to find a group for. Now that people can't kill time doing wzs while in lfg, you'll likely (not for sure, but likely) see those queues stretch out even farther. I think there are more sensible ways to fix the issue of people leaving wzs.

Actually, it's not pointless. If they see that the community is not pleased with the fix they chose and has some ideas they may not have come up with, then perhaps they will change the way the fix is implemented. Unlike some people, I don't assume they're omnipotent gods or completely deaf.
STACKING of queues, WAS THE CAUSE.... and you know it. Leaving because a queue popped was an allowed behavior due to the cause. So stop pretending otherwise. In a mature player base where people would respect the group they were in and not jump to a queue pop.... there would be no problem. But it's clearly not a mature player base, it's largely selfish and self-interested... so they stack and jump.

If you want to make JUMP the issue, that is fine... but they can't jump if they can't STACK. So STACKING is the root cause that is actionable by the game developers.
Forum disputatio ------> est completum ineptias.

iamthehoyden's Avatar


iamthehoyden
10.03.2012 , 10:51 AM | #59
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
STACKING of queues, WAS THE CAUSE.... and you know it. So stop pretending otherwise. In a mature player base where people would respect the group they were in and not jump to a queue pop.... there would be no problem. But it's clearly not a mature player base, it's largely selfish and self-interested... so they stack and jump.

If you want to make JUMP the issue, that is fine... but they can't jump if they can't STACK.
I'm quoting myself here because you either missed or intentionally misrepresented what I said.
Quote: Originally Posted by iamthehoyden View Post
This actually doesn't say anything about stacking queues not being intended. What it indicates is that one of the undesired results from stacking queues the way they had the system set up was that people were leaving wzs when a lfg popped.
One of the results of stacking queues was to cause people to leave wzs when a lfg queue would pop. I said it in my earlier post, I'll say it again here. So stop accusing me of pretending that wasn't the cause of the issue. Does their fix stop this? Yes. Does their fix have other negative consequences? Yes. Are there other possible soutions? Yes.
aren't you a little short for a stormtrooper?
---------------
Fan Fiction: My Name is Solomon Crae The Man in the Box

anakedcowboy's Avatar


anakedcowboy
10.03.2012 , 10:57 AM | #60
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
STACKING of queues, WAS THE CAUSE.... and you know it. Leaving because a queue popped was an allowed behavior due to the cause. So stop pretending otherwise. In a mature player base where people would respect the group they were in and not jump to a queue pop.... there would be no problem. But it's clearly not a mature player base, it's largely selfish and self-interested... so they stack and jump.

If you want to make JUMP the issue, that is fine... but they can't jump if they can't STACK. So STACKING is the root cause that is actionable by the game developers.
People leave a warzone because there is a scarcity problem. It can take a DPS hours to get a GF queue, and under the old system, minutes to get a warzone (which backfilled pretty quickly), though that could be optimized by reducing loading times, time to accept the invite, cinematics.

People wanting to experience both aspects of the game in a reasonable period of time is not a problem, it's a strength.