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Tanking in this game sucks


grallmate's Avatar


grallmate
09.20.2012 , 07:06 PM | #41
Quote: Originally Posted by Kyriosgundam View Post
I understand that but when I cant even kill the level 16 elite for the JK Story mission on Ord Mantell (on my own) and my gear is the best for its level and I still lose then something is wrong (and my Shadow and Assassin Tanks could take more punishment and deal more damage at that same level).
I loved leveling my Guardian tank, I don't remember any of the bosses because none of them were particularly tough. Interrupt, stun, CD and your golden. My assassin had a much tougher time until about level 35 but my PT (still only level 20) is just a cakewalk compared to both of them.

Also should note that at level 16 you are still essentially a DPS with heavy armour and a taunt. Plus Focus management is horrible in Soresu early on. Guardian tanking really blooms at about level 30 and just goes up from there. Its tough early but much easier than Assassin pre-Harnessed Darkness.

Some tips for that fight:
- Send T7 in first and taunt off him when he reaches about 25%
- Make sure you have a stim and medpack handy
- Use your stun
- Build 5 stacks of Sunder before you Master Strike
- Kill the adds first
- Consider running in Sho-Chii form for extra DPS/Focus

OnlyNameLeft's Avatar


OnlyNameLeft
09.21.2012 , 02:14 AM | #42
Quote: Originally Posted by cjakubow View Post
If you have wondered why there are not enough tanks queuing for HM's and raiding, you only have to look at the mechanics in this game.

I have tanked in just about every MMORPG I have played. I mostly enjoy it. I tank in this game. I find myself pulling my hair out more often than not. Just about half of everything in this game stuns the tank, or knocks me back 100 feet and snares me, or CC's me, or stuns me, knocks me back and CC"s me. It isn't fun, it isn't strategic, it's just frustrating and terrible. Even trash does this consistently. Stuns and knock backs should be used extremely sparingly. You have given NPC's so many powers that only players should have.

The issue is exacerbated because DPS tend to just jump in .01 second after me and start blasting on the thing. Meanwhile I'm two miles away because I've been knocked back into the last room and am snared and/or rooted and some idiot Marauder is getting laid on by some huge robot and complaining that I can't hold threat.

Yes I realize they should play smarter but you have to design around these kinds of issues.

Tanks have enough to deal with keeping threat on everything. We don't need to deal with getting stunned and shot around the room every pull.
Just to reiterate the prevailing response to the OP, tanking in this game is fine - no - it's at a really nice sweet spot that feels gratifying and fun while not being faceroll. Stuns, KBs, interrupts - those things should never be player-only. To remove those from mobs would be tantamount to removing a huge portion of fun from tanking, not to mention strategy.

Yes, it is strategic for mobs to have and use those powers, just as it is strategic for us to counter them. Our job is to control the battlefield. If the mobs merely stood in place and accepted the occasional Smash, Sweeping Strike, and Taunts to maintain control then the role of tank would be watered down to the point of meh. The fact that I have to know who does what, who must be interrupted, who must be pushed/pulled where, how best to shape the battlefield to the advantage of my group - that is the essence of tanking. That is what makes tanking fun, and what most players who tank enjoy.

To be sure, tanking is not a job for everyone. It is not a role I would ever force upon a guildie or random stranger because we need a role filled. It is a job that requires that you not just know what you're doing, but enjoy it - otherwise, you'll be shoving that role onto someone else and hitting up the Skill Mentor in no time.

If the frustration of the role is lessening your enjoyment of the game - respec. Not everyone enjoys every role.
∭∭∭∭∭ΞΦΞ╣██████████████████████████████████)

TheRampage's Avatar


TheRampage
09.21.2012 , 03:34 AM | #43
My problems as vanguard tank - keeping aoe aggro. If I use aoe attakcs, ill burn my ammo in 5 seconds and then I'm useless. And even if dps is attacking 1 target, rest of mobs will go for healers. I have feeling that guardians can keep mobs easyer, don't know if I'm right., don't they haver better way of gaining focus, every time they are hit?

LarryRow's Avatar


LarryRow
09.21.2012 , 08:13 AM | #44
Quote: Originally Posted by POPsi View Post
^ What he said. Our tank yesterday did the same, start with saber throw, never jumping in as a starter. He was good, didn1t really have to heal him, only a fresh 50 dps merc, healed my you know what out to keep him alive
Jumping in should be safe, because if you are tanking without Unremitting/Unstoppable you are doing it wrong.
A classic sig that should not be lost:
Quote:
Stunned , pew pew hack slash , stunned , running backward circles, stunned cannot move, pew pew, break stun, 30 second snare, wha?!?!!? stunned, knockdown, ...less stun more pew pew and hacknslash please.

Sithcreep's Avatar


Sithcreep
09.21.2012 , 09:45 AM | #45
Quote: Originally Posted by Vankris View Post
i respectfully disagree, tanking in this game does not suck. I too have tanked in many MMO, last to date was wow (and the mot popular, so the one most people can relate to). Tanking in that game was mindnumbingly easy, with 500% increase threat and powerful AOE, you blast in god mode throughtout any dungeon, topping damage and never at risk of dying.... boring!

In star wars, tanking is different. First of all, you generate more aggro than any dps but not light years ahead, so you do have to keep a good rotation to keep the aggro.
And yes, in this game, mobs fight back!! Awesome. it make tanking more engaging, more dynamic
You have tools at your disposal.

If you are stun, you can break stun with the 2minute cooldown ability that everyclass have.
If you are knowk back, you can charge or sprint in.
this is basic stuff, but always tank with your back to a wall
More often than not, knock back or stun are actually cast than can be interrupt
almost every mob (except boss and some champion) can be stun, so use it.
your taunt has 30 meter range, don't wait you are in melee range to use it.

Finally i'll finish by my guild forum signature
"DPS is science, healing is art, tanking is strategy"
Tanking IS strategy, know the pull, plan ahead

Bioware, if you are listening, awesome design in tanking. please never revert back to zombie tanking like in wow, keep us engage in combat.
I beg to differ! DPS is no science in this game. DPS is FACEROLL!!

But tanking requires a good knowledge of game mechanics, thats what makes it really interesting. Im just really disappointed about the fact that BW for some weird reason has decided to make the life of Warrior tanks as hard as possible compared to the other classes for no compensation but the honor of being pro.

Still im really enjoying tanking with my Jugger most of the time, although often looking with great envy at the other classes amazing tank stats... Sigh...

Atramar's Avatar


Atramar
09.21.2012 , 09:59 AM | #46
Quote: Originally Posted by Sithcreep View Post
I beg to differ! DPS is no science in this game. DPS is FACEROLL!!

But tanking requires a good knowledge of game mechanics, thats what makes it really interesting. Im just really disappointed about the fact that BW for some weird reason has decided to make the life of Warrior tanks as hard as possible compared to the other classes for no compensation but the honor of being pro.

Still im really enjoying tanking with my Jugger most of the time, although often looking with great envy at the other classes amazing tank stats... Sigh...
note, GOOD dps is science.
with accent on GOOD
I love spending lots of time on my ship chagning rotations jsut to get that extra 35 dps...
and i know many feel same way.
Tracer Legacy, The Red Eclipse.
Not reading colored text, it hurts my eyes. Sorry (unless it's a dev post)
L55:Sniper,Operative,Juggernaut,Assassin,Marauder, Powertech,Guardian,Commando,Scoundrel
to finish:Shadow(41),Sage(53),Merc(39). 29.07.2013

Taleek's Avatar


Taleek
09.23.2012 , 06:02 PM | #47
I, like all but one other person that has replied to this thread, disagree that tanking sucks. I think that tanking is a great deal of fun, tanking requires a lot of attention to detail, and so is not for everyone. A good tank is one that keeps cool even in a ****** situation, and plans out best what they can do to make it less ******.

Before each pull I will look at the enemies, and I will say, okay, what does each of these guys do? That guy is melee? Okay I will let him run over to me, that guy is ranged, I will need to pull him into AoE range. Which ones do I want cc on, should I use my grapple on this guy to pull him away from the group after he is cced to allow for better AoE, or should I pull the one that is ranged and hits hard into position for better AoE? A good tank has a plan beforehand, and if they are familiar with the fight they know exactly what they are going to do before the fight even starts, but at the same time need to be level headed enough to realize, okay, my plan has gone to ****, what do I need to do now? I really hope they don't dumb down tanking, because I very much enjoy it.
*insert witty retort that will become someone's signature*- Kitty Prawn
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=347245
.- Never forget.
"DPS is science, healing is art, tanking is strategy."

alifaraaz's Avatar


alifaraaz
09.23.2012 , 06:22 PM | #48
Just chiming in to say, tanking is great in this game. Trash tanking isn't that fun, but with the increase to aoe threat made a lot more manageable. The trash in the new Op is a bit more fun too. The way taunting works might want to be reworked in future as except for use of bosses dropping threat, threat becomes pretty trivial after the first 30-60seconds on a single mob or boss.

It definitely doesn't need more dumbing down. It's challenging enough to be fun and strategic but not too easy as to just be a walking meat shield who just stands there doing nothing.

As for PvP I think tanks are decent there too tbh. They're great for defending objectives, staying alive until backup arrives, and fantastic in huttball. Aswell as being very useful with guard and taunts to protect allies and reduce damage. I'm not saying they couldn't be tweaked a bit...but to say tanking sucks is a gross exaggeration.
Kazar - Powertech, [Tomb of Freedom Nadd EU]

anstalt's Avatar


anstalt
09.24.2012 , 05:11 AM | #49
Seriously, do u guys not find tanking in this game faceroll easy?

I honestly cant believe how mind-numbing easy tanking is in this game! I dread to think what WoW was like if that was even easier! I play a shadow. I prefer DPS, so I've got full BH/campaign dps gear. My tank gear isn't too bad, maybe 50% BH, 50% rakata.

Honestly, every single fight in this game is easy to tank. I don't know about other tanks, but as a shadow I have very few attacks in my rotatation: slow time, project, telekinetic throw, double strike, force breach, spinning strike, saber strike. Thats only 7 skills! That means my rotation is ridiculously simple. Despite being simple, I virtually never lose aggro. I do not use taunt to increase my aggro like some tanks, I tend to save it for emergencies and tank swopping and yet its easy to hold aggro off full campaign sentinels doing 1600+ dps.

The knockbacks etc that the OP was talking about? WHERE?!?! Everywhere that tanking matters, i.e. bosses, does not seem to have these mechanics. The only place where you get excessive knockbacks and stuns is on trash pulls and it just does not matter there! DPS can take a lot of hits from trash, we all have cooldowns. Its just not an issue.


What confuses me more is how some tanks are bad! I can understand being undergeared, but when you are same gear level as your DPS, you should NEVER lose aggro on single target fights. Boss swopping is fecking easy due to taunt being on such a low cooldown. Every tank has gap closing / mobility skills. ITS EASY!!!


So, I do actually agree that tanking in this game sucks, but not for the same reasons as the OP.
Anstalt - lvl 50 valor 81 Shadow Consular

Currently retired due to poor design decisions within the game that have killed its longevity. Get rid of Hickman before he ruins the game completely!

Ephesia's Avatar


Ephesia
09.24.2012 , 08:09 AM | #50
Quote: Originally Posted by anstalt View Post
Seriously, do u guys not find tanking in this game faceroll easy?

I play a shadow.
Stopped reading the rest, no wonder tanking is easy for you <3
Ephesia, Level 55 Jedi Guardian
Tomb of Freedon Nadd (EU)
Member of Catalyst