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Why do tanks put Guard on healers in PvE?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
Why do tanks put Guard on healers in PvE?

SoonerJBD's Avatar


SoonerJBD
07.27.2012 , 08:20 PM | #61
Quote: Originally Posted by DiLune View Post
Guard doesn't matter in an HM FP. It really, really doesn't. But if I have to choose someone who matters more to me just for the sake of using guard? It would be the healer.
This issue isn't hard to understand, and several people have explained it, so I'm not sure why you still don't get it. Guard is a skill just like any other you have. You can choose to ignore force sweep as a guardian tank or only use it on single targets, and it probably won't wipe the group in a HM flashpoint, but you are still ignoring or misusing one of your main skills. Let's take this down to as simple a level as possible.

The group's goal in a HM flashpoint is to defeat the bosses and clear the instance as efficiently as possible. If one or more people in the group are undergeared, being efficient may be the difference between wiping or not. If everyone is at the appropriate gear level or better, it may just mean clearing the instance faster. If as a tank you are guarding the healer by default you are, by definition, lowering your efficiency. It will not help you. You keep acting like you can never lose aggro as a tank, but you don't always have aggro on every target. When everyone on the team is doing their job right, DPS will take more damage than the healer. The DPS may be burning strongs while you are tanking an elite. They will take damage from one or more of those strongs, especially if they are using AOE skills. If a DPS makes a mistake and, say, breaks CC, they will pull the aggro of that mob as well, taking damage until you can taunt or switch targets. Putting guard on the highest threat DPS who is pulling the most aggro on the mobs you aren't tanking reduces the incoming damage to your team by more than if you are guarding the healer, who should take very little damage during most of the instance if your team is doing its job. Guarding the highest aggro DPS will make everyone's job easier because you will kill things faster and put less pressure on both your DPS and your healer, who will spend less resources by casting less overall heals.

TL/DR: It's simple math. DPS will take more damage than heals even in a HM flashpoint when done correctly. Guarding the melee DPS or, if no melee, the highest damage ranged DPS is most efficient use of the skill unless there are special circumstances.

Mitissa's Avatar


Mitissa
08.01.2012 , 08:56 AM | #62
My simple rule of thumb. Find best geared or highest lvl'd MELEE dps and guard them. If no Melee DPS is present then I guard the healer and add Chilling Scream into my rotation so if I DO lose threat it'll take the mob an hour just to run back to the DPS.

Damage reduction for ranged (including heals) is useless so my only perk for using this ability is for the threat reduction.

1- Are there Melee DPS present (Yes? - Guard them, No? - Proceed to 2)
2- Are there Ranged DPS that are WAY to high as far as gear or level goes? (Yes? - Guard them, No? - Proceed to 3)
3- Do you have a healer? (Yes? - Guard them, No? - Proceed to 4)
4- Are you low-balling it with a companion healer? (Yes? - Guard them, No? - Drop group and do something else)

Veeius's Avatar


Veeius
08.13.2012 , 02:33 PM | #63
learn how to play op. Guarding the healer makes sense. It may not make sense to have the healer continously guarded, but any tank who doesn't guard the healer initially is bad.

LogicalPremise's Avatar


LogicalPremise
08.14.2012 , 11:28 PM | #64
As a healer, I expect guard to be floated to who needs it. There are certainly times and instances where it makes sense, but as a rule I'm more concerned with the tank being aware of my energy levels and how fast he's pulling.

I can count on one hand the number of times me not having guard has gotten me killed. If I had a nickel for every time the overgeared DPS has ripped threat off the tank, got crushed , and then the mob came running over to me with a blood-handed "hi" I could afford to buy Hawaii.
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BlznSmri's Avatar


BlznSmri
08.15.2012 , 01:06 AM | #65
Quote: Originally Posted by Veeius View Post
learn how to play op. Guarding the healer makes sense. It may not make sense to have the healer continously guarded, but any tank who doesn't guard the healer initially is bad.
It doesn't make any sense at all to have the healer guarded in PvE because out how minuscule the threat they generate is.

Guard the Melee DPS, chances are, they're the ones that are going to be pulling threat.
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dipstik's Avatar


dipstik
08.20.2012 , 12:09 PM | #66
if dps has bad kill priority or doesnt include threat dumps in their rotation, then i will put the gaurd on the healer to spite them... until they learn how to kill in the right order, protect the healer, along with myself, and put their threat dumnp in their rotation. healers are often guilty of not using their threat dumps/cc as well.

i do not like using my gaurd to cover up bad playing. if everyone is doing well, i will put it on the melee dps taking the most damage, as threat is not a huge concern when everyone is playing properly.

DSafana's Avatar


DSafana
08.20.2012 , 12:51 PM | #67
Quote: Originally Posted by dipstik View Post
if dps has bad kill priority or doesnt include threat dumps in their rotation, then i will put the gaurd on the healer to spite them... until they learn how to kill in the right order, protect the healer, along with myself, and put their threat dumnp in their rotation. healers are often guilty of not using their threat dumps/cc as well.

i do not like using my gaurd to cover up bad playing. if everyone is doing well, i will put it on the melee dps taking the most damage, as threat is not a huge concern when everyone is playing properly.
^ this. If it's a PUG I start by guarding the healer. Once I see the DPS doing their jobs on the low level adds , then I put guard on the highest DPS. Ive been amazed at how many DPS in PUG's have bad kill priority.
I've played all 3 at end game and some groups force my healer to waste multiple threat dumps in each fight. Meaning the next trash fight, none are available.

RDeanOU's Avatar


RDeanOU
08.20.2012 , 11:15 PM | #68
Quote: Originally Posted by DSafana View Post
^ this. If it's a PUG I start by guarding the healer. Once I see the DPS doing their jobs on the low level adds , then I put guard on the highest DPS. Ive been amazed at how many DPS in PUG's have bad kill priority.
I've played all 3 at end game and some groups force my healer to waste multiple threat dumps in each fight. Meaning the next trash fight, none are available.
I don't understand this mentality at all. You are making the run more difficult for everyone by only putting guard on the people that need it when their play style meets with your approval. Why make a run that is already difficult because DPS aren't following kill orders properly even MORE difficult by wasting your guard buff on the healer?

I can understand that there might be an extreme situation where guarding a healer might be advantageous, but when you put it on the healer by default it makes you look like you know your role even less well then the DPS who can't follow a kill order.

So basically those DPS that can't properly follow a kill order can now blame you equally because you are foolishly guarding the healer and you clearly don't know how to tank properly. You are making yourself look just as bad as they are. Guard the people that need guard and not the person that needs it the least. You advertize that you are bad when you guard healers by default in pugs. Why do that?

_gideon's Avatar


_gideon
08.21.2012 , 03:11 AM | #69
You guard your healer in case an operative or assassin snuck into the FP and tries to gank them.

LadyTributary's Avatar


LadyTributary
08.31.2012 , 09:45 PM | #70
As a healer, I would like to point out that I'm never out of range of a healer.

Also, I judge tanks who put guard on me automatically. I judge them harshly. I am unlikely to take much damage and extremely unlikely to pull threat.

It's beneficial for me as a healer for a DPS to be guarded. They're taking 5% less damage, and since they're more likely to get hurt than I am. this can actually be a significant number. Furthermore, the guard will help reduce the chances of them pulling a mob off of the tank.