I Am All For Pay To Win, Are You?

I'm against Pay to Win. I am an adult working full time and don't have as much time as others do to play this game but the thought of Pay to Win just doesn't work for me. Paying my sub fee to play is one thing but being able to pay to win is just wrong in my book.

In the SW universe, do they wake up one day, spend money and suddenly become the Emperor. Do they hold auctions about who will end up being the most powerful force user in the universe...

Pay to Win just doesn't fit in with how I conceptualise the game and setting. I want to play the game and, like others, work for the benefits. I may not be the best player but I still want to play when I can and put in the effort myself because to me that is far more rewarding because you've actually earned it through playing rather than simply paid for it.

If EA/BW move away from what they are currently doing with F2P and move F2P towards a P2W model just for the sake of milking the consumer then that proves that the experience of the game will no longer be worth playing.

Disagree...

I have always been a subber and play MMO's that have added the F2P option... and that's fine.

The cashop is there for a sole purpose.. to generate profits for the compnay, its a business.
Your sub and my sub pay to give us access to content but that has proven to be insufficient to sustain the game so they need to put added value into it.
As a subber we are entilte to all current content in game and likely m ost of what will come from F2P model.. a subber should only be considering the cashshop as an extra, its something you get the oportunity to peruse and use at your desire. If you want to take the bait and pass some coin over for something then that's up to you not BW, their job is to to dangle the carrots. If they put that fluff stuff in game then what is the point of having F2P in the first place.
Its not about Free players and subbers playing different games its about making money out of the same game, you just get to choose what your entry point is. The stuff in the shop that is fluff, is fluff for both parties. The real coin killer stuff you wont have to pay for but F2P will... to a point at least... that is still something that is unknown but dont expect everything to be free but then again large expansions even in a subbed based MMO are normally chargeable (a la WoW )

Think of it as 2 cars on sale at your Porche dealership...
Car A costs $150k and has Fan/Heater, radio, driver Airbag and comes in a range of matt colours
Car B is exactly the same car and the same price but comes with metalic paint and has a CD player and an Immobiliser.... this car is only available through the Porche subscriber club.. and if subscribe they will also upgrade your car to include, Passenger Airbag, Foglights an Alarm, a full Climate Control system and free multi-point servicing for the life of the car (Note - not a full service !) as a thank you.

Each option however has an options pack... that includes CD player, Foglights, Passenger Airbag, Climate Control, Metalic Paint colors, 1 yr multi-point Service, Air freshners, baby seats, Footmats, Halogen bulb packs, Alarm, Immobiliser, Furry Seat covers, Chrome bumpers, a stylised Paint design of your choice, Ipod conncectivity, 12x 100watt speaker surround sound system, engine chipping, big boy twin exhausts.... etc etc.

Now if you decided to buy Car B then on inspection some of those things just are'nt relevant to you cos you already have them but there is a nice range of optional items and accessories to customise your car if you want
Now if you purchased Car A... guess what you can pretty much get all the same things that Car B has and all those nice extra items and accessories at a price of course.

Or just consider this.. if everyone decided to think the same way, what's the point of BW continuing on with the sub package rather than forcing us all down the F2P route instead? - ooh you might cancel anyway.. so either way if the game does not make money then simply there will be no game... simples

Yes, you cannot skip the training session and just run at the olympic games. However, just like with the olympic games, it doesn't matter whether you run on a track in NYC or on a track in London. So after you already spent 10 years running on the track of grind in 20+ MMO's over the course of the last decade, there's no need to run through the same course over and over again here.

It's needless time investment, and do you wish to lure in the long-term MMO players, it's one of the first things you should be willing to hand out on.

And yes, I would have no objection with running through ops with a player who just jumped over to this game after having been a long time hc raider in WoW for example, but didn't want to go through the initial grind here again. Chances of the people instantly buying their way into raiding or those going through the grind ending up being a complete fail aren't all that different anyway. It's a long time discussion which went on in WoW as well, entry level dungeons in Cataclysm were eventually proof enough for many players that simple campaigns in no way prepares people for true challenging content.

The same can be said here for the Lost Island HM FP. Simply try and do it on random, most people you encounter there can't distinguish heads from tails. That doesn't stop people from still forming raid teams and checking out who's a good potential candidate and who's not based on their gaming history and a test run or two to prove their worth. In that, there's little to no interest in whether you grinded long enough.

No I am not for P2W good sir.

And at this rate going by news...

...You'll be lucky If SWTOR makes it that far.

Alas...my time has run it's course on SWTOR.

So to you all farewell.

Farewell and goodnight.

lol...so many dumb people....


AAA TROLLING LADIES AND GENTZ! THIS IS HOW YOU DO IT!

yeah....either way....stop feeding it, report the tread and let it die, just look at OP's posting history....

100% sure hes trolling ..hes done nothing but profess his desire to have cyber with GW2 over the past week , you all got trolled so hard

nah i think people are more concerned that they invested a tonne of time in to their characters to watch tehm develope and grow ... and then some douchey little kid with daddys credit card gets the same gear instantly.
i know thats what annoys the hell out of me, in this play-to-win model that this game is 100% guaranteed to become.

i have no doubt that EA did not invent coporate greed, but it is my choice not to buy their goods if i deem them to be too greedy. IF EA does go pay-to-win, then they are becoming too greedy and i will quit.
They already have my sub, if they made the game better then they could expect more people to play the game.

stop copying WOW and its fail logics on games EA, start reading the forums and you will see tonnes and tonnes of good ideas that no other game has thought of.
The most powerful and inventive minds out there are the nerdy twits that play this game, myself included.
EA needs to read what they are saying and impliment these ideas ... theres armys of nerdy players out there, use em in your war on mediocrity.

oh, and give me an alt bank that all of my alts can put stuff in to and take out of .... its such a pain to gather on one alt and mail to the crafter alt. A guild bank would be fine but unfortunately i dont trust anyone in the game enough to invite them and get them to invite/promote my alts. Not everyone brings friends in to computer games or plays online with them, you know.

and bring in gear brackets for pvp at level 50.
and rename ewoks as wookie-poop.
and make more costumes.
and have more than one planet as a destination whilst leveling ... gods i hate nar shadda.
and remove macros.
and make more colours for lightsabers.
and make more different types of bullets for guns, maybe stylised/personal choice colours for your gun bullets (who doesnt want to shoot bullets with "in your face with a can of mace" or "hope you kissed your momma goodbye this morning cos you aint gonna see her again" etched on to each one .. oh come on.
and more ships, customisable and re-structurable.
and more companions, very annoying to get greeded loot for heavy armour and none of my comps can use it. Every class should have customisable companions as extends to their tree/talents ... to an extent.
filters on your crafting skills to limit, for example, based on level or gear type or "usable by" sorta thing.
the above filters on vendors too ... so much time crawling through what gear my comps can use.

these are just drawn from my brain as i prepare to go back to work from my lunch break.
etc
etc
etc

I have much in common with the OP except for the purchase of 2 CE edtions of this game. I have never had any reason to purchase such items as they are (IMHO) over priced and not worth the value.

As to the items listed (or any other item), I think that anyone that puts down the money FOR A SUBSCRIPTION should be able to get those items WITHOUT paying EXTRA. I do not pay my sub to pay for "freeloaders". I do not pay my subscription to get no content except that I have to purchase in a "store". I further will not pay for items in a store as they are overpriced and I will not pay for overpriced "pixels". It is going to be people that are like the OP that are going ruin MMO's with the willing help of overly greedy game developers.

Think you might have mis-understood my point, so I'll give you some examples from LOTRO

1) XP Boost Scroll e.g. 200% xp from monster kills for 1 hour.

This item was not available in game, only through the store. However, the result of using the item was simply quicker leveling. Gaining XP and leveling was still available in game through normal quests, so the shop was not giving you anything exclusive. You could still level fine without the shop. It was convenience, not paying to win.

2) Deed Accelerators

Again, another convenience item. Using it made your deeds go quicker for an hour, thus reducing the grind.

3) Horses / Cosmetic Outfits

These bore no relation to your performance in game so are just fluff items. Not pay 2 win.

4) Content packs, expansion packs, new classes etc.

If you wanted to level through the misty mountains, you either had to be a subscriber or you had the buy the content pack for MM.


Basically, what I'm saying is that I'm fine with anything being in the store as long as it does not give the buyer an irreconcilable advantage over a normal subscriber. So, for example if the top tier of gear was only available through the store, and not available in game any other way, that would be pay 2 win, something a subscriber could not overcome through simple playtime. If they offer convenience items, thats fine, as whilst it may be frustrating I know I can overcome the advantage just by playing normally.

now, of course, if bioware force us all down the F2P route and do away with subscriptions then I'm fine with pay 2 win. If you go down that route from the start then at least everyone is on a level playing field and knows what they are in for. I dont think its a good idea, or sustainable, but at least it would be even. However, if you're sticking with subscribers, a subscriber should get everything included with their subscription fee except expansions.

Nah-trolling is not what the intended purpose of this thread, even though P2W hater would like to think so. The purpose of this thread is to find out if there are other players like me who are partial to the availability of P2W items in SWTOR.

There are so many emotionally-charged posts against P2W items out there and I was wondering if this resistance to P2W is purely economical or are there other reasons for it. Judging from the posts, the main factor for the anti-P2W sentiment is economical. Although some posters state that they oppose to players buying what can be earned in-game, the reasons behind this is also economical. Frankly, I think one will buy a P2W article if they can afford it. For example: would you buy a full set of War Hero gear for $1? Most of you will probably say "Take my money"! However, would the same people who would buy it for $1 buy the same item if it was priced at $300? Probably not.

So I think there is a divide in the SWTOR community between the haves and the have-nots. These two groups are not age-dependent as I know that there are some well-off students who play SWTOR on a high-spec PC with multiple 32-inch screens. There are players like me who would pay a reasonable amount of money to buy convenience in the game. This convenience increases our enjoyment of the game and probably make us play more or continue to remain subbed for a longer time. There are also other players who deplore the business idea that players can pay for such items and claim to quit as soon as these items are available. These players probably can't afford to buy such an item at the intended price. These are all economic reasons.

I am sure that there are players who are strongly against P2W because its against their principles. I respect that, but I am of the opinion that the roots of these principles are purely economic. Why should it bother one if the other player can spend their own money to buy better gear? If one can't afford to buy better gear then one can obtain it by other means, like grinding for it. The end result is the same: time is traded for money. If one is able to afford better gear, but does not want to buy it due to "principles", then be happy and grind for the gear. That way everyone is happy in the game.

Now, I know people may have different views than mine, and I respect your views. If I have offended anyone, it is not my intention. I merely want to find out if anyone shares my views on P2W, and I openly welcome differing views, as long as they are expressed in a mature and civil manner ,,, and in accordance to the EULA of SWTOR.

May there be peace in the Galaxy.

From a guy that unsubbed I take this with a grain of salt


"I have unsubbed. Reasons: 1. Guild Wars 2 -...

I have unsubbed. Reasons:

1. Guild Wars 2 - I had fun in the beta test weekends and stress tests. Hey-there will be a stress test in a few hours' time! Wooohoo!
2. Boredom - lack of end game..."

I call TROLL

And No to the P2W