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Could Free to Play Turn into Pay To Win?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Could Free to Play Turn into Pay To Win?
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ImmortalAlien's Avatar


ImmortalAlien
08.20.2012 , 03:01 PM | #31
Sub 50 PVP is actually more skill based than gear and class based compared to 50 PVP. Levels and gear are relatively balanced due to the fact that while low level players don't have the talents than near 50 players do, these low level players have ridiculously high damage reduction.

Check out a low player's stats during a sub 50 match and you'll see it.

You'll also notice that classes that should be "terribad" or "OP" are actually the opposite depending on player skill and experience.

Goretzu's Avatar


Goretzu
08.20.2012 , 03:03 PM | #32
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
As we discussed back and forth yesterday in the other thread (for which this one is kind of redunant)....... blue gear at sub-level is in no way likely to make you more powerful then your counterparts in PvP (open world or otherwise). Because in point of fact, green gear is vendor for credits, and blue is barely wearable in the context of all the higher quality gear available to anyone but a player who brand new started the game.

Besides, PvPers are notorious min/maxers, who will twink their sub-cap characters with flashpoint and crafted gear with high end mods, even if they are brand new to the game. It's a habit they carry with them from game to game. So really, why would a PvPer purchase non-BiS non-BiL gear? They wouldn't. A new person to the game is much more likely to purchase credits for RLC and shop the GTN, rather than purchase coins and buy blue gear from the coin shop.


A person levelling on a PvP server knows that level is god, and anything that you can buy that gets you to that level quicker and easier is P2W.

As I said you can pretend that it not being the ultimate P2W somehow makes it "better", but it doesn't. P2W is P2W is P2W, it's as simple as that.
Real Star Wars space combat please, not Star Wars Fox! Maybe some PvP and flight too?
Goretzu's Law: As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving "Entitled" approaches 1

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
08.20.2012 , 03:07 PM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
Oh come on lol, that's a horrible simile. One has NEVER EVER happened during the lifetime of our galaxy (our sun going nova), one happens daily (company gets greedy).

In fact, you can see it happening already as they've already recanted their statement that Makeb would be free. Now, it's suddenly become 'so large' that they may sell it. That's GREED!!! PURE and simple GREED! Milking their only loyal customers...from the start even...pathetic!
I agree with you about the simile, but I used it to make a point about hyperbole.

The rest, I disagree with you.

If they took Makeb, which they orignally pitched as new content later this year via patch, and decided to expand it and make it expansion level size and scale (by the classic MMO definition of paid expansion scale), then not only are they within their rights to convert it to a point of sale expansion, it's actually a smart decision on their part.

Honestly, IMO, people get waaaaaayyy too fixated on every pre-announcement comment from Bioware. And as far as Makeb is concerned, all we have to date is pre-announcment commentary on things they are thinking about. Everyone who has played MMOs knows MMO pre-announcement talk is talk, NOT commitment. And we wonder why they struggle with communicating with the community.
When you find yourself surrounded by hostile Clowns... always go for the "Juggler" first.

Goretzu's Avatar


Goretzu
08.20.2012 , 03:08 PM | #34
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post

If they took Makeb, which they orignally pitched as new content later this year via patch, and decided to expand it and make it expansion level size and scale (by the classic MMO definition of paid expansion scale), then not only are they within their rights to convert it to a point of sale expansion, it's actually a smart decision on their part.

They've said nothing about expanding it, only about changing it from a free content update to a paid for adventure pack.
Real Star Wars space combat please, not Star Wars Fox! Maybe some PvP and flight too?
Goretzu's Law: As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving "Entitled" approaches 1

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
08.20.2012 , 03:11 PM | #35
Quote: Originally Posted by Goretzu View Post
They've said nothing about expanding it, only about changing it from a free content update to a paid for adventure pack.
Actually, Jeff Hickman specifically commented (without revealing a lot of specifics) about it being "very big" in terms of content, which is new pre-annoucement info. And the implication was it's big and getting bigger, which would be reasonable grounds for at least talking internally about if it's paid expansion or not.

Once again though... this is all pre-announcemnt commentary from Jeff. There is no announced plans about Makeb in terms of release date, content level, cost/no-cost from Bioware yet. All of that is specualtion on these forums based on informal comments made by Jeff.

And you know my position on specualation.
When you find yourself surrounded by hostile Clowns... always go for the "Juggler" first.

Goretzu's Avatar


Goretzu
08.20.2012 , 03:13 PM | #36
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
Actually, Jeff Hickman specifically commented (without revealing a lot of specifics) about it being "very big" in terms of content, which is new pre-annoucement info. And the implication was it's big and getting bigger, which would be reasonable grounds for at least talking internally about if it's paid expansion or not.
It was always supposed to be "big" though.

Fair enough if it's 1/2 the vanilla games floor space though, but there's an awful lot of "big" before it gets to be that "big" (i.e. Hoth is "big", but it's not an "expansion").
Real Star Wars space combat please, not Star Wars Fox! Maybe some PvP and flight too?
Goretzu's Law: As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving "Entitled" approaches 1

TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
08.20.2012 , 03:17 PM | #37
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
I agree with you about the simile, but I used it to make a point about hyperbole.

The rest, I disagree with you.

If they took Makeb, which they orignally pitched as new content later this year via patch, and decided to expand it and make it expansion level size and scale (by the classic MMO definition of paid expansion scale), then not only are they within their rights to convert it to a point of sale expansion, it's actually a smart decision on their part.

Honestly, IMO, people get waaaaaayyy too fixated on every pre-announcement comment from Bioware. And as far as Makeb is concerned, all we have to date is pre-announcment commentary on things they are thinking about. Everyone who has played MMOs knows MMO pre-announcement talk is talk, NOT commitment. And we wonder why they struggle with communicating with the community.
We're "fixated" on it Andryah because we're content starved at 50. <--- THAT is this games biggest problem. Makeb has been the only thing to look forward to this entire freaking year for me...

Telling those of us who have trusted them by continuing to fund the development that we suddenly have to pay what was announced as 'included' 2 months ago, is bad business. It's the sign of a desperate company and one that will do anything for a buck. This would be a horrible precedent for them to set.
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ZudetGambeous's Avatar


ZudetGambeous
08.20.2012 , 07:36 PM | #38
It's too late, they have already said they are going P2W.

They are letting you buy blue level gear up to level 49. World leveling PvP (if it ever happens) and 10-49 PvP bracket are now P2W.

I give it another month before they talk about how you can use the cash shop to "save time" by buying black hole gear (technically not top end since you can get Campaign gear) or BM gear.

Then soon after that it will be campaign and WH gear.
I tell you this: though neither he nor they yet know it, he is the greatest of all the Jedi. Jacen Solo is the living Jedi dream. Even without the Force, he is more dangerous than you can possibly imagine."

bahdasz's Avatar


bahdasz
08.20.2012 , 07:41 PM | #39
In two months half of you will be back on here crying about 'how come you can get all kinds of RP cosmetic stuff on the store but you can't get good combat gear?'

Mark my words.

jedip_enguin's Avatar


jedip_enguin
08.20.2012 , 07:43 PM | #40
Yes it could, now can we stop with the posts about it.
Click my link please, I'm almost out of Cartel coins - http://www.swtor.com/r/Sh6HPh
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