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PvP Analysis

Squeejero's Avatar

12.16.2011 , 07:19 PM | #1
Let's discuss the state of ToR PvP.

I understand this may be redundant, but searching the ToR forums seems to be messed up for me.

If I had to phrase it shortly, I'd say ToR PvP lacks depth.

(Begin harsh opinion for humor)
It's chaotic, brutal, and boring. It's reminiscent of playing Tekken except both players are babies playing Eddie Gordo with hammers.
(End harsh opinion for humor)

A list of things I find wrong with it:

The controls are iffy and clunky.
I put my move forward on my middle mouse button (a la wow) so I can actually hit one of 5098324 abilities I have and it sticks when I depress (The game does not my mouse). So then, I'm flying off in a random direction facing the sky because I tried to depress and adjust my mouse. Needless to say I'm slain.

Warzones need respawn times.
Particularly Alderaan. ToR PvP takes forever to kill someone unless it's a huge team battle but then those take forever too. If you're fighting for control of the middle turret it's brutal because before you can kill all the enemy, the ones you killed first are already back into the fray. Another thing that could fix this is increase the physical distance. I'd honestly suggest both.

The abilities need to be reworked for PvP
There needs to be a risk/reward for ranged characters. Make it so they can do a lot of damage standing still or less damage kiting. Also melee need a method of combating the kiting. Melee could use lower CDs on charge, pulls, better slows, etc. (Not necessarily all of those.) If melee can't reach the ranged characters, ranged wins 100% of the time. This will help build depth.

The UI needs to be optimized for PvP
With the wonderfully small, omnipresent, target locator in the bottom right. It needs to be top-down, larger, and appear when you get a target/disappear when the target dies. It's hard to track life/targets while you're whirling and spinning and jumping.

Make a more obvious distinction between the classes
I don't have to know what they are right off the bat, but it would be nice to be able to tell that they're different.

TL;DR Add depth to PvP, make controls and UI better

Stinger I feel that, for a lot of us, the PvP has taken a backseat to PvE. I love the PvE aspects of the game. I love the class stories and the side missions are a more bearable compared to WoW. For many of us, raiding won't capture our attention the way end game PvP will and if it's not up to scratch, we'll search for our PvP experience elsewhere. I apologize for comparing, but after my first time doing a Battlegrounds in WoW I was hooked. It was clean, interesting, and dynamic. There were overarching strategies and (With comparable gear) skill could overcome others. WoW lost a lot of interest for me though. There was so much repetitive grinding from skills to dungeons to quests that PvP could not sustain me paying for it and I hoped ToR would improve where it had faltered. I love Star Wars lore. I love lightsabers. I love the wonderful class stories, but thus far, the PvP has let me down.

Anyways, discuss what you feel is wrong with ToR PvP and/or ways to improve it. If you feel I'm wrong about anything, discuss that as well (Constructively and politely please.)

Also if you feel I hit it right, but not quite right, feel free to expound and explain. We want Bioware to see our ideas and be able to work with them to make the game better.

I like ToR thus far and I want it to be the best game it can be.

Bioteks's Avatar

12.19.2011 , 01:47 PM | #2
I haven't had a problem with controls yet and this just be a case where you'll have to adapt.
I agree that respawn timers should be added. They obviously thought there was a problem in voidstar with rapid respawns, hence the annoying barrier blocking defense from leaving the spawn area (which is incredibly long and annoying by the way).

I feel they've fallen into the same traps as other MMOs. For example, Rift and TOR both had the advantage of access to Mythic's experience (via EA in TOR's case) and failed to capitalize on the opportunity. Rift copied most of the bad parts from WAR, and TOR seems to have copied some bad from PvE games in general.

Crowd Control - everyone's favorite thing to love and hate. Not only has TOR included excessive cc but they also failed to control it properly for pvp, in my opinion. WAR had immunities that occurred immediately after the current cc ended. It didn't build up a resistance bar, leaving you subject to a cc chain, but granted full immunity for about 30 seconds. The immunity was broken into two categories of cc, each on it's own timer. This system has worked better than any other I've experienced. But TOR gives every player a cc break skill right? That should have been a clear sign that it was out of control to begin with - and CC breaks are irrelevant in group content without immunities.

As is generally the case with PvE MMOs, the class balance is terrible at low levels. Maybe it's all better at 40-50, but people have to enjoy themselves enough to get that far. Again, WAR had very good class balance from 1 to 40, not perfect but awfully good. On that note, low level tanks aren't even remotely as good as in WAR.

The bolster mechanic is ineffective. Bolstering worked quite well in Warhammer but WAR also used level separated brackets to control the balance. TOR throws all levels into the same Warzones and gives low level players a weak bolster. In less than a month there will be level 50s in excellent gear, what chance will anyone really have after that? The current bolster can't even account for the level difference portion.

The queue system is incredibly poor. Forcing players to queue for every warzone, whether they enjoy it or not, is a bad decision. That's equivalent to forcing players into random flashpoints or operations instead of the ones they want or like. Others have said that forced join-all will lead to better queue times. I say if people are trying to avoid certain warzones they're obviously in need of redesign or re-balance. And is it really any better to have fewer people in queue for all warzones, or many more in queue for select and/or all warzones?

TOR's group queue was an interesting attempt at keeping preforms from trashing PUG warzones, but still failed miserably in that goal. The only system that works is a separate queue. Others games have the nerve to add separate queues for "rated" warzones while insisting that splitting queues otherwise would segregate the queue population too much. And if I read correctly (been a long time, correct me if I'm wrong) they've already talked about adding "rated" warzones to TOR at a later time.

I could keep going but this is getting long enough...
I will continue to give PvP in TOR a chance as I level up and otherwise progress - based on my impression up to 25, I'm not optimistic.

(I won't accept level based arguments contesting my complaints about game mechanics. If players can participate in PvP from level 10 to 50 then PvP should be as functional, balanced, and fun as is humanly possible for that entire level range.)

Any other opinions/additions?

_Foy's Avatar

12.19.2011 , 01:55 PM | #3
I haven't had a chance to really look at PvP critically yet but so far I *can* say that looking at my tiny buff bar in the middle of a heated fight to check tha status of my HoT can be frustrating. Especially at high resolutions those icons are TINY, I can barely discern one icon from another, let alone it's remaining duration. D:
Foy -- Imperial Operative -- Shii-Cho
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