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Gear: Pvp Vs Pve


Corsairr's Avatar


Corsairr
08.02.2012 , 01:37 PM | #1
Ok first i would just like to say i am very tired of hearing the same old same old, Pvp gear is fine in pve, but pve is not ok in pvp. ok i get it, expertise is king in pvp. but at the same time im geting tired of the same people then bringing pvp gear to a ops. they should make it so that pvp gear is only good in pvp. otherwise why shouldn't pve be ok for pvp? sure its a quick easy set to get. but its not the point. the gear is made for one thing or the other, it shouldnt then be accepctable to work in the other, unless its both capable. ./end rant. and fyi i am not pvping in pve gear nor pveing in pvp gear. just wish the devs would fix it.

Codek's Avatar


Codek
08.02.2012 , 02:35 PM | #2
PvP gear in PvE is just as good as PvE gear in PvP.... and by that I mean they both are much weaker then the appropriate equivalent.

You should immediately assume that anyone who is doing this is basically the weak link in the group comp (unless another member is clearly under geared to the content itself).
~Codek

Satedbuffalo's Avatar


Satedbuffalo
08.02.2012 , 02:47 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by Codek View Post
PvP gear in PvE is just as good as PvE gear in PvP.... and by that I mean they both are much weaker then the appropriate equivalent.

You should immediately assume that anyone who is doing this is basically the weak link in the group comp (unless another member is clearly under geared to the content itself).
I'd rather someone brought Battlemaster than lvl49s. In many cases, a Battlemaster piece is significantly better than the equivalent Columni. I've often hit 50 with 3.5k ranked WZ comms, and 2k normal comms, and moved into nearly full Battlemaster. Storymode operations are definitely do-able in that condition.

Also, many, many theorycrafters argue that BIS relic for almost every class is the Warhero Relic of Boundless Ages (situationally slightly less attractive than matrix cube). As far as I know, there is nothing better.

The reason PvE gear is such a huge disadvantage in PvP is expertise: there's no equivalent for PvE. Yes, your stats are slightly lower than equivalent tier PvE equipment (often most pronounced in terms of HP), but you're not doing a solid 30% less damage or taking a solid 30% more damage.

In my experience, severely undergeared players who know what they're doing can perform very well in PvE content. Even a very good PvPer with zero expertise is going to have an extremely hard time in Wzs.

basketballbum's Avatar


basketballbum
08.02.2012 , 02:59 PM | #4
They could make it where expertise would count against you in pve situations, for example where it gives 20% damage increase in pvp, in pve that could be a 20% damage decrease. That would force people to have a pvp set for pvp and a separate pve set for pve. This would force people that want to do both to go through double the grind (grinding for war hero and separately grinding for campaign) which would suck for some people, it just all depends on what bioware wants and what they figure the pvp gear should be equivalent to in pve. If they do this though I wish they would make two tabs for gear on your character sheet. One where you slot your pvp gear and one where you slot your pve gear.
Your ability to speak does not make you intelligent

Codek's Avatar


Codek
08.02.2012 , 03:09 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Satedbuffalo View Post
I'd rather someone brought Battlemaster than lvl49s. In many cases, a Battlemaster piece is significantly better than the equivalent Columni. I've often hit 50 with 3.5k ranked WZ comms, and 2k normal comms, and moved into nearly full Battlemaster. Storymode operations are definitely do-able in that condition.

Also, many, many theorycrafters argue that BIS relic for almost every class is the Warhero Relic of Boundless Ages (situationally slightly less attractive than matrix cube). As far as I know, there is nothing better.

The reason PvE gear is such a huge disadvantage in PvP is expertise: there's no equivalent for PvE. Yes, your stats are slightly lower than equivalent tier PvE equipment (often most pronounced in terms of HP), but you're not doing a solid 30% less damage or taking a solid 30% more damage.

In my experience, severely undergeared players who know what they're doing can perform very well in PvE content. Even a very good PvPer with zero expertise is going to have an extremely hard time in Wzs.
The majority of your statements fit into the category where PvP gear > under geared players. But that right there is already a problem since the player you are comparing to is under geared for the content. It's the worst player to compare to. It's like comparing a full rakata set to recruit gear, you just don't do it.

My point is that the bonus (or lack there of) of using the wrong gear is pretty equivalent. You can use high end PvP gear to clear basic PvE content just as you can compete in normal PvP matches with high end PvE gear (You only get destroyed by people in full BM/WR gear as expected). Both sets would fail miserably once taken to the higher end levels (Ranked matches/ EC).

Also, the relics are the exclusion since the abilities don't involve expertise. (If you could use the PvE relics in PvP, wouldn't you?)
~Codek

Khevar's Avatar


Khevar
08.02.2012 , 03:51 PM | #6
For a dps player, Battlemaster is close enough to Columi as long as you get 2 "boundless ages" relics (they add +206 power). The only thing you're missing out on is health.

I did an AskMrRobot workup:

Full Columi Eliminator set:
983 damage
27% crit
64% surge
18k health

Full Battlemaster Eliminator set:
1009 damage
27% crit
72% surge
15k health

I'd bring a Battlemaster-geared dps to an op as long as they were on voice chat and knew what they were doing.

I wouldn't however, bring a Battlemaster-geared tank, that's a different story.

grallmate's Avatar


grallmate
08.02.2012 , 04:34 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by JeffKretz View Post
For a dps player, Battlemaster is close enough to Columi as long as you get 2 "boundless ages" relics (they add +206 power). The only thing you're missing out on is health.

I did an AskMrRobot workup:

Full Columi Eliminator set:
983 damage
27% crit
64% surge
18k health

Full Battlemaster Eliminator set:
1009 damage
27% crit
72% surge
15k health

I'd bring a Battlemaster-geared dps to an op as long as they were on voice chat and knew what they were doing.

I wouldn't however, bring a Battlemaster-geared tank, that's a different story.
Just want to check if you're using PvP relics for BOTH gear sets or just the Battlemaster one as that will skew your stats.

AshlaBoga's Avatar


AshlaBoga
08.02.2012 , 04:41 PM | #8
Really because the current PvE content is so easy you don't need that much gear for any of the Ops.

HM EC requires Full itemized Rakata - stock Rakata is terrible.

Nothing in the game right now requires Black Hole/Campaign gear.

You can do Story EV/KP in Recruit and HM EV/KP in Battlemaster.

You could try Nightmare EV/KP in Battlemaster but I suspect that you would have one heck of a tough time.

You can do HM LI in a Recruit Battlemaster mix so FPs are EZ.

HM EC would require itemized War Hero with 14/14 Augments. It would be doable, but tough (you might need datacron bonus).
I guess you could do it as a self-imposed challenge, but that's what 8 manning 16 man Ops is for
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Khevar's Avatar


Khevar
08.02.2012 , 05:33 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by grallmate View Post
Just want to check if you're using PvP relics for BOTH gear sets or just the Battlemaster one as that will skew your stats.
No, the PvE stuff was with these Columi level relics:
http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/gear/169...boundless-ages
http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/gear/303...ital-rupturing

grallmate's Avatar


grallmate
08.02.2012 , 05:55 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by JeffKretz View Post
Given that a proc relic and an on use relic don't give static bonuses you should be either ignoring the relics or using the same ones in both item sets. Anyway, relics aren't really part of the item set and can be swaped out depending on playstyle/encounter requirements,