DPS, a discussion that has been avoided

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DPS, a discussion that has been avoided

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Kagek

07.24.2012 , 11:39 AM \| #21	Quote
Quote: Originally Posted by Hizoka there is a difference in asking for help and demanding someone tell them how to play. Talking about which skill should be higher in a rotation is asking for help, demending someone tell them what their rotation should be is different. The forums were never build for the purpose of good players telling bad ones how to play. You will NEVER be a good player if you are incapable to thinking on your own, what most of these players are demanding is for someone to tell them how to play. If you need someone to tell you how to play and how to gear you will NEVER be a good player. I couldn't disagree more. Your explanation for people being 20-25% worse at dps is that they didn't reinvent the wheel as well as others? And the forums weren't made for people to help each other? *** are you on? I want to see how the world would work in real life if everyone had to reinvent everything and never ask for help. And pretending to know what the forums were made for it hypocrisy itself. There's not a whole of stuff you can actually do wrong with a Veng rotation, this tells me that the numbers mentioned in this thread are either made up, misunderstood or perhaps slight gear differences make a larger dps difference then we think. Yesterday I grabbed on of those "change to do extra damage every 4 seconds" relics to see how they compare to flat stat PvP relic and did a couple minute parse on a dummy. I was shocked to see my dps on dummy go down from 1.5k to 1.38k. The dps proc was apparently barely doing anything and the loss of like 130 power from the previous relic made at least 120 dps difference.

Hizoka

07.24.2012 , 01:34 PM \| #22	Quote
Quote: Originally Posted by Kagek I couldn't disagree more. Your explanation for people being 20-25% worse at dps is that they didn't reinvent the wheel as well as others? And the forums weren't made for people to help each other? *** are you on? I want to see how the world would work in real life if everyone had to reinvent everything and never ask for help. And pretending to know what the forums were made for it hypocrisy itself. There's not a whole of stuff you can actually do wrong with a Veng rotation, this tells me that the numbers mentioned in this thread are either made up, misunderstood or perhaps slight gear differences make a larger dps difference then we think. Yesterday I grabbed on of those "change to do extra damage every 4 seconds" relics to see how they compare to flat stat PvP relic and did a couple minute parse on a dummy. I was shocked to see my dps on dummy go down from 1.5k to 1.38k. The dps proc was apparently barely doing anything and the loss of like 130 power from the previous relic made at least 120 dps difference. what did you do a 30 second parse? The top end proc relics add between 2.5 to 4% more damage just by equiping them. The power relics are good but not as good over a longer period of time. The problem is people do not even do the tests right if you do not do a parse of at least 6 minutes then you are not doing anything worth while, and you never end right after you pop procs. The people trying to post their parased are trying to slant the parses their way by doing burst parses and what not instead of being legit with them. Like i said if you are unable to think on your own then you can NEVER be a good player. Not to mention i never said the forums were not for people to help one another, i said they were not for the good players to tell the bad ones what to do. There is a difference and if you fail to see that then that is nothing but an epic fail on your part.

Kagek

07.24.2012 , 02:51 PM \| #23	Quote
I did it for about 4-5 minutes per parse. I watch the dps live, it wasn't changing much after that long, not sure why you're putting the magic number at 6 minutes.

Elyssandra

07.24.2012 , 03:27 PM \| #24	Quote
Quote: Originally Posted by Hizoka The problem with 99.999999999999999999% of gamers... I hate to say it but it is a 100% L2P issue... you expect people to just tell you how to play... No-one ever becomes good by simply copying what someone else does... The forums were never build for the purpose of good players telling bad ones how to play... what did you do a 30 second parse? ... you can NEVER be a good player.... epic fail on your part.... Hizoka - all I see is you derailing a thread discussing Jugg DPS with your arrogance. Congratulations!!! You add a sum total of ZERO information on Jugg DPS across multiple posts - no information, no facts, no figures or stats - NOTHING. And all the while you are busy berating everyone else. Now be a good boy and go preen elsewhere. Let people who know how to play Jugg and want to contribute to the community to contribute to this thread. By the way, every top ranked guild shares information among its members. Whether better builds, ideas, tips and tricks, class information, etc. The community grows and becomes better as a result of it. To quote Newton "If I saw further than other men, it was because I stood on the shoulders of giants." Now it's completely your right to decide that you don't want to contribute to such efforts but don't derail this thread with abuse if that's your choice.

JamieM

07.24.2012 , 05:22 PM \| #25	Quote
Quote: Originally Posted by Hizoka there is a difference in asking for help and demanding someone tell them how to play. Talking about which skill should be higher in a rotation is asking for help, demending someone tell them what their rotation should be is different. The forums were never build for the purpose of good players telling bad ones how to play. . What are you on about? No one is demanding anything here - it's simply one person asking others for their thoughts on the state of Jugg DPS and then asking for tips on how to get the most from his class, which is surely one of the reasons this particular forum (Juggernaut) was built for. You've just taken an interesting thread and completely misinterpreted it - and contributed absolutely zero benefit as a consequence. I'm almost impressed.

Hizoka

07.24.2012 , 05:39 PM \| #26	Quote
Quote: Originally Posted by Kagek I did it for about 4-5 minutes per parse. I watch the dps live, it wasn't changing much after that long, not sure why you're putting the magic number at 6 minutes. 6 minutes is the enrage timer for hard mode bosses. Again something that everyone who does PvE should know and another thing you seem to of missed completely...

ImmortalAlien

07.24.2012 , 05:44 PM \| #27	Quote
Quote: Originally Posted by POSOINU I fee like no one talks about it, but everyone knows about it. Maybe its because you have to go out of your way to obtain the numbers. I know the numbers will never line up 100%. My biggest complaint is: Jugg DPS is to low I have yet to see a Jugg pull over 1400 dps on any fight in denova (except kephess). I thought maybe all the jugg's i played with had just not been that good so I leveled one, gave it full campaign. my complaint stand. I'm sure there are other dps issues as I still haven't seen quality players play each respective class. what are your thoughts about the state of dps? Jugg DPS is perfectly viable. Vengeance is best for PVE boss fights and can beat any DPS requirements for Operations, while Rage is the only other spec that can get close to what good Pyro Powertechs can do in DPS.

Fossman

07.24.2012 , 05:49 PM \| #28	Quote
Wasnt there a thread a while back on the same topic where a jug posted parses in the 1400-1600 range?

Alec_Fortescue

07.24.2012 , 08:59 PM \| #29	Quote
Hi http://postimage.org/image/4f6ziv73r/ http://www.torparse.com/a/740 We're able to do well, just get the stats right and try harder... Harder than other classes :'( Playing it right is pain sometimes. Regarding the dummy - I am not getting additional rage from hits and aoe and Pooled Hatred is not working either. Also Vicious Throw is not usable which in boss fight becomes granted 4000+ hit once the enemy is below 30%

KingFink

07.25.2012 , 01:32 AM \| #30	Quote
Quote: Originally Posted by Hizoka 6 minutes is the enrage timer for hard mode bosses. Again something that everyone who does PvE should know and another thing you seem to of missed completely... I don't know where you get you information, but parsing for six minutes on an unmoving target does NOT show you how much damage you will do on a boss fight with an enrage timer of 6 minutes. Boss fights usually have much more going on than "tank and spank" which is what six minutes on a dummy simulates. I would say three minutes or more is plenty of time to figure out how constant your DPS is. Parsing for a full six minutes is just extraneous, and quite frankly unnecessary. If I parse 1500+ for 3 minutes, I'm just going to be wasting 3 minutes continuing to parse the same numbers, since all I have to do is stand there and run rotation. However, for amusements sake once I am done tanking for my guild this week(Don't ask, they make me tank sometimes) I'll upload a 3 Minute and 6 Minute parse, and prove it to you.
Quote: Originally Posted by GeorgZoeller Disclaimer: The first rule of partial class balance discussion is that you do not discuss partial class balance.

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