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End Game Woes & the LFG Tool without an iLvL ?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
End Game Woes & the LFG Tool without an iLvL ?

Marak's Avatar


Marak
07.07.2012 , 06:48 PM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by monkgryphon View Post
Couldn't the average be unbalanced though? One person could easily have the top end score, to offset the average enough from 3 lower ends, and still create a group not so great for what you want to tackle. I'm not really going to argue that 4 ungeared people should be able to do certain things, it's just that Gearscoring wont really help, and it is not foolproof. Communication goes a long way, and the current LFG system is still not quite good enough.

The OP wants to play with his small guild for OPs, but doesn't want to wait for them to get the gear like him... that just seems selfish.
Maybe that's the compromise. Make a group gearscore. I personally have no problem carrying people if it's doable and I'm on one of my geared characters. But if I'm on a fresh 50 and everyone else is a fresh 50.. I have no expectation that the group should succeed.
Cag - Juggernaut | V'ae - Sorcerer | V'ay - Mercenary
<The Jyse Legacy (50)> | Jedi Covenant
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Skidrowbro's Avatar


Skidrowbro
07.07.2012 , 06:53 PM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Marak View Post
But if I'm on a fresh 50 and everyone else is a fresh 50.. I have no expectation that the group should succeed.
You mean how everyone was at one point. Wipe after wipe until they got the gear needed to succeed and now people want to blacklist them? Look, if you want a flawless run to get your precious comms, don't use the tool.

Marak's Avatar


Marak
07.07.2012 , 06:55 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by Skidrowbro View Post
You mean how everyone was at one point. Wipe after wipe until they got the gear needed to succeed and now people want to blacklist them?
No one is blacklisting anyone. We're not talking about normal HMs here. We're talking about Tier 2 HMs. One should be expected to have obtained Tier 1 gear before going into Tier 2. It's the only reasonable expectation.
Cag - Juggernaut | V'ae - Sorcerer | V'ay - Mercenary
<The Jyse Legacy (50)> | Jedi Covenant
Aenik - Assassin | Vhay - Operative | K'rie - Sniper | Vhae - Marauder

Skidrowbro's Avatar


Skidrowbro
07.07.2012 , 06:57 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by Marak View Post
No one is blacklisting anyone. We're not talking about normal HMs here. We're talking about Tier 2 HMs. One should be expected to have obtained Tier 1 gear before going into Tier 2. It's the only reasonable expectation.
Yes I do agree with you on that, and my mistake. A fresh 50 should not be able to queue for a T2 but the onus is on Bioware for rushing their LFG tool before the exodus happened

Tsillah's Avatar


Tsillah
07.07.2012 , 07:15 PM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by Skidrowbro View Post
Yes, we need something to exclude others from enjoying the game with us and not helping them out. Please make it happen Bioware
Except that when these others are enjoying themselves, we are not. So why do you feel that the people who actually do their best to gear up should be punished so that others can have fun?


And a little sidenote: Do people realise that it's probably easier to get BH stuff now than Rakata.

We end up with hundres of useless tionese crystals/commendations, I have a couple hundred columi commendations and I have 4 BH items, but other than my crafted ones and the earpiece, I only ever had one Rakata drop on my main. I now have a mix of Columi, Rakata and BH and all because I haven't been able to do much HM Ops yet. I upgraded my off hand from tionese to BH because that was the easiest. Sense it makes none.

Gear progression should make more sense on various levels and the LFG tool needs more options and a better reward system.

I don't see how a 20-minute BT HM gets the same reward as 2.5 hours of mucking about with people in SM EV because the all of the DPS were undergeared...exaggeration? Nope, I had that experience tonight thank you very much.
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Delorae's Avatar


Delorae
07.07.2012 , 07:31 PM | #26
Doesn't tionese / energized gear drop from normal modes now?
No one is being excluded from anything... People are being lazy and relying on people to carry them.
I would NEVER do that to 3 other people. Why would you even want to be the reason for a wipe?
Run normal modes, put a minimum stat requirement for T1/T2 HM.
This is the only Dungeon finder I've seen that doesn't have a gear requirement...
What the heck were they thinking?

Pubsam's Avatar


Pubsam
07.07.2012 , 10:47 PM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by maelstromicus View Post
I fail to see why those of us in small guilds should be forced to abandon our merry bands and join the few larger guilds that raid simply to do end game content. We don't want to be a part of a bunch of people who we may not have anything in common with simply to do that. It's not equal the way that things are set up at the moment, and yet we all pay the same amount monthly. Surely with the decline in subscription levels, you guys want to keep the loyal players that you do have?
You aren't forced to do anything to experience end game! Pugging HM OPs is very doable. Sure it's not as easy as being in a guild. It's not as easy as the mythical LFG tool you want that will magically place you in a competent group of well-geared people. Perhaps this tool on top of having a gearcheck will have you solve a logic problem, and then have you maneuver an obstacle course, so you can enter the Op confident they have some baseline intelligence.

Point is, sure, they could add HM OPs to the LFG and institute a gearcheck. But you don't need to be good at anything to have highly rated gear. You get 5 BH comms everyday. HM FPs are very easy and drop Columi. You'll see people wearing DPS tier to heal or tank. So even with the LFG you're still gonna have to interact with the other raiders, evaluate their performance and if they are actually ready to be there, and at that point it's not much less effort than pugging from general chat. An impersonal LFG tool works for SM OPs and FPs because they're so easy. When content gets harder you need to engage your fellow players.

Also, if you want a guaranteed no cutscenes run... DON'T PUG! You surely have at least 4 people in your selective snob guild who feel the same way... or at least know others who feel the same way. Why don't you all agree to do your daily together!
Time for a nap.

Skidrowbro's Avatar


Skidrowbro
07.07.2012 , 11:12 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Tsillah View Post
Except that when these others are enjoying themselves, we are not. So why do you feel that the people who actually do their best to gear up should be punished so that others can have fun?


And a little sidenote: Do people realise that it's probably easier to get BH stuff now than Rakata.

We end up with hundres of useless tionese crystals/commendations, I have a couple hundred columi commendations and I have 4 BH items, but other than my crafted ones and the earpiece, I only ever had one Rakata drop on my main. I now have a mix of Columi, Rakata and BH and all because I haven't been able to do much HM Ops yet. I upgraded my off hand from tionese to BH because that was the easiest. Sense it makes none.

Gear progression should make more sense on various levels and the LFG tool needs more options and a better reward system.

I don't see how a 20-minute BT HM gets the same reward as 2.5 hours of mucking about with people in SM EV because the all of the DPS were undergeared...exaggeration? Nope, I had that experience tonight thank you very much.
Don't use the tool, plain and simple. If you want your precious loot, get the same kind of players you want by advertising. The tool wasn't made just for you.

EternalChild's Avatar


EternalChild
07.08.2012 , 03:04 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by maelstromicus View Post
We wanted a tool that would make sure that their level of gearing was not dissimilar to ours, and therefore give us a reasonable expectation of their skill levels.
Unfortunately Gear != Skill != Manners. I have seen characters in Tionese performing better than characters in Rakata. I have seen well-geared and skilled players acting like utter jerks, causing wipes and rage-quitting. I think the best solution for your problem is to build a network of friends in other guilds, whom you can invite to your runs. But in order to acquire friends, you need to join PUGs, there is no other way...

Fornix's Avatar


Fornix
07.08.2012 , 03:10 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by Skidrowbro View Post
Yes, we need something to exclude others from enjoying the game with us and not helping them out. Please make it happen Bioware
It's not too strange really, however it shouldn't be a major hassle, but regular progression wouldn't be bad.

Think of it like this:

Want to unlock access to HM flashpoints? First run the equivalent normal one. Want to unlock tier 2 flashpoints? First finish up on the tier 1 flashpoints.

Want to unlock operations? At least finish up tier 1 HM flashpoints.

Eventually this way they can also much easier introduce hard mode operations after having finished story modes. And perhaps even nightmare modes after having completed the hard modes.
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