Why Macros belong in TOR.

Yeah.....cause that's actually playing the game. Jesus, dude......what made you so cynical? Also, complexity simply for complexities sake is bad. There are a myriad ways to differentiate an unskilled player from a skilled one (notice the lack of judgement in the words there.) The entire /point/ on a massively multiplayer game is to appeal to a wide variety of skills and player levels. It is NOT to allow you to point at someone and deride them or make them feel bad for lacking your ability, or even your play style.

The attitude that any game should be made complex simply to exclude people (for whatever reason) is wrong. Would it not be better for the community as a whole if you took what you say as a 'bad' player and tried to help them improve themselves? Doesn't that give you a larger potential pool of people to pull from for ops and flashpoints? Oh, wait, I forgot, they're 'bads', so who really cares. They don't deserve to play.

P.S. I agree that anyone who would BOT (what you're describing when you're trying to talk about macros) shouldn't be playing b/c they aren't really doing anything but wasting $15 a month. Personally, I pay to play, not watch a movie. That's what Netflix is for. And at half the price.

All I want is a way to macro "/say GG!" and "/ops LEFT!" cause I type slow :x

i decide to do a marathon but since i sux at running i go by bicycle (i am smarter i go faster and do get way less tired)

i call the other lame because they could get a bicycle as well but they didn't my skill was to think about a bicycle and buy a bicycle (i still sux at running is not like i got any better)

rule explicitly say bicycle are not allowed (bw said it over and over) but it's so much easier to win the marathon this way why shouldn't i do it plus my bicycle is invisible so nobody really notice
running is tiring and difficult you need to train u sweat... no point in that

I am all for macro in game and bicycle in marathon

people is just stupid

sport is based on equal condition to create challenge... obviously there are way to make thing easier why use a bow and arrow when there is a gun?

People that use macro are people that are not good enough to play on fair field and need a boost to keep up sometimes the boost is so great that they win easy and they think they are good but take away the unfair advantage and they sux even worst because they got use to cheating and never actually learned to play

Honestly I just think simplifying the game is bad but I'm competitive and I would hate to see players get better simply because the game made it easier for them. I started out very bad... know how I got better? Research and practice and I feel everyone should have to do the same thing. It's not the most complicated thing in the world... I went from bottom of the totem pole to the top within a couple months of dedication. I'm not even an MMO player... This is the first MMO I've taken seriously so if I can do it... anyone can.

I fail to see why giving players an easy mode option is a good thing. Obviously I'm more competitive and enjoy a challenge more than anyone that likes this idea.

On top of that... once I become comfortable with a classes key binds I actually feel like I'm in control if their movements and attacks. Something I feel macros takes away from. The game is very situational and macros will not help anyone IMO. I don't attack a healer the same way I attack another DPS... etc.

To me adding macros to an MMO is like adding auto aim to a FPS... easy mode = bad.

I get it. I really do. As a person who spends /way/ too much time with spreadsheets and math in order to min/max a toon I respect and appreciate anyone who is willing to devote that much time to learning how to be the absolute best. I would like to point out that there is a vast difference in a macro that will allow you to spam one button repeatedly to do everything in exactly the right order at exactly the right time, (Vanilla WoW warlocks come to mind here....very boring and utterly NOT the way any game should be played), and a macro that will either type a commonly used phrase (/ops ADDS!) or save you a few buttons on your bars (one button that contains four abilities but only uses one of them depending on whether you're holding a modifier or not....e.g One button that is both slash and cyclone slash that simply changed depending on whether I hold down shift or not....ie Button Paging)

I don't think anybody who is honestly into PLAYING this game would want to simply spam auto follow and afk. That's, once again, a huge waste of money. I will reiterate however that a middle ground between the two extremes is viable and if limited properly (1 key press per action, no /wait commands, no cast sequencing, etc, etc...) The entire debate feels as if people are reacting to the absolute worst possible use of a macro system without being willing to ever consider something less..... ab-usable.

Play the game not the macro.

God forbid you have to use and develop ALL your skills to improve your gameplay.

I was exaggerating with my sammich comment to make a point... I am just simply against anything that makes things easier and can possibly get people closer to my level with less work. That would be like giving a clicker special little boxes that he can click a rotation instead of an ability... let the clicker click and let the clicker be bad.

People should have to learn to be better instead of having tools to be better.

chat macro are not a problem as 99% of the people already ruin the "fair common ground" using ventrilo

ventrilo is like macro honestly...
If something is not "in game" whoever use it taking the "easy" way
I dont see any difference in wanting the macro or using Ventrilo

everybody can use ventrilo as everybody can use software macro so whoever say macro are lame and then use ventrilo is just as guilty of trying to cheat

you should only be able to use what is in game they want us to chat to eachohter add an ingame voice chat they want us to do macro add an in game macro system

I am so sad that people cannot understand the concept of "fair game" anymore nowday
whatever give you an advantage and is not IN GAME is in my opinion a way or another to cheat

I do use ventrilo and i am as guilty as everybody else but i do because 99% of the premade use it so actually it's more "fair game" to use it then don't if you meet a premade

but i would be the first to stop using it if everybody would... part of the game is to deal with little comunication in my opinion strategy will became much more evident if people cannot real time talk to eachother. It's not easier or it's not harder it's just different like a marathon is different form a bicycle race

using ventrilo is a different game then not using the complexity is different you get real time info and the game get a higher speed of execution more speed obvioulsy add complexity in a way (reflex-reaction time) and remove a part of complexity (strategy)

why turn game are called strategy game as opposite to real time shooter that are more solo/reflex type of game
because the slower the infomration you recive the more time u can reflect on them the more strategy the game involve

Ventrilo/Macro is the FPS style MMO
noVentrilo/noMacro is the strategy style MMO

they are 2 game just different no one better then the other I personally like the strategy part more...but that's just my taste

No, no matter what you say, macro=less skill.

The people who love macros are the same people who try to make fun of others for keyboard turning but they can't find the 't' key without looking at their keyboard.

No one having macros evens the playing field and the game can be balanced on that.

I hate it when a new patch comes out in other MMOs and I spend hours updating my add ons and macros. Anyone who does not want to play the meta-game of trying to find all the ways to have the game play for them will not be able to compete.

Let macro building be a needed skill for other games.

This is exactly my problem with macros. How did mashing your macro button take any skill? You didn't even have to notice which teammate needed a dispel, or even if ANY of them needed it. You're now able to mindlessly mash the key four times and know that you've covered your bases.