Do Worlds Feel Lifeless?

No, you are not alone. I think that's the thing that kept me playing SWG for so many years, the fact the planets felt like real planets, mainly for the following reasons:

* No loading screens on planets.. Massive landscapes (sure, graphics a little dated now)
* Player Cities..... BH collecting, camping people in their player house... so much fun
* Mass open world PVP that spanned planets literally..
* Spaceports on each planet that let you go to any planet, from any planet (almost, excepting mustafar)
* Spaceships that were like actual space ships.. Freedom of flight, fly to another planet physically if you
want the nostalgic approach, or hyperspace...
* The allowance of hundreds and hundreds of players on a single map
* Practically zero instancing.
* Exploration - SWG allowed you to explore the landscape and find all the cool landmarks.. SWTOR makes me
run into invisible walls, or my speeder hits an "exhaustion zone"
* Most importantly... The ability to speak to the opposing faction!

According to some users this has been requested since 2008. Guess BW thinks different about it.

It's been discussed endlessly since 2008. It was a big part of controversy for a long time.

Meh, was trying to send you a PM but you've got that blocked lol.

Who were you back on Kette?

So I come from SWG, and I dabbled in a little of LotRO and DC Universe. SWTOR by far has the nicest looking worlds, but there's one problem. They feel dead compared to other MMOs. Nothing ever changes. Hardly any NPCs ever move. Some may gesture, but they all stay in the same place. There's no day/night or weather cycle, so the whole world seems static.

I love the game for what it is, but it's hard to truly immerse myself in the world because it doesn't really feel like one. Everything feels static and lifeless to me. Am I alone?

What I'd like to see are planets which are less singularly planar. The fleets and city planets especially I think could do with some depth/height to make them feel more dense. If you think about Orgrimmar (yep I'm using this as an example) and a few other places in THAT MMO, you had overhead bridges and underground tunnels in the same instance as everything else. Yes, we have different levels accessed by elevators, but that's not the same.

Give greater variation in the y-axis for locations accessible by toons, and you get a more dense and vibrant feeling world, and things feel less linear.

It's not so much that the visual design of the game worlds is bad. Obviously, lots of people love it and I can understand that, but I feel it's more to do with if well-designed areas feel like a part of the same world the toon is in. Making mountainous areas, cityscapes and the like more than just backdrops and more a part of the world the toon has access to would create a much greater sense of immersion.

Perhaps that's one of the main reasons I liked places like Orgrimmar and the like: there was a greater sense of immersion because I knew there was at least the potential of activity going on overhead and underneath me, and that the good visual design I could see was more than just framing for a corridor towards the next place to level up.

Also, and this is may be the wrong thread for this, but I reckon the fleets could be more interesting. Like what do we have? We have a circle, and to top it off each faction might as well have identical fleets as far as lay out is concerned (the visuals of the Republic fleet in-game I find much more appealing but I can see why Vaiken Spacedock looks the way it does but anyway). I know there's a sense of practicality to it, but I reckon some of that can be sacrificed to make the structure of these hubs a little more interesting. Maybe?

Enough is enough. Instead of giving 5 reasons, I'll take the liberty to post the same message I wrote to Bioware when I decided to cancel my sub. I add a couple of references to other posts and comments.


From the first moment, I noticed the game was severely lacking in the aspects that have defined the MMORPG genre in the last 15 years. To put it briefly, those aspects are the ones which provide the player with the notion that he is immersed in a breathing, living world where he can develop a unique career through unique decisions, with proper systems and mechanics that encourage socializing and community making. [I even created a thread months ago, sharing my concerns and asking for suggestions, tried to be constructive, you know: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=289349]

I find the game linear, shallow, limited and mind numbing. A pretty carcass with no soul, that it is. I gave you the benefit of the doubt for 6 months, I have been very patient [Check my post history, hehehe]. Now, what I see at this point of the road is that you have no intention of adding some soul to this dead carcass, to put it in a poetic fashion. On the contrary, your "big plans" for the upcoming future is just to add more linear and mind-numbing content (ops, warzones, on trail quests...) into this dead and mind numbing mechanics for the sole sake of the grind. How fun! Like Bretch put it: "try, try again, fail again, fail better"

Do you want a suggestion? Study the classics, the games that defined the genre: Neverwinter Nights (the first one), Ultima Online, Everquest, Asheron's Call, Star Wars Galaxies.

Kind regards, wish you luck (honestly)



I should add that targeting the casual gamers was a terrible, short termish business decision.

In my definition, the difference between "casual" and "hardcore" is not based on the time you commit to the game, it's an attitude towards gaming instead. Let me explain:

- The casual looks for a time-killer, no brainer game where not too many intellectual efforts and role playing capabilities are asked, nor heavy punishments are inflicted (no big consecuences to the player's actions). Examples of casual oriented games: Diablo, World of Warcraft, Call of Duty.

- The hardcore fundamentally looks for a game where he can walk in his character's shoes and see through his eyes. More concentration, consistency and effort is required to play in "hardcore mode". EDIT: Examples of hardcore oriented games: Ultima Online, Star War Galaxies, Battlefield 3

The main point here is the type of player that is going to support a game on the long term are the hardcores because they have the commitment and implication as, after all, their characters are part of their personality . They not only sustain the game, they are the ones who create guilds, forums, blogs, etc... But, of course, you need to have a game with sufficient depth to appeal the hardcores. Definitely, not the case with SWTOR