CORPG vs MMORPG

It doesn't really matter whose fault it is. The fact of the matter is that devs aren't forced to copy other games at gun point. They should know better, and remember that MMOs are about bringing as many people together as possible for a common purpose as much as possible. That's what made MMOs great. I'm not suggesting they remove soloing, or even stop continuing to improve soloing, but grouping should be epic.

Right now we're down to small group content that really doesn't give any satisfaction upon completion; that your small army just saved the universe, and the war between factions just feels like small, insignificant skirmishes.

ding ding!!

THAT is it. People do not want to be social. THERE you go They like to play in a world where there are other people with them but not...PLAY with them if that makes sense..

aren't all wars small, insignificant skirmishes with some being more significant than others though? Until the other side is defeated and they cannot skirmish anymore? Battles and skirmishes MAKE the overall "war"

I dread to see what Lord of the Rings would have been without massive armies clashing.

I think you're also underestimating the size of the forces involved in historical battles, many of which inspired LotR in the first place. The Blitz, Stalingrad, Somme, etc.

I think Hope and Deceived would have been pretty friggin' lame if they featured fights with 16 people total. People want what those trailers showed. There just isn't anything epic about SWTOR's current offerings. It's a small, small game.

This debate needs to end, now.

First, saying CO-RPG is no different than saying MMORPG. Ok? Get it? The semantics are just silly and you are talking about the same thing.

Second: What some folks are TRYING to say by calling it a COOP RPG is that it is fundamentally a one player game. Not only is that wrong but saying that is stupid at best (for lack of a better term). This game has the exact same leveling experience as WoW. You can go from 1-85 in WoW with ZERO HELP. You can go 1-50 in this game with ZERO HELP. But that is where it all ends! The "story" in this game just makes it ENJOYABLE for one person to make it to 50 without slogging through the same BS quests just to grind out end level. Obviously if you roll the same class again its going to be the same.

Third: The major issue is the server are too sparsely populated. This game even encourages people to group together at lower levels. The heroic areas are for 2-4 players. That seems like an MMO to me.

Fourth: You cannot play ANYTHING in this game past your class story without a group. You can't run PvP (auto group), you can't run HMs, you can't run any of the operations without a damn group.

This is as much an MMO as any other game in the genre.


Now if you want to make the argument that games like WoW and this game are NOT MMO's because they allow a solo player to get to max level, thats a totally different argument and needs a totally different thread.

If you want to go prove your worth, then go load up FFXI. You can't get past level 10 without a group. You will stand in abandoned areas for hours, berating chat with the same plea for help. You can stand there and be hardcore, I'll be having fun in TOR.

You can't do any of that without a group in Guild Wars either. There are quests that you can't do without other players due to the nature of the merc system in that game. There are even group story missions equivalent to flashpoints that you can't solo after the first few, and I'm pretty sure they're even required to progress the story.

It's still not an MMO. It was never advertised as one. ArenaNet has specifically said it was a Co-op RPG, and not an MMORPG, which means they are in fact two different things.

It is a co-op game, trust the people who have played the game from begining to end with a partner, you can damn near co-op everything. Not a single-player game at all.

The differentiator is

1. Presentation. Guild Wars does not present itself as an MMO and the basis is PvP. The game is literally based on the solo player never having to say a word to anyone. Its a PvP game. Its called guild wars.

2. FPs/Operations / Raids. Guild wars doesn't have and never will support Operations on the scale that WoW, TOR and other similar games do. Look at the sheer number of FPs alone in TOR. Thats the difference. Its all in the presentation.


Now if a person logs into TOR and decides to never speak to a sole and only runs 1-50 then STOPS....thats their own personal decision. That doesn't change the presentation and accessibility of group content.

The basic group size in GW is 8. How are the GW flashpoints (it has more than SWTOR) smaller in scale than SWTOR exactly? GW flashpoints even have multiple bonus objectives just like some SWTOR flashpoints.

Have you even played GW? There's a whole lot of PVE in GW in addition to the arenas.

There's no difference at all between the scale of what SWTOR is offering and what GW offers, except GW has instances of bigger PVP, and SWTOR has instances of bigger PVE. Otherwise it's a total draw.

This is it right here. The community is lacking because of a bunch of self-indulgent self-entitled players who think that because this game wasn't SWG2, there's no reason to be nice to anyone or to do much of anything other than gripe or whine.

Spoiled users are killing the community, not BioWare.

Since when was community only important because of some REWARD you got out of it? The community WAS ITS OWN REWARD. But who wants to try being nice to players who do nothing but bash the game, the developers, and anyone hwo likes the game?

Alderaan, Tatooine, Corellia, Ilum, Quesh, Belsavis, and any other planet where the two sides aren't segregated due to people arriving at different levels, such as Balmorra where Imperials get there around Level 20 and Republics get there around Level 36 or so.

It's happened before. I've heard of several guilds "marking" each other for takedown on my server.

In the one I got to participate in, Imperials took over the Republic spaceport on Alderaan before on my server. It took a team of Republics getting together to evict them from the premises.

You can set up any alliance you want and announce it amongst your guilds. You can create your own Guild Alliance channels just for your use.

I think the biggest problem is players without imaginations who need developers to give EVERYTHING to them. Apparently there isn't enough horsepower existent to come up with their own events and their own actions. If it isn't offered in some GUI by a point-and-click choice, it doesn't exist.

What a pitiful state of gaming. Sad commentary, really.